Invisable aspbergers?

Honestly I think the whole negative vibe thing is a big load of bullshit.

I had to pull up my SD20 on inferring disapproval from a situation where the other people were just waiting neutrally and there was no need to over read the emotions.

We talked about it after and I pointed out that even neurotypical people could get things wrong, and we should not play guessing games on other people's feelings if we were unable to do anything differently that might alter their perceptions of us.

In this instance she perceived disapproval because I was being careful pulling out of a car park. I refused to accept disapproval because I was not changing how I pulled out because I drive deliberately and carefully to compensate for DCD.

Part of the problem in that training course was you demonstrated competence. If I'd been your trainer I would have got you to help others to improve their skills and observed the interaction. It would give them an opportunity to demonstrate their willingness to deal with difference and you the opportunity to reflect on what you might need to learn.

Instead they perpetrated a situation where your difference was allowed to colour perceptions and feelings to win over facts.

Rather not say said:

Hi I have been diagnosed with Asperger syndrome, I am 32 and I am struggling with my emotions. I have no control over myself when I am upset. I end up reacting to things so badly. I feel like people are being awkward with me. I hate it when people say things that I don't understand. I hate it I need help. Everyone around me ends up hating me. I feel lonely and I don't know how to control myself when I am upset...I feel my emotions build up until I explode and then its too late. Does any body else feel like this...does any body else understand...because I feel alone.

You are not alone on this website.  Many here have had similar experiences or are dealing with family who are suffering.  

I am much older than you and have experienced many of these problems.  All my relationships have failed and people accuse me of thinking all sorts of false things.  And when things get too much.  I lash out in violence.

With a diagnosis you should be getting professional help.

Hi I have been diagnosed with Asperger syndrome, I am 32 and I am struggling with my emotions. I have no control over myself when I am upset. I end up reacting to things so badly. I feel like people are being awkward with me. I hate it when people say things that I don't understand. I hate it I need help. Everyone around me ends up hating me. I feel lonely and I don't know how to control myself when I am upset...I feel my emotions build up until I explode and then its too late. Does any body else feel like this...does any body else understand...because I feel alone.

Robert124 said:

I have been told more recently that my problem is that people give off invisible vibes.  That other people can sense.  And I give off a negative vibe and that there is something different and wrong about me.

That is one of the main problems for people with autism. We don't have the extra sense (over sight, hearing, touch etc) that enables the majority of people to know when another person is happy, upset, just wants to chill etc. My way of understanding it is that we just don't have the bit of wiring in the brain that enables most people to put the non verbal cues together and then form a coherent response. We also don't know how to use facial expressions usefully so a lot of people with autism have blank, expressionless faces that can be a bit off-putting to other people. I was told off at primary school for always looking serious. That comment only makes sense to me now, 50 years later. I now make a much more conscious effort to smile at people and to look at their faces even though I probably can't get much useful info from doing that.

(PS - I'm not sure of the OP is aware but there is no B in Asperger's)

Pirate Santa said:

Even though I only recently found out that I am on the spectrum (in my mid 50s), I can certainly sympathise with a lot of this.

After a horrendous school-life where I was constantly bullied for being a misfit, once I had left home & started work, I gradually taught myself to blend in with the crowd. Sadly though, it doesn't always work & being quite good at reading body language, I am very aware that certain people seem to take an instant dislike to me.

I think it's a bit like the 'Uncanny Valley Effect' reported in video games that try to be to realistic, but end up creating characters that look creepy rather than human. I've got used to it now though. I've always worked in Programming & Data Analysis which is usually fairly 'geek friendly', but in my career I have sometimes been on the receiving end of particularly nasty office politics due to people who visibly took an instant dislike to me.

Not sure if it would have made things easier if I had been able to tell people I was on the spectrum, but at least I wouldn't have had people commenting that they found it weird how I didn't really like making eye-contact. I quite often tried making a joke of it, saying I reserved eye-contact for when I was trying to chat someone up & I didn't fancy them. At least for me, humour seems to be the best diversionary tactic in most situations. I've always found that people are much more likely to accept me if I can make them laugh.

I still usually feel like an outsider though & constantly worry that people will see through my performances & realise that I don't belong. One thing that has definitely helped me a lot though was joining a local mental health support group. I was only diagnosed as being on the spectrum this year, but have been on anti-depressants for almost four years now. The friends I have made in a local mental health group have a wide variety of mental health issues, but are all very supportive. This is probably the closest I have ever felt to feeling like I actually belong somewhere & it is like being part of an extended family.

As long as there is at least one area of your life where you aren't made to feel like an outsider, it seems to make the rest a lot more bearable. Well that & being able to come home to my adorable cat!

