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Help, really struggling with school

jo and jack

We are only two days into the week and it's two bad days at school for my son.

 

Mon- recieved phone call from support teacher in respite syaing awful day in some lessons, not sitting down, telling his teachers he's not doing the work, walking out of lessons. Didn't turn up at the end of the day to see her, to hand over his report card.

When i questioned my son about this he just says "i don't know"(which makes it difficult to understand the situation).

Tue-recieved phone call from same support teacher saying shocking day agian, similar to Mon behaviour. But their has been an allegation of racist behaviour from my son. Although she did not have any facts that she could tell me about. Other than something had happened and we will be called into school for a meeting with head of year and local police officer attached to the school????????

When we questioned our son about this allegations, he says he doesn't know what their on about, he hasn't said anything racist. His exact words"dun no". We know our son knows that making hurtful remarks about other people is not acceptable.

Support teacher is also saying that my sons time in respite class is now coming to an end, his behaviour has not improved during this 3/4months in respite. She feels the only option is to hand him over to head of year(which i think it's looking like him being excluded at some point).

She also said that my does know right from wrong but he is making choices to behave in certain ways and some of his behaviours he can control.

I know my son knows right from wrong, but have read through info relating to recommendations from the school psychologist, that my son lacks social communication skills(SCS)-aspegers. Is this part of his condition that his judgement is impaiared because of his lack of SCS or is he using this to be seen as the class clown(again seeking acceptence)from peers, this is a commom theme through our sons life.  

He does not act like this at home and he did not act like this(no where near to the extent in primary, we were never called in school to discuss his beahaivour or at parents eveing)at primary, i still have all his reprots.

But since he went to secondry school, it been a nightmare for him.

Report card after report card, meetings about his beahviuor, regularly i get phone calls at work from teachers in class asking me to speak to during class for his behaviuor they cannot control(is this right????)

Yet they have placed him in respite, concerned enough to have him see the school psychologist, the psychologist recommendations are SCS, support in the class room, support to settle into lessons. The school head of SEN was saying, no resources here, not enough staff there etc.

I have mentioned to the support teacher,that at home he spending alot of time in his room when he is in playing with his lego.

She said she as observed him in and around the school, she does not see a boy who is reverting into himself. As she very often see him with a group of friends, larking around, hitting each other and getting upto mischief???????

One thing i do not want to turn into is a parent who wraps her son up in cotton wool, because of the term lacks SCS has been brought into the forum. It will not do my son any favours in the long term, but i feel i am having to defend him(which i do see as my job, as his mum).

I suppose because of my lack of full understanding of my son's lack of SCS, lack of knowing what makes my son tick(at this moment) and lack of insight to what is actually going on in school. I actually feel really useless for him. 

           

  • Hello,

    Am new to this site as have been waiting for a diagnosis for my son for a long time now.  He has seen the ed psych through school, who I was told would do an assessment, only to have that assessment be positive, but be told that I need an appointment with a clinical psychologist for him... I have know for years that things have been wrong with and for him, but it has been hard to isolate exactly what, as for a long time specialists (and I) thought he was coping with depression due to my divorce and difficulties with his father.  We also lived in France until this summer and I now know that there was little chance of him being diagnosed with Aspergers as the official figures state it is prevalent in only 4.5 children in every 10,000!!  This clearly shows that it isn't being diagnosed, but it doesn't stop me feeling guilty for not realising earlier or knowing what I know now about it!

    It was such a relief to read about all your experiences and know that I am not the only one who has struggled with school due to my son's behaviour.  They are treating him as if it is BESD with no special provisions for when things go wrong apart from the current threat of exclusion for 6 weeks!!!  From reading through the information on the NAS site I know that I can challenge this, but thank God for everyone else on the internet willing to share and help each other as well!

    Good luck to you all :)

     

  • Hi Jo and Jack, I am new here and just wanted to say a few words.

