discipline

I have found the comments here useful, and it is good to see the subject discussed from different points of view, because I think sometimes parents or carers can forget what it is like for the child, who might be angry or upset because of frustration or not understanding something.

My daughter gets very angry because she can hear every little noise, so I try not to make noises that will upset her, but it's not always easy, as a noise can sometimes just happen such as me scratching an itch and then she gets mad about it, and I try not to take her anger personally.  She has the TV on quite loud but she can still hear some other noises even then, and is the same with music.

treva52, you have some really good ideas, especially the safe zone to go to, and with things that are comforting, and when someone feels secure and safe they will feel happier.

Hotel california said:

Hi monkey

I'm a mum of two boys with aspergers.  Mine are somewhat older than yours so I hope my experience may help you.

Firstly I understand how exhausting parenting any child is and how much strength you need to parent a child with autism. 

There will be many people, teachers included who will criticise how you parent.  Family members can be the worst as punishing children is still considered the best way to deal with unruly behaviour.

I learnt very early on that the best way to parent was through positive parenting.  I went overboard with rewards and positive feedback.  I ignored bad behaviour in the hopes that it would eventually fizzle out, which it has.  Both boys rarely have meltdowns but when they do occur they recover quite quickly.

Your daughter may not recognize the distress of her brother and vice versa and this can be challenging to deal with.  

Distraction was always a favourite of mine.  Rotate toys so there is something novel to play with.  Maybe try to have set quality time with each child.  I was lucky as both boys liked the same thing so played fairly well together.

Being outdoors was a great way to relax and burn off energy.  If you have the space maybe a trampoline might help your son destress.  

don't take on the full responsibility of your children.  It is easy to suffer burnout, so spread the load.  

In my case it did get better.  You will face many challenges and coming on here to ask for help is commendable.

Keep strong and embrace your children's specialness.  Mine are a joy because they have made me a better person.

Enjoy them as they grow up really fast.

Finally see if there is a support group that you can join where you can meet other families.  It helps to socialize with others who understand and can offer support to you all.

Take care.

i totaly agree i had aspergers and adhd and i now wen there nioses i hate it im 26 and still have melt downs but i now when im starting to feel bad and i go in a room on my own and tht is wat i suggest leave him in a safe zone were he can calm own and then come to u if u are in his space tht could be making it worse without u meaning to best thing my foster mom learnt is plaing music in background belped me focus more on tht positive niose tht i could control and then not hearing others as much 4 is gd  age to use visual cards on how he feels so get him to chioce what face he feels happy sad etc then try and ask wat made him happy wad made him sad create a safe zone in the room and show him when he feals like its to much he can go in his safe zone put ear niose cancellors there his favourate toy and boot a bean bag to sit in and a sheet to make it private and enclosed i now he is 4 but as long as u explain in way he understand (throw books and videos) it help him and u 

Stop trying to discipline your childs Autism. Thats child abuse. Its analogous to you being punished for instinctively answering a smile with your own; its a hardwired reflex. When he has a meltdown, he needs comfort and reassurance not punishment. Calm him, then when he is able to return to reason, explain that the hitting is a problem, that he needs to try not to. This will be very difficult for him, and may take years or prove impossible.

I know I have expressed myself strongly in this thread, thats because its important. I do however believe you to be a good parent, Ive read your other posts and know your trying to help your son. But punishing autistic behavour is unacceptable.

You say you know his triggers, but do you know them all? And are you even aware of the contributory stressors that push him towards the edge of his tolerance envolope without provoking an overt reaction? He needs ways to remove accumulated stress before more builds, and doesn't have any. I use sporting violence and canabis, you need to discover what works for him.

You also need to do a better job protecting him from these stressors and further teach him how to defend himself better. For example, if his sister's crying sounds like a sonic weapon, teach him to leave the area or put on headphones. 

Meltdown avoidance is possible, meltdown control is not.

Hi monkey

I'm a mum of two boys with aspergers.  Mine are somewhat older than yours so I hope my experience may help you.

