Visitation for autistic father with intense anger issues

Thanks Plastic

His dad knows about much of the abuse, he acknowledges it in one breath and tells me his son would never hurt me in the next. I have never been able to discuss it with his mother, she is happy to remain ignorant to the reality of what is going on. 

Thanks again for your support, understanding and advice on this subject Plastic, you've helped me more than you will ever know  x

I'm happy that you're looking seriously at the violence issues    It takes a lot to grow the strength to walk away from an abuser.        It's just a shame his parents still defend him.

I hope things work out well for you.

Plastic 

Hi Plastic, Hi Michael,

I've not explained about the extent of the physical abuse previously (and if I'm honest I still haven't examined the things he's done in full) because my intent is not to come on him to slate him, my intention is to try and figure out what is going on in his mind to cause such behaviours.

After learning that autistic meltdowns would not excuse these behaviours, I have some serious thinking to do regarding the issues with my husband. I had hoped the family unit could be saved if only he could get help. Now I realise that even if he is autistic, this and the abusive/violent behaviour are two seperate issues and as he seems to avoid taking responsibility for these actions and also very much seems to lack remorse, it is best that I remove myself from the situation. 

Thank you for your advice, after speaking to you I feel so much better about leaving this marriage behind me now, for the sake of mine and our child's safety x

Hi Lulu

I must have missed the post where you've said he was hitting you more than once but your post above concerns me - that does make him sound like a classic narcissist.    Targeting things you love to specifically hurt you or them.    Hurting animals is uncomfortable too.  .

If he can do this and also control it when it suits then, that's not normally an autistic thing     Are you sure his meltdowns aren't just tantrums when he doesn't get his way?        I'm related to a pair of narcissists and that the sort of thing that do - it's all about controlling the world and everyone within it are just puppets to play to their script - and woe betide you if you fluff your lines....

Narcissists subconsciously plan to break you down - to destroy your confidence, to keep you dangling at their whim and make you so broken that they can do whatever they like to you- and you'll willingly accept - total brain washing.

The only escape from them is to starve the monster - stop reacting (like you say you have) and eventually they get bored and look for easier targets.    They absolutely cannot survive without the drama to feed on.

You might want to watch couple of YouTube videos about narcissists to arm yourself.

If he is a narcissist, it's likely he will poison your child against you as a 'useless mum'.

 Losan

Hi Michael. Hi Losan.

Basically I am getting mixed messages from all angles. 

On the first hand, I know he struggles with his anger, I just can't work out what type of anger. I suppose what confuses me is the fact he still seems to have control over the situation when he had a meltdown. 

For example:

In the beginning, when he used to hit me, he works do it seemingly without a care in the world, however he would never but me where the bruises would show. 

In more recent years, I can literally see him fighting his urge to hit me, the look of regret in his face between starting to throw the punch and impact. This results in less injuries for me as he seems to be trying to refrain from hurting me, the blows have become far less painful and hardly leave a mark.

I have a shelf of trinkets in my office where I keep a collection of things I have collected from around the world over the years of my life and also some given to me by my grandparents who passed away some years ago. He knows that some of my most sentimental belongings are up in that shelf. In the beginning, he used to storm in there, threatening to destroy everything on it. I would respond in an emotional way and try to enter the room, being him not to destroy an thing. Over the years, I started ignoring him when he would do this and I've realised that if he doesn't get that emotional reaction from me, he doesn't make the threat. This is the same as when he threatens to hurt the family pets, the less of an emotional response he gets from me, the less he tries to used these things to get an emotional response. 

My reason for telling you these things is not to list his faults, but to try and understand what causes this. I have read that people with autism are not manipulative of others emotions, but it feels in some of these circumstances he very much is doing just that. When I have experienced others have autistic meltdowns (only in an educational setting), they seem very much out of control or focused inwardly, trying to save themselves from the cause of the distress.

Due to this, im torn between believing that he has autism or some sort of narcissistic personality disorder. He denies the latter as he believes this would make him a bad person, but the way he behaves does make me wonder. I know he has suffered through traumatic periods of his life so I don't blame him if this has resulted in something like NPD, I just want him to get the correct diagnosis and the correct support so we can move forward either as a family, or at least with peace of mind that our child won't be the next thing to be used to achieve an emotional response from me.