    A child can be put onto the SEN register for any reason. There doesn't have to be a diagnosis. A child is placed onto school action when the school decide that they need additional help with their learning, if there is no progress then they are moved onto school action plus which then brings in outside agencies eg educational psychologists, speech and language therapists, occupational therapists etc etc. If you believe that your son will benefit from a statement you can apply for one of these yourself. You do not need to wait for the school to start the progress.

    My son is 8 and was recently diagnosed with Aspergers. It was originally the headmaster who self diagnosed him years ago. He did this and then stepped back and did nothing to help him. I went to see Parent Parnership and they said that my sons IEP should have autistic tendencies on his IEP after reading information from the autism outreach team who had observed my son mentioned autistic tendencies, but the school would not acknowledge this just kept it to BESD. I got myself into a state and got the ball rolling and the GP referred him to CAMHS. Even though I never really had any concerns to begin with, during the process of the diagnosis it was as though I was the one doing the stressing while the school did nothing and I watched my son slowly lose all of his get up and go, he was so sad and there was nothing I could do to help him. When I tried to help the school with my sons outbursts by telling them what I had always done (strategies which I had unknowingly used all his life) I was just seen as asking for the moon on a stick?? and was pretty much told that without a diagnosis they would not be doing anything more than bare minimum? which meant nothing!. He spent a whole 12 months without an education because they were concentrating on his behavior instead of providing the support which in turn would reduce the behaviour. It was like banging my head against a brick wall. The SENCO is a star but unfortuntely the teachers and headteacher seem to be dancing to their own merry little tune.

    Is CAMHS involved? Are you aware that CAMHS can intervein on your sons behalf if he is struggling due to lack of support from the school?

  • Hi again Jo and Jack

    How was your day and how did it go with the GP?

    Sorry my reply was a bit short this morning, had to rush off and do stuff - my day when I don't work but have tons to do!

    Anyway to answer your question, I think that at least now we now our son probably has ASD (and I am convinced even though diagnosis is not complete) I do feel we are getting closer to understanding him better.  I think the CAMHS therapy is helping but I really want him to get some specialist ASD help and therapy and just can't seem to find anything - have you come accross anything at all?

    He has a speech and language assessment coming up which is part of the diagnosis we have been waiting ages for so I will be asking them lots of questions when we go along to that!

    At least a lot of things are explained now about the way he is, he was always anxious even as a very small child, terrified of loud noises, used to rock and head bang to get to sleep, the list goes on.  What really annoys me is that all the " unusual" things he did we discussed with health visitors etc and no one ever suggested he might have ASD.  We even had an Educational Psycologist in to see him over the course of a few months back when he was in year 4, I even asked the question did she think he might be on the spectrum and the answer was no.  it would have saved so much heartache if we had known earlier - I guess you feel like that too?

    Sorry - didn't mean for this to turn into a rant!

    Does your son have many friends?  Ours has 3 good friends who go back for years and who we make sure come round regularly. Often they just play computer games or sometimes lego but its really good for him to see them.  He gets on well with his brothers and for that we are very thankful.  I do find any social events with people we don't know very stressful as he can come across as rude - head down, frowny face, and you never know what he might say that might not be very PC!

    Does your son ever talk about stuff you wish he wouldn't and get angry about it? Ours seems to like to argue about politics and religion and gets very het up about world problems and government regimes, he is obsessed with people in power doing wrong against the people and says some things that we wouldn't want him repeating outside the house!  Its fine with family and people who know him but I worry he will get into trouble one day saying stuff he shouldnt.

    The social interaction seems to be the biggest problem - he often feels people are getting at him or laughing at him - he was picked on when he was at the mainstream school and this lowered his already low self esteem - does your son have issues with this?

    Sorry - too many questions - please don't feel you have to answer them all.

    Hope you have a good weekend.  We are having a curry tomorrow - favourite with all my boys so should put them all in a good mood!

    Take care. Mary

  • Hi

    Just typed a long reply and then wasn't logged in and I think it has disappeared! (sorry if you get two relies though - not used to this forum system yet!!)