Take care

Your experiences are broadly similar to mine.  Also live "up north".  Most employment in programming and a first degree in statistics.

I find office politics very difficult and have suffered constant bullying my entire life.   Now find it difficult to find employment due to bad or lack of references and long gaps in between jobs.

I get along with cats a lot better than people.

I am mostly self taught in social skills, although have had help from non professionals.

Only school I felt comfortable with was a special school I attended for a year when I was 10.  Even there I mostly interacted with the staff, because my fellow pupils were a bigger mental mess than me.

Even though I only recently found out that I am on the spectrum (in my mid 50s), I can certainly sympathise with a lot of this.

After a horrendous school-life where I was constantly bullied for being a misfit, once I had left home & started work, I gradually taught myself to blend in with the crowd. Sadly though, it doesn't always work & being quite good at reading body language, I am very aware that certain people seem to take an instant dislike to me.

I think it's a bit like the 'Uncanny Valley Effect' reported in video games that try to be to realistic, but end up creating characters that look creepy rather than human. I've got used to it now though. I've always worked in Programming & Data Analysis which is usually fairly 'geek friendly', but in my career I have sometimes been on the receiving end of particularly nasty office politics due to people who visibly took an instant dislike to me.

Not sure if it would have made things easier if I had been able to tell people I was on the spectrum, but at least I wouldn't have had people commenting that they found it weird how I didn't really like making eye-contact. I quite often tried making a joke of it, saying I reserved eye-contact for when I was trying to chat someone up & I didn't fancy them. At least for me, humour seems to be the best diversionary tactic in most situations. I've always found that people are much more likely to accept me if I can make them laugh.

I still usually feel like an outsider though & constantly worry that people will see through my performances & realise that I don't belong. One thing that has definitely helped me a lot though was joining a local mental health support group. I was only diagnosed as being on the spectrum this year, but have been on anti-depressants for almost four years now. The friends I have made in a local mental health group have a wide variety of mental health issues, but are all very supportive. This is probably the closest I have ever felt to feeling like I actually belong somewhere & it is like being part of an extended family.

As long as there is at least one area of your life where you aren't made to feel like an outsider, it seems to make the rest a lot more bearable. Well that & being able to come home to my adorable cat!

Take care

HungryCaterpillar said:

You're probably right.

"He who should not be named."     <autism>

Maybe it would be better if I 'came out' to the group as autistic... at least then she knows she has a possible ally if she should choose to pursue the option?

Ha ha ha.

If you do, keep us informed of people's reactions and how the mood changes over time.

HungryCaterpillar said:

It's a sad state of affairs that even the most well-intentioned of neurotypicals just don't seem to get us - they really can't empathise (or even want to empathise) with our perspective. Rather, it's always about our adapting to fit their model.

Funnily, I'm on a similar job training scheme myself right now (which I'm finding exceptionally slow and frustrating). There's a young lady on the course whereby my 'autism radar' is going off the scale. She's intelligent, resourceful, insightful and creative - yet is branded a 'trouble maker' as she just lacks the tiny social nuances that enable her to fit in. Rather, she's clearly annoying the tutor, and I keep thinking, "just play the game, just play the game and it'll make it so much easier for you".

From your experience, what would be the best thing I could do for this young lady (e.g. don't raise the autism issue and let her get on with things on her own, or 'come out' to her myself, letting her know she has a possible ally etc)?

I would never mention autism by name in a ordinary social situation.  That would probably make situations worse.  The exception is if the other person brings up the subject first.

I have been told more recently that my problem is that people give off invisible vibes.  That other people can sense.  And I give off a negative vibe and that there is something different and wrong about me.

So even if I make an effort to fit in.  People can pick up that I am acting.

HungryCaterpillar said:

That's awful Robert123.

Did you have any idea of just what specific behaviours you were doing 'wrong' at all?

If not, did they provide any sort of constructive feedback? After all, saying you're "not fitting in" doesn't actually say anything - it doesn't give you specific feedback from which you can adapt your behaviour and model future behaviour. That's just harsh.

I must admit, I'm not a fan of such training schemes (or the JobCentre)... as they seem ill-equipped at the best of times, never mind when dealing with ND's. I remember trying to explain my autism to one of the JobCentre Advisors, who immediatly interrupted, stating "yeah, well, I'm probably somewhere on the spectrum too, yet I manage to come into work don't I..."

This happened in 2001, I think.  So I have got better at being normal.

As for what I did wrong ?  Hygiene and dress was ok, I tried to interact with the other people.  Problems started on the first day when we were asked to use a word processor on a computer, the task was to type in a letter.  I just got on with it and typed at my normal speed.  Other people were struggling badly and were getting help from the training staff.  After that the trainers never spoke to me just gave me funny looks.

