Verbal communication and actions are over rated.
For example, for the past 12 months while I’ve been in burnout, I haven’t heard from hardly any of my friends and barely any of my family, and I’ve got a lot of friends and family, so this isn’t usual.
This has been a true god send to me. Most of them don’t even know yet that I’m autistic and they certainly don’t know I’ve been in a burnout, they have no idea.
However, since I’ve started to feel better, I’ve had a steady but manageable (so far) stream of friends contacting me. Inviting me out for lunch, to go for a walk, to go nordic walking, cycling, one friend who knows I would love to go to Marrakesh has paid for and booked a holiday there for us in June, the same friend has also booked a hotel for us next week so we can go to listen to her favourite band who are coming over from America. None of her friends like the band so they won’t go but she knows I’d go to the end of the world for her if needs be so although I don’t like going to listen to bands, I’m happy to go with her because I know how important it is to her and she’s insisted that she pay for that as well. We might not see each other or have any kind of contact for months and months on end but she knows she can rely on me to the degree that if i’m able to help or be there for her in any way, I will be. She doesn’t have the same level of confidence in the friends she hangs out with all the time.
I have other invites coming in as well, as well as friends popping up to simply say hi, how are you. I don’t keep in regular verbal or physical contact with my friends or family but we are in touch constantly by something much stronger than our words and actions. They didn’t know that I need their friendships right now, that their friendships are what will help me on my next leg of the journey. I’ve decided to go back to India and Bali and some other countries so I’m going to be away for a while this time, maybe a few years, maybe forever, who knows, so it’s great that I get to see some of my friends before I go. And no matter where I am in the world, at least one of my family or friends (who are my family) will come and visit me. They have been to Australia, Bali, India, the Isle of Man, all the places I’ve lived in the UK, wherever I go or wherever I am my friends keep in touch with me some how. I’ve even had letters and cards arrive at remote ashrams I’ve been at in India ~ I wouldn’t even know you could do that!
I don’t keep in touch with them so much but they never let me out of their hearts and visa versa. They all encourage and support me no matter what I do. My dad is currently encouraging me to walk the Pacific Crest Trail, another friend bought me the book with the route etc and I just know that whether I want them to or not, at least one of them will come and see me while I’m walking the trail and either walk a bit of the trail with me or for me to have a little stop off with them. I know when my sister is hurt and in which part of her body and visa versa and she’s the least ‘spiritual’ person you could ever come across.
This is a few days later now and I have to admit that the messages from friends and family is starting to become a little overwhelming for me now. I’ll handle it. But what I’m saying is, if I had to rely on verbal communication, I don’t think I’d have any friends at all, but I speak to them in my language. They don’t use this language with other people and they have no idea really how it works with me but it does and I’m overflowing with gratitude at the love and friendship that’s pouring my way now, now that I’m ready to receive it.
Verbal communication hurts my head, sign language is a bit better but I much prefer to communicate in a non verbal, none sign language way. That way I don’t have to get past all your understandings and you beyond mine before we reach some level of mutual understanding.
This is why I love silent retreats and the level of friendships you form there go way deeper than the ones you make when you are verbally communicating or communicating through body language.
I love it when I go mute but that doesn’t happen very often so I have to accept that I was given the ability to speak for some reason. I have surrendered to this now so now I will be guided in whatever way I need to be and if it means using my voice, so be it. I don’t hate it like I used to. I accept I can speak and now I’m not fighting it I guess I’ll soon find out why I can. I still find verbal/body language to be a very crude and harsh form of communication though.
Hi Former Member
Sounds like things are really improving for you and it is good that people are showing such a genuine interest in you as well as caring for your well-being and needs. The fact that you have some unwritten agreement among you and your friends on how best is to communicate is wonderful. I am still trying to work on that one, but the fact that you have accomplished this brings me hope. Verbal/body language is overrated and unfortunately society revolves around it, but I still believe there is a way that NT and ND people can communicate between each other better than we do currently. Understanding and education will help with this over time.
I'm glad that things are improving for you and you are feeling better than when we last spoke. :)
Thank you Starbuck, I appreciate that. I feel so loved and cared for right now and with every message I get I feel so fortunate. I know I’m there for my friends and I don’t really ask for help, I didn’t know how to, but this feels like they are paying me back 100% plus more ~ not that I ever put a price on what I give.