    Regarding the SEN statement, it is a separate thing and does not need a diagnosis.  The process is long but well laid out and begins with you and the school SENCO putting together a "case" which gets submitted and discussed by a panel.  If they decide you have a good case then you get assigned a case officer and the process begins.  There are various meeting with Ed Psychs and school observations and they put the case evidence together - this is where we are at, we should hear some kind of result in February.  I know via the school I work in that they are trying not to give out too many statements - all comes down to money probably - but it sounds like you have a very good case like we did so hopefully should happen for you.

    I hope all goes well with your GP appointment - will be thinking about you, I will write again later - have to dash off out now -

    take care

    Mary

  • Hi Mary,

    I thought the SEN came from him being formally daignossed?

    This could of been explained to me but at the moment i am having trouble retaining all that is being said, cos i am getting so stressed.

    I know i need to calm down, i won't be any use to anyone being stressed.

    But i see things, where people's right are concerned, as simple and support should kick in. Children struggling in school(when it's has plain as the nose on your face)should be recieving support. The school have a duty of care towards my son, i have a duty of care towards my son.

    We have discussed accessing outside private support ie; counselling, home tutoring etc. We will look at anything to weigh up if it would benefit/support our son.     

    I am starting(through work)a couselling course in specific area of my work but CBT based, along with other techniques, so maybe it may give me some tools to support my son.   

    I can only live in hope.

    Do you feel you are making head way for your son, do you feel you are understanding him and understanding his world.

    Sorry for asking you alot questions and will understand if you don't want to answer them.

    I just feel that our sons are same age, our posts read the same about our boys but you seem further into the process than me and your insight invalauble.

    Take care

    Thanks.x

  • Oh I am so sorry to hear he is having a bad week at school.  When our Son was in his mainstream secondary he would be fine when he was in the special quiet area (like your respite area) and they would see a totally different boy in there to the one in the main classroom.  this was because when he was in there he was relaxed, when he was in big class situations he would become very very anxious, and the anxiety manifests itself in the disruptive behaviours.  SO, without the anxiety, behaviour is fine, with anxiety behaviours escalate.  Unfortunately this then gets punished and nothing gets resolved,  they are not naughty, just frightened, anxious and confused, they need help not punishment and it can be very difficult to get this across. 

    Once our school had realised that our son was clinically depressed and probably had Aspergers they did do a lot to try and help - but it wasn't enough.  I cannot see him ever going back into mainstream (in fact I would not let him).  He is currently in the medical PEC which is supposed to be an interim placement.  Not sure what happens next but I would resist a mainstream school with all my might and home school if it came to choosing between the two (but I am sure it won't come to that....)

    Our sons previous school were supposed to have a special ASD unit yet they did not spot his ASD !!- it was only when we took him to a private counsellor for his depression (a consequence of not understanding what was wrong with him, combined with being bullied and a family bereavement) that she spotted it.

    Good luck with your GP appointment.  The formal diagnosis process is a very long winded affair but its worth doing as you need it to then get the support you need.  Has your son got a statement of special needs?  You don't need a diagnosis for this, but you do need the full support of your school,. we are part way through this process (it takes 26 weeks) another load of form filling and appointments but again needed if you want to get help and support.

    Someone who was extremely helpful to us and who was instrumental in us getting a place in the medical PEC for our son was the Head of Inclusion at the Education Authority office.  She was amazing and worked extremely hard on our behalf to help.  Its worthwhile contacting this department direct - google it for your area - rather than wait for school to do something.  I work in a school myself and so was able to get some advice from my Head Teacher which was really helpful.  At the end of the day our children are entitled to an education.  When our Doctor advised us that our son should come out of school because it was detrimental to his health it was the best thing that could have happened because it finally got things moving in the right direction.

    Hang in there and fight for what you think is best for your child.  Don't be afraid to go straight to the top, it can be remarkably easy to speak to those who are in a position to do something for you (and much quicker than waiting to be referred....)

