Help with explaining telephone problems.

Roy said:

looked at most of it

Translation: didn't bother to read any of it 

Oh, Roy, I am so sorry that your mother failed to grasp what you had been trying to convey, and completely missed the point.

In my case, it generally only tends to be phone calls from my mother that I have an issue with. However, to spare her feelings, I have purposely given her the impression that it applies to phone calls from anyone. Perhaps like your mother, my mother seems to think it doesn't apply to her.

I've lost count of the occasions when I've messaged my mother, and received a reply back saying, "I'll phone you now". I find myself thinking, "Noooooo! Please don't!" 

I am happy for you that your mum was so understanding of your social challenges L, and am sorry that she is no longer in your life (in a physical sense). I understand what it is like to lose a parent, especially one that we had a good relationship with.

With the odd exception, many of the people I communicate with (close friends and relatives) have Messenger, so for that reason, I have never felt a need to use WhatsApp. 

Sorry to hear that with your mum Sporadic Sparkly

My mum is dead now but I was lucky that she understood me on a deep level more than anyone else ever has.

She was able to communicate with me without making eye contact, she never called me and she was always understanding with my social challenges.

I miss her a lot. No one since my mum has been like that.

Have you tried emailing your mum? 

Or WhatsApp? 

They might be a better alternative for you :) 

Aww Roy, I understand, answering the phone is probably one of the toughest things for me to do.

Our brains are processing so much all the time and a phone call requires a lot of thinking because you have to work out what you're going to say, listen to what's being said and generally you don't have a lot of time to respond.

It's an autistic person's worst nightmare, hence we all usually try to avoid phone calls. x

You explained it perfectly. I have never had a successful phone call. It takes me so long to process that the other person usually assumes the line is bad and hangs up.

Hi Roy

You are very welcome, we are here for you!

I am sorry that your mother still doesn’t accept or understand why telephone calls are so anxiety inducing for you, it is obviously very frustrating for you.

It seems like regardless of the information you give her to help her understand, it is not working.

An unfortunate but classic example of the double empathy problem.

Thanks to all who helped, I sent my mother one of the links kindly supplied to me.

I heard nothing for two days….

The reply came last night , “ I looked at most of it, but my phone shows who’s calling so I do understand why a phone call can cause anxiety?” 
I really give up, it’s not certain phone calls, it’s all phone calls! 

Yes I hate answering the phone and unfortunately I have to in my job. I was spoken to in my last job as someone complained about how I spoke on the phone as they said I didn't sound enthusiastic enough! For a while I went completely over the top and probably sounded a bit hyper!. Now though it just gives me massive anxiety every time it rings :-(

Telephone communication is the worst and has caused issues most of my life. I no longer use the phone except in extreme emergency.

An academic research study (from the University of Bristol) looked at autistic communication methods and produced results entitled:

"Anything but the phone"

https://s3-eu-west-1.amazonaws.com/autistica/downloads/images/article/Anything-but-the-phone.pdf

There's a lot more to it than anxiety. For me I believe it is mainly an auditory processing issue. Without any visual clues it is much harder for me to process what the other person is saying. I tend to memorise what they say and replay it back in my head as many times as I need to to 'process' it and try and think of a reply. Of course that takes time and while my brain is doing that it isn't processing anything else they say. 

That's assuming I can actually hear what the other person is saying. If there is any background noise, such as a noisy call centre, I hear everything and can't filter what one person is saying to me. The last time I tried calling my dentist I could hear so many voices, from other staff and customers in the background, that I couldn't make out anything that was said to me even when repeated numerous times. Eventually I gave up and emailed instead. To be fair they were really good when I explained my difficulties in an email, replying straight away with an appointment the same day.

When I did used to force myself to use the phone I used to find myself agreeing to stuff just to get off the call or because I would go blank and not be able to say anything. The other person would either assume my silence means they've been cut off or take it as implicit agreement and move on to something else. Invariably after a call I would end up thinking wtf just happened and be annoyed with myself because the call had not gone as planned.

Sporadic Sparkly said:

Using one of those articles you shared as a guide, I explained in my own words why phone conversations can be so anxiety-inducing. 

Great I am glad these articles have helped you explain your own autistic needs! I hope communication with your mother will soon become easier.

Sporadic Sparkly said:

I've taken to communicating with my mother via Messenger, which she hates because she finds verbal communication easier. Since my dad died, she has felt lonely and isolated, so there's also a need to hear a "friendly voice" at the other end of the telephone.

I understand that, I suppose it is a matter of finding a compromise that suits both your needs.

its likely because its talking, and you have nothing to say or cant think of what to say so you will be silent... and being silent over the phone is cringe and the other side will be asking if your still there.