I really think you need to distinguish more between raw anger and what could be 'reactive' anger i.e. frustration / pain from noise etc. He may need his anger dealing with - but that alone won't be enough. He needs to reduce the sources of stress and anxiety - that will naturally lead to less anger and frustration.

The former would be treated very differently from the latter. As others have said, most therapy is designed for NT not autism. 

Give him time and space - he needs it. Pretty much everyone autistic needs time and space to themselves. And when you do speak to him again, don't overwhelm him. Giving him rules and rewards etc. probably won't work - it's probably not in his nature for that kind of thing to have a meaningful impact (or if it does, it doing invisible harm).

Plastic

Hi Plastic,

Thank you for your input throughout all this, you have been an amazing support and have helped me understand my situation so much better x

Hi Michael,

I understand why you find my posts confusing, as I am extremely confused about the situation myself.

Yes my husband has been abusive, however I'm now trying to figure out if this has been down to meltdowns due to him being autistic, I'm not trying to excuse his behaviour as I have been told on this forum it is not an excuse. However I guess I'm living in hope that with an answer and a diagnosis and new understanding and support, we can get past that and learn to live in a way that avoids the meltdowns. 

This hope comes from the fact he has not actually ended it. The last word on it is that he isn't saying he is leaving and he isn't saying he won't. I basically just have to wait for him to make a decision. This is why I am desperately trying to figure out how his mind works, because the waiting and the silence is making me ill. 

Hi Blue

You have to remember that Lulu and her husband were both attracted to each other when they dated and got married.           He was probably suffering from extreme stress back then but he considered the 'risk' low enough to get involved.  

He's willingly thrown himself into the full NT lifestyle so he does owe some big explanations to the unsuspecting person he chose to have a relationship with.. 

NTs are NTs - they know their own game - he's tried faking being an NT and it's blown up in his face.

JuniperFromGallifrey

Hi Juniper,

Thank you for your understanding, you are right, the multiple posts are a result of sheer desperation and panic. With every answer I receive it raises another question as I'm getting no answers from the person I need them from the most. For this I apologise, I did not mean to cause offence.

It's funny you should suggest I paint him as a monster as this is how he tells me his past girlfriends used to describe him. So I think the problems he has with relationships  started long before me.

I suppose it now feels like the diagnosis will come too late, the damage is done, and from what Blue stated, there is no therapy that will help with his anger issues. 

I guess I just need to give it up as a lost cause and stop hoping he might come home. Thank you for your input, I will check out the site you suggested x

Blue, this is a very thoughtless response to a much larger problem. From my experience, it is typically the Middle Class and upper class who teach their children how to invest properly or at least what seems on the surface proper, to a partner. Some humans learn from self-help books, but society doesn't typically vomit out a Venus-like female, fully formed who can handle even voyeurism with eloquence and camp. 

Lulu, he is probably responding to the multiple posting on this site, and it may be that you haven't learned yet that a more mature approach to such a complicated situation in the future will involve you spending time, writing down your thoughts, identifying everything you are feeling and going though. Identifying your responsibilities as a wife and mother and putting everything in context. And THEN creating a few concise paragraphs which create the image of your husband you want others to have so that you can get the best responses possible.

Some of your threads paint him as a bit of a monster, and humans who, like myself, have been bullied and mis-judged by those who were supposed to understand and love us, will react negatively if you do not take great caution and care with the way you speak. Because from my standpoint, I have to go through an incredible amount of daily effort to communicate, effort which NTs don't or take for granted. I have to research and choose my words deliberately and repeat repeat repeat that I am not ignoring you or please be f**king direct... I cannot tell you how exhausting and frustrating it is in a society that normalises secret codes and uses words like weapons.

I can tell that you want to actively seek repair, but you need to focus on one element at a time and not appear like a victim to these males on here - As a woman, I can see what your trying to do, You're clearly panicked. Your heart is broken and you are desperate to try to resolve it. You will need to grow out of this Auto Response Mode into a more mature human and fast if you want your marriage to work. A quick fix is to learn your role and responsibility. Learn Boundaries in Marriage (I think there are books on this). Write down the Ethics of how to be Loving and the art of self-denial (in opposition to selfishness, not as a 'carpet' to be walked on). You will have to learn to be abruptly mindful when you feel 'offended', and make a conscious effort to recollect that that feeling of offence is based on a Very Myopic and Wrong perspective and not snap into a defensive mode, but learn the essential tool of ALWAYS responding with How Do You Mean.  As someone on the spectrum, I have a working list of Ethics to engage with everyday society to create an aesthetic which inspires rather than one which repels. Commit to hunting down and researching this. It will hurt the most emotionally. But you will grow past that hurt once your perspective shifts and you take on responsibilities of choosing to be a healthy and safe individual for others. If need be, find God or a higher power to take some of the weight off. This is where religion can be useful. 