    Best of luck

    Mary

  • Hi mum of 3 and Mary R,

    Thanks for your replies.

    There are lots of similarities between our sons and at times reading your posts, I felt like I was reading about my son in your post.

    Although school have been quick with some actions (after a year) and not with others.

    Although they have had him assessed by EP and her recommendations SCS (aspergers), when I try to discuss support for aspergers they say we will have to wait until he's got his formal diagnosis to put an action plan in place.

    This week for him, has been hideous. The last two days he's spent running around the school away from the teachers, texting me saying he wants to move school, he doesn't want to go in his respite place. Monday-I got txt saying he wasn't coming home!!!!!

    Mary R, I have been in touch with parent partnership through our local council. They seem pretty much like an advice, advocate service between parents and school, they will attend meetings with you and school etc. They are a national service H/O in London 02078436058,www.parentpartnership.org.uk.

    When I try to discuss with SEN, support staff in respite unit about how aspregers can display it's self, they say, we have seen him behave differently in this unit, we know he can behave, we know he knows right from wrong. In around about way saying he is putting it on and we are buying into his bad behaviours.

    Did ask the SEN this morning how much exp has the staff and school had in dealing aspergers, she said a lot!!!!!!!!!

    SEN also told me that they have done all they can do, they will be handing him over to head of year, this sounds like an exclusion coming. Which I told this will be unacceptable.

    We are the GP in the Moring to discuss ref for formal diagnosis, hopefully not another fight.

    I can empathise with both your post, but feel so inexperienced in this new area, that I haven’t got any advice to offer.

    Although you both sound like me where you will continue to fight for your children to get the best possible support.

    Good luck.x   

  • Hi, I so feel for you and you could be talking about my son (right down to the lego!).  I am new here - this is my first post but I have read quite a few and there seems to be a common theme for boys who are OK at primary but as soon as they go to secondary school everything goes to pot.

    My son had a terrible time in year 7 (Sept 2011).  He was picked on, couldnt fit it, luckily he had friends there from primary school.  I was always on tenterhooks waiting for the phone calls to say he had done this, that or the other.  When he gets very anxious he goes into defense overdrive and (this has been said to us by his psychologist) he says terrible things to make himself seem frightening with the aim of getting people to back off and leave him alone.

    During the summer term the SEN team told us they thought he was depressed and a referral was made to camhs.  He was diagnosed with depression and began medication and therapy which he is still on now.  We also took him to a private councellor at around the same time while we awaited the referral to camhs and within two sessions she came to the conclusion that he might have ASD.

    We are now about half way through the incredibly long and drawn out diagnosis process but do know he is on the spectrum and a lot of things now fall into place.

    He tried to go back to school in September 2012 but could not cope, within 4 days he was involved in an incident where a teacher made a remark which he took to be a slight against him, to cut a long story short he threatened the teacher and we were called in.  The school did not exclude him, however his Doctor (from camhs) advised that keeping him in that school was bad for his health and so we took him out.(best thing we ever did and we will not be sending him back!)  We had him at home for 8 weeks doing work mostly set by us, and with a home tutor for the last week.  We had a struggle and a lot of anxious waiting but finally he got in to a special school for kids who are too unwell for mainstream. 

    This is really good but he is still having problems with fitting in socially and has been very angry on a few occasions and said things, really nasty things - probably this defence mechanism again - but not acceptable.  I am so worried that he will hurt himself or someone else although they (at camhs) do not think this is likely.

    I would urge you to get to see your GP as soon as you can,  depression is often the first thing that is spotted before ASD is diagnosed and it can take a long time to spot, meaning that it gets very advanced before you know it.

    Well meaning though the schools can be, they lack expertise, it is best to take it upon yourself to see your GP and set the wheels in motion for diagnosis and also a statement of special needs - you need the schools help with this and again is a long winded process - 26 weeks - but can get special support for the child which I think is essential.

    What I am seeking now is more specialised ASD help for my son.  I do hope that you will be able to find help for you and your son too.