Drakenfeld said:

the neurotypical mind doesn't constantly evaluate whether they are saying the right or wrong thing. They purely express their thoughts, while we tend to contemplate within our minds,

I believe it is more subliminal for NTs than that - they do a lot of the assessment of what is being said - including the tone and phrasing - much more efficiently than us and without having to use as much of their concious mind.

This stems from the difference in how the autistic brain develop where our lack of filters means we often need to conciously evaluate inputs to decide what to discard and what to consider before responding, while an NT brain will have advanced filters for all kinds of mundane stuff, letting them keep thier foucus on whatever inane subject they are interested in talking about.

Drakenfeld said:

In conversations, it's like a game of chess, a back-and-forth exchange.

There are plenty of people who talk lots and don't give you much of a chance to respond if you aren't ready with an immediate reply. These are often the hardest to deal with.

I spend 32 years in IT, lots of it in a user support capacity where I would be often on the phone to talk a user through identifying and resolving issues (they would often be upset when calling in which makes it a lot harder).

You quickly develop scripted responses to wedge open those little windows of opportunity in a conversation to be able to formulate a reply, but need to rotate them so the user doesn't catch on that you are stalling whem while working out what to try next.

People have loads of different ways of speaking on the phone so it can help to understand them and work out how best to deal with them for a positive outcome, including keeping a file on the more important ones so you can come across as having paid attention to the mundan content of previous conversations.

For the likes of the assistants to the board members in the companies I worked for I would keep a Notes file with entries for each on subjects like their partners/kids name, significant events they talked about, interest, things that happened to them etc and would use this to pad some of the times when we were waiting for their computer to reboot for example for me to ask how they are getting on with the (insert subject of relevance). It made them feel that I paid attention to them, gave them a positive to talk about while they were stressed about and IT issue and kept them talking about something they were happy about for a while in the day when they could switch off from other stuff.

I guess I developed an interest in the "headology" behind the subject in those long years.

But like the rest of you, I avoid the phone whenever practical and if I don't recognise the number calling me, it gets ignored now.

I normally contact my mother by messenger, I sent the first link to her. I’m not confident enough to put it on FB as nobody knows about my autistic life.

Ausomely Autistic ,

I've taken to communicating with my mother via Messenger, which she hates because she finds verbal communication easier. Since my dad died, she has felt lonely and isolated, so there's also a need to hear a "friendly voice" at the other end of the telephone.

In the past, I have attempted to diplomatically explain to her why I don't like telephone conversations with her, but it's always fallen on deaf ears. However, for the first time in over a year, I logged into my Facebook account this morning and posted a status update, which was mainly for her benefit. Using one of those articles you shared as a guide, I explained in my own words why phone conversations can be so anxiety-inducing. 

Hi Roy. I completely understand how you feel regarding this. So many people at my school and off my age love talking on the phone...I watch them sometimes envious because they talk smoothly and it clearly doesn't bother them at all. It bothers me massively! I find talking on the phone extremely difficult and stressful...There is so much to think about and consider, so much to prepare for....tho preparation rarely actually helps me. When I answer my phone my mind goes blank and I freeze, no idea what to say or do.

How this affects you and how you feel about phones is validated. Don't ever feel ashamed or embarrassed. It's something most of us can relate to. Until I found out I had autism I thought phone call dread was just a me thing and now I realise it affects us all of all ages.

I've seen a few videos on youtube and this is one of my faves. She gives really good tips on phonecalls and this is quite informative.

youtu.be/BuDHMfpv9j8

What I personally believe the issue is (and I acknowledge that nothing is impossible, including the possibility of myself being wrong) is that the neurotypical mind doesn't constantly evaluate whether they are saying the right or wrong thing. They purely express their thoughts, while we tend to contemplate within our minds, questioning whether to say this or that, often resulting in saying nothing at all. It took me 20 years, but I've learned not to care. Not caring about what I say has allowed me to develop effective communication skills.

In conversations, it's like a game of chess, a back-and-forth exchange. You pass the ball of conversation, taking turns to speak. When it's my turn, I express myself. When it's your turn, you respond based on what I've said. Even if it seems off-topic, their response was triggered by something I said, so I should just express my thoughts. The key is to worry about their judgment after the conversation. Did they ever indicate that I shouldn't have said something? If not, there's nothing to worry about."

I am glad the article resonated with you! 

Roy said:

To see another person acting the same as me was very affirming.

That’s great Roy!

Hi Sparkly

You are very welcome! Could you ask your mother to communicate with you in another way? Such as text messaging?

Talking to someone in person without rehearsal is hard work, the opening pleasantries are boring / inane.