This site is a good one for explaining life from an Autistic Perspective: https://autcollab.org/2018/04/09/autistic-cognition-decoded-for-earthlings/ From an autistic perspective, NTs create a society based on competition and it is very unethical. There is a standard of being that is Wise, Kind-natured, Disciplined who will be willing to engage in a healthy way with all neuro-types. x

Hi Blue,

First of all, if I was planning on stopping him seeing the baby, I wouldn't be on here asking for advice on the subject, I'm here asking so my mind could be put at rest that the outbursts won't happen when he takes the baby on his own. Had I decided he wouldn't be seeing the baby, why would I be on here bothering to ask for advice on this matter and advice to hopefully save our marriage? 

I'm a firm believer that it is the right of the child to see both parents, so please don't throw accusations you have no real basis for, it's not productive in the slightest. 

Secondly, I know that, amongst other things, I have been part of the problem, had I realised he was autistic prior to the breakdown of the marriage, I would have realised his behaviours were probably down to this and not taken it so personal. Again that is why I am here asking questions, so I can learn from those who know about it the best.

Thirdly, to suggest that I deliberately provoke him is just plain cruel, you have no idea of the extent of injuries and threats I have experienced when he has his meltdowns, there is no way on earth that I would deliberately cause this to happen. In fact I feel like I'm walking on eggshells a lot of the time trying to avoid it. It even happens due to things completely out of my control, yet somehow I become the punch bag. So, again, please don't throw accusations presuming you know what is going on in my head, if you want to know then ask, I'd gladly tell you, but please don't just throw unhelpful accusations about something you know nothing about.

Lulu you are going about his all wrong, your other post has made it abundantly clear what the problem is, it’s you. 

a man without autism wouldn’t put up with your behaviour. Your husband is intelligent and he probably has realised what direction your heading in and knows that you are going to try and block custody to his child. so it’s not within his interest to continue with the mental gymnastics that you are deliberately creating. He probably what to see his child but the drama your causing is making it hard for him to regulate his emotions.

the unpredictable behavioural outbursts aren’t unpredictable, they are extremely predictable and you are actively unconsciously or consciously provoking the out bursts, just stop it.

the kitten thing is not okay, but like it or not you are trying to control and dictate to him what he should do. His video gaming is a decompression behaviour in moderation and your have harassed him to stop making his tolerance for stress and sensory bombardment to extremely low. 

you are pushing him and more than likely your behaviour has gotten worse or changed to an extreme because you are pregnant and expect him to do stuff and wait on you hand and foot without actually talking to him and asking for help around his routine structure that support his neurological difficulties. 

Therapy isn’t going to help your husband, it’s not designed for autistic people. Even if your no longer in a relationship with your husband you still got to make reasonable adaptions for him. 

I'm not sure it's good to pretend. Step back and spend time learning to be the best you. In all honestly, it will be far more healthy for your child. This may seem terrible because marriage is supposed to be about 'growing together' or 'shared experience'. 

But here's 2 paths you could take.

Path One: 2 immature individuals who are unaware of their limitations, 'playing' house with idealistic phantasies about who the other is, because this is just what we do. We pair up, find a space to exist in, have a kid, and 'make do'. And all the while, neglect our need for character growth, personal growth, creative time alone, mindful growth, learning something new... humans tend to get absorbed into chores, tasks, mundane life things and fail to become who they were meant to be individually, so they can actually be the best partner toward and with. For some it takes about 7 years until this failure to take care of my own self is projected at failure to take care of the other. And the relationship is Over.

Google search: Little things that destroy a relationship. 

I refuse to ever date a man who doesn't put self-care (actively being healthy, mindful, etc.) at the top of his list. Because if it is important to me, I will automatically understand and project it being important for you. This is the opposite of selfishness. Selfish humans won't undergo disciplines to better themselves. They're too lazy.