As for feed back why I didn't fit in.  "Not fitting in" was the feedback after I pressed the issue.

Initially the discussion was that they just didn't want me there and would I leave voluntarily. 

I tend to fit in better in some groups such as mental health group sessions.  But that doesn't help me much in ordinary life.

AuraTodd said:

Did the support worker say or do something which made you feel as if you were being negatively judged or unfairly treated, or was it more of a feeling you had?

There were three of us plus her, but she didn't really aknowledge me.  Perhaps it was me.

Is there any member of staff at the support centre who you trust that you could talk to about this?

No I don't go there anymore, I was never good at getting what I actually meant across.

I find photography very relaxing

So do I, but I'm never taken seriously

I always had problems at school and in employment because I don't fit in.

Same here, most people thought because I was quiet that I was stuck up.

Sorry for the rant.

No worries mate

Yes.  This whole fitting in thing!!!

Don't fit in with the NTs.   Don't fit in with the 'non NTs' what does one do ?

It's like falling through the cracks.  Except the cracks are like wide canyons.

My most embarrassing experience of being excluded was a retail job training scheme.  I tried to fit in with the other trainees but the real problem was with the staff doing the training.  Right from the start I noticed that they were avoiding in engaging with me.  Other trainees were called in for personal interviews along the way.  I was not. At the end of the week I was called in for an interview with the head of the centre itself.  And asked/told to leave.

I asked for reasons why.  I turned up on time every day and did everything that was asked. And if I left of my own free will or was thrown out.  The job centre would stop my benefits.

I was eventually told that, I didn't fit in with other rest of the group, I didn't belong there, the training staff were terrified of me and I wouldn't get a job in retail in a million years.  So there was no point in me being on this training scheme.  Just leave!

Did the support worker say or do something which made you feel as if you were being negatively judged or unfairly treated, or was it more of a feeling you had?

There were three of us plus her, but she didn't really aknowledge me.  Perhaps it was me.

Is there any member of staff at the support centre who you trust that you could talk to about this?

No I don't go there anymore, I was never good at getting what I actually meant across.

I find photography very relaxing

So do I, but I'm never taken seriously :)

I always had problems at school and in employment because I don't fit in.

Same here, most people thought because I was quiet that I was stuck up.

Sorry for the rant.

No worries mate :)

I actually understand and feel sympathetic towards what you feel, because I have had some similar experiences.

After a lifetime of problems with not getting along with people.  I have had a lot of time and practice at developing coping strategies which means I can fool many people that I am NT, up to a point.  But eventually my acting breaks down and people start shunning me because they consider me strange.

Most of my problems are dealing with people and socialising.  I say inappropriate things, sometimes I am am self aware at other times I haven't a clue why people get upset.

I have received help at various times with various problems and like you, sometimes the people in charge give me funny looks and eventually ask me to leave.  Yet in reality I need help even more than the other people in that group.

Like you, I am also an enthusiastic photographer and I am still actively learning and getting better.  I find photography very relaxing.

Do I have aspergers syndrome ?  I don't know? First time I heard about it was my mental health team discussing it after my last suicide attempt.  I thought, rubbish! I don't shout abuse at people. I confused it with tourettes syndrome.

The important point here is, do the general public have any idea what aspergers syndrome is ?

As for not fitting in.  That is the story of my life.

I was twice asked to leave training courses because i didn't fit in with the rest of the trainees. 

I always had problems at school and in employment because I don't fit in.

Now, I am having difficulty signing on universal credit, because I hate visiting the job centre and I can barely cope with being near the other people there.

Sorry for the rant.

Hi AuraTodd,

I’m really sorry you experienced this horrible situation. Sadly, some people are still ignorant about ASD and that is their failing and not yours. Please keep being courageous, just as you had the courage to express the things you struggle with, and don’t let someone else’s ignorance spoil your enjoyment of or attendance at your support centre.   

Did the support worker say or do something which made you feel as if you were being negatively judged or unfairly treated, or was it more of a feeling you had?

Is there any member of staff at the support centre who you trust that you could talk to about this?

Before I got my diagnosis (not autistic, but do have some autistic charactersitics!), I was spending a couple of days a week at a mental health support centre. I needed to discuss some problems, and the support worker started off by stating "I've never known why you come here. You're totally self contained, and don't need anything or anyone". Not the most helpful way to put it, and it put me off going there again!

If she'd said it as an observation of how I come across, it would have been one of the most useful things anyone has ever said to me, but stated as fact it was insulting, and inappropriate in that environment.

I do think it's how I come across though, and I hadn't realised it before. I think I'm actually that way because I have trouble making close connections with people, rather than because I want to be.