Firstly I understand how exhausting parenting any child is and how much strength you need to parent a child with autism. 

There will be many people, teachers included who will criticise how you parent.  Family members can be the worst as punishing children is still considered the best way to deal with unruly behaviour.

I learnt very early on that the best way to parent was through positive parenting.  I went overboard with rewards and positive feedback.  I ignored bad behaviour in the hopes that it would eventually fizzle out, which it has.  Both boys rarely have meltdowns but when they do occur they recover quite quickly.

Your daughter may not recognize the distress of her brother and vice versa and this can be challenging to deal with.  

Distraction was always a favourite of mine.  Rotate toys so there is something novel to play with.  Maybe try to have set quality time with each child.  I was lucky as both boys liked the same thing so played fairly well together.

Being outdoors was a great way to relax and burn off energy.  If you have the space maybe a trampoline might help your son destress.  

don't take on the full responsibility of your children.  It is easy to suffer burnout, so spread the load.  

In my case it did get better.  You will face many challenges and coming on here to ask for help is commendable.

Keep strong and embrace your children's specialness.  Mine are a joy because they have made me a better person.

Enjoy them as they grow up really fast.

Finally see if there is a support group that you can join where you can meet other families.  It helps to socialize with others who understand and can offer support to you all.

Take care.

Can I endorse what KaloJaro and recombinantsocks have said. This is a website for people on the spectrum and parents/families. There is a wealth of knowledge on here which resolves some of the solutions you seek.

Those of us on here on the spectrum don't do well in conventional socialisation and cannot readily identify the niceties needed in a world that isn't always nice to us.

You will get good advice on here, but it is unfair to ask us to deliver it in terms of your world, which is full of conventions and preliminaries and dos and donts, when it is not a world we are able to share.

I have to agree that Outraged brings up several key points that could help you in regards to educating your son, and personally feel your response to be excessively hostile, rude, and disregards all that's been said by not just Outraged but by others on this thread.

If you cannot interact peacefully and with understanding online when conversing with a full grown Aspie, you -will- struggle with 'disciplining' your son as he grows.

Its that knee jerk anger that so often causes problems in young autistic people to start with. Rather than getting so upset you're blinded by everything else, take the time to calm down and see things from anothers point of view.

No one asks to be stuck with any form of Autism. It is a curse. If you yourself have this then you should be all the more understanding.

Yes you may be struggling with your sons diagnosis, but the best thing you can do for all of you is to find an outlet for your rage, both for yourself and for your son. Get him a punching bag, teach him Tai Chi, an activity that'll take his full concerntration and wear him out WITHOUT the violence.

If you can't lead by example how can he hope to learn to control his anger? Please, do not react with aggression to posts on this website as the people here are indeed trying to help. They are speaking out of kindness. If they didn't want to help, they'd ignore your posts and move on. Your reaction could only hurt a fellow Aspie and will help NO ONE. Bear in mind this isn't just a 'parents with ASD kids'-only website, many of us here have a form of autism ourselves and part of that is difficulty communicating. So please, keep hostility to a minimum. If you're upset with Outrage's post, then simply state in one sentence you're upset and why you are upset in a simple logical manner. Your outburst only serves to upset people.

Many people I know with ASD (of all ages, it runs in my family) will get upset when the people they look up to get upset, yelling at us when we're doing something wrong will escalate the situation into all out war, leaving all sides feeling hurt and upset. I suggest implementing a routine where your son has to go and do an activity when he's STARTING to feel upset rather than when he gets to the point of no control. By then it's too late. Make sure his siblings know to keep their distance when he performs this task, as they will most likely hound him or harass him without knowing any better which will only set him off. They must all learn to respect each others boundries. By giving him a way of expressing himself, you're giving yourself the chance to help him overcome his worries and fears before it gets to a stage where you're all helpless.