Now, path Two is more difficult emotionally. It requires researching new ways of bettering ourselves and undergoing tasks to become the best version of our 'inner child' or inner self. The one we often neglect, the one who, like a tiny human, needs safety and resources and understanding and creative Play Time. I always suggest seeking something higher or finding a spiritual path. I need to learn how to invest into my self and protect that time alone to recoup & learn, so I can learn how to invest in another. I must learn to relinquish control at the very moment I want to control because manipulation or forcing another to love only turns into resentment. Fighting to become something better is harder but far more rewarding. If 2 individuals are open to growth and open to allowing the other to become, learning how to be trustworthy and invest properly, the outcome could equate to some time apart for the sake of longevity. 2 more responsible adults doing life together is far better than getting what I want right now irresponsibly. 

I would let him be for the time and become a woman who others are attracted to - not for him, but for you and your child. This should take years if you start now. If it helps, allow yourself to be loved by something/someone higher. The Artists Way is a good resource for helping to understand this concept. We all have failures and limitations. Allow yourself time to grow. In fact, seize this opportunity. Once the baby comes along, there will be less time to indulge. Allow your husband to become who he needs to be as a father. So long as he is at least meeting you financially right now stop worrying about what you cannot control (the outcome of his therapy sessions for instance or what he is doing) start working on yourself. Think long-term. Become you. Xx

Hi Juniper,

The rage has always been there, since before I knew him. 

I know he changed from a sweet natured child, aged 4, when his brother was born. Then became an extremely angry teen, started taking  drugs, drinking and partaking in antisocal behaviours.

He then was falsley accused of something in his early 20s, dragged through the courts for over a year, for the accuser to finally admit she'd lied. I think in his mind, before realising he might be autistic, this is the situation he blamed for his angry outbursts, but in reality, his inability to cope through adolescence may have also contributed. 

He has told me in a brief conversation since he left that he still loves me but needs to figure out if he just needs to live the rest of his life alone. He has also told me in the past he will always protect me, even from himself. So he is aware of the hurt he causes. Even if he can't consider his actions   enough to bring himself to apologise. 

I know deep down he's not a bad guy and he had a lot of pent up issue even before autism is thrown in to the mix, which is why I've stuck around longer than I probably should have, 

Its whether the therapy he is now finally due to get in August is going to work and how long it is likely to take before he's going to be able to take our son on his own. 

It breaks my heart to be around my husband, knowing he's off test driving a life without me, if it is the end of our family, before it has even started, I'm going to struggle to play  happy families with him. 

Rage is usually built up. sometimes over years. If he’s continually frustrated by noise, by lack of breathing space, lack of a purpose or finances, if there’s even a list of unmet needs and broken relationships it all just adds up.  

With this information I wonder if he’s afraid of hurting his child. 
But there does appear to be a lot here which could use proper evaluation and I wonder if you have access to a therapist. Or prenatal care? 

I don’t tend to lose things when I do it’s startling. Before I completely overturned my whole life, I first left my sons father- I hated when he interrupted me. But that was a power game for him. It gave him a sense of satisfaction to constantly interrupt, throw me off. It meant I couldn’t focus on work and it cost me financially. Now my son can interrupt me whenever  we have a different contract - I am responsible for him in every way. but I know not everyone views their children the way I do... add males are different than females.

A legal counsel would advise to write down everything that happens which feels unsafe, the date, time and incident. Sometimes humans throw cats in a way so they land on their feet. I’m hoping he didn’t recklessly damage the animal? 

Again, I think it’s important you’re not alone. And if you have family you can rely on, I wonder if they can help. There’s a good deal of advice here, but you are in a situation that needs practical support. I had my son in London and we had a pre-natal group meet up every few weeks. Something like this would be a positive force for you right now maybe? 

Even if you changed all the lightbulbs to halogen and incandescent and you sound proofed your rooms or de-noised the house and even if you only used natural non scented cleaning products, or natural essential oils, he would still need to do the work of learning to mend past hurts, work through old habits and learn mindful techniques to leave immediately when the frustration is too much until he matures enough to make more immediate adjustments or communication skills. We all have work to do. Hopefully you have access to someone with authority (like a certified therapist) who can help you cope.