Yes he must learn not to hit other people. But that doesn't mean he can't hit another object out of frustration. Having no way of expressing yourself is what I'd consider to be the most inhuman torture possible, then being punished for expressing yourself the only way you know how only serves to distance you from the so called 'society' who thinks its alright.

What I have said may upset you. I apologise. I am merely trying to express how from my personal experience as someone with a form of ASD could help you and your son, as well as give you an insight as to what your son may be feeling. The fact you are asking for help speaks a lot to your person and indicates you are a good parent. Please do not take out your aggression needlessly on other users.

One of the emotive points here is the word discipline. This word is a trigger for outraged and its worth trying to struggle to understand why this is so.

A child needs to learn not to be violent for its own safety and everyone else's. Discipline often means that punishment is involved and i suspect that it is this meaning of the word that outraged is reacting to. Any form of punishment will difficult for an autistic person to understand and it is liable to result in escalation and worse behaviour.

so, what can you do?

be calm

be logical

be consistent

challenge by asking questions

you need to train and educate and challenge bad behaviour.

Hi,

please don't mind outraged :-) His heart is in the right place and as an Aspie he can see things from the sufferers point of view which is really valuable.

one of the problems that we have is that we are sometimes too blunt and can provoke reactions that we don't want or anticipate.

ok. i came on this online chat as i needed a way to get things of my chest and understand things better. a way to make my sons life better. i certainly did not come on to get responses like that outraged. you say you believe me to be a good parent yet contradict yourself by saying that what i am trying to do is child abuse and that i need to do a better job at protecting him. i think this is rude and out of order. i am not trying to discipline his autism but i think you are forgetting HE IS 4 YEARS OLD. he is a child and still needs some kind of discipline as i said before i comfort him and calm him down when having a meltdown. i am fully aware he can't help what he does but he also needs to know hittting is unacceptable (which he doesn't listen about when spoken to when calm). And i do everything i can to help my son in general especially with his autism. but i have 2 children to protect, and she is constantly getting hit and scared. he thinks if he can hit when having a meltdown its ok to all the time. he doesn't understand and i was asking for help with this. i may not have expressed myself clearly but i am still new to all this, still new to the diagnosis, struggling to cope as my husband has to work alot, and having to deal with extreme emotions with my son whilst trying to sort out my own feelings. i have alot going on, if you have read my discussions you would also know that i suspect myself having asd as well and explaining myself is something i struggle with. i would have thought outraged that being on this site you would be more understanding of struggles. unless you have struggles yourself and are trying to bring up a child with the same struggles at the same time you can not understand how difficult it is to do all the right things all at once. if you are going to message me again i suggest YOU DO NOT INSULT MY PARENTING AGAIN as i found your response extremely unkind and saying things like that to someone you could do real damage to a family. 

Hi,

have you seen the "Early Intervention Training" at http://www.autism.org.uk/our-services/residential-community-and-social-support/parent-and-family-training-and-support/early-intervention-training.aspx

i think you may be able to get some help there.

You need to acquire a better understanding why he hits. If he is experiencing sensory overload or other build up of stress, and at 4 cannot explain how he feels, hitting may be his only means of conveying the level of distress. Therefore reprimanding him after the event is not going to make much sense to him. What else is he supposed to do?

You say you are "trying to catch it before he has a meltdown" - this sounds like pre-emptive punishment.

Meltdowns aren't simply bad behaviour. They are a response to a build up of stress. You have probably had bad days when everything seems to go wrong and you reach a point where your only resort is to express anger, rage and frustration. Your son reaches that point several times a day.

He may be unable to filter out stress factors, and may be experiencing environmental stresses you couldn't possibly imagine. For example his sister crying may sound to him a great deal louder and more stressful than it sounds to you.

His being heavyhanded in play may involve motor control issues as well as difficulty assimilating feedback from others about the level of play, especially if he experices friendly touching as much more painful or stressful.

You need to read up about environmental issues and sensory overload. I appreciate this isn't easy as it isn't adequately explained in triad based guidebooks (note to NAS).