And yes, I 100% agree with you. I absolutely believe there’s a way we can communicate better with nt’s. Most of my friends are nt’s and the diagnosis and the time spent in this burnout have taught me that I need to learn about others and understand them as much as I want them to understand me, as far as they can. My support worker is helping me with that as well and I’m finding ways to communicate with people that doesn’t result in arguments and me getting annoyed with them. I also see how even my brother in law, who I thought for all these years was out to wind me up, wasn’t/isn’t. I thought he was the chief winder upper and he wasn’t at all.
I’m coming to understand that my autistic traits won’t dissapear just because I have awareness of them but that I can do things to minimise meltdowns etc. For example, I might spent time with people but maybe make the visit a bit shorter and rest afterwards.
Having all that time alone, not even having to get out of bed or wash and change everyday etc has helped me tremendously as well as having the support from people on this site. I’ve still got a long way to go, my support worker keeps reminding me that I’ve got further to go than I’d like to think and that we have to keep on working the baby steps, because they are actually working. But I’m out of the darkest stage and I can see the light and that’s good enough for me.
I think we will all find our way to the light if that’s what we’re aiming for, however we get there. You’re often in my thoughts Starbuck because I know we were at a similar stage so I’m glad that my experience is giving you hope. It’s like it all just happened all of a sudden but as we know I put a lot of effort in to getting me where I am today but it worked. I’ve stopped taking the anti depressants but they were a huge huge help. I don’t think I could have got this far without them. I’m very grateful to them.
With the communication thing, I think it’s all about have total confidence in yourself. Not in who you present to the world, that’s superficial, but in that thing, whatever it is that got us this far. I’ve always had a strong connection to it, all my life, although I didn’t understand it like I do now, or I didn’t understand that others weren’t like me. It’s like when you’re so connected to that thing inside of you that is beyond thoughts and ideas, it emenates out and meets other people. It’s like, I knew I needed this period of total solitude. I knew that and had so much confidence in it, it’s like my friends responded and supported me by not contacting me in all that time. If they had been contacting me I would have been freaking out, I wouldn’t have been able to handle it. I came off all social media, unsubscribed to all email lists and started blocking them. This took me nearly a year but I achieved it so now I’m not getting emails. I just reduced my life down to nothing, basically. I rarely even get mail coming through the door now. In the past year I’ve hardly ate and when I did, it was usually chocolate yet my blood results are better than they’ve ever been. My vitamin D levels are the highest my doctor said that he’s ever seen. He said in fact, he’s never tested anybody who wasn’t deficient. And I know this is true after working with consultants and politicians in the Isle of Man to get the government to supplement everyone as a matter of course. I have never not been aneamic. Me, my mum, sister and niece are all aneamic. We take iron tablets now and again if it goes too low and we can rarely give blood, but this time, my levels were normal. I have provided my body with little nutrition, no sun light, hardly any fresh air, I have barely moved, I even have bed soars, I haven’t kept my hydration levels up, I have been frequently dehydrated, living on solpeideine to take the pain away because even though I knew a drink of water would do that, I couldn’t drink. Even if I had had to live on the streets, there was nothing that was coming between me and my burnout. Meaning I was shutting the whole world out. I knew it would work even though all those around me were worried, trying to throw labels at me, eating disorder, chronic fatigue, fibromyalgia, depression, anxiety, agoraphobia. I was none of those things. I presented as those things but that was a false appearance. I was simply exhausted. My first shut down of this proportion was when I was 18 months old and they put me in an isolation ward at the hospital for kids with learning difficulties, for 3 weeks, all by myself with only nurses going in to feed me. And it worked. I began to function again. And as many of us found out, receiving the diagnosis is not only a cause of celebration with the answers to so many questions, asked and unasked, it also comes with loss, grief, devastation, fear for the future and lots of other things. In the end I also stopped going to the job centre. I just told them I’m not going in any more, it’s not helping me, I need to not leave my house at all. They didn’t sanction me and they’re making it so I don’t have to go in any more. When I need that time for total shut down, I am so committed to getting that time that I will not accept anything less but I also don’t put any conditions on it. If it meant living on the streets and eating out of bins I would have done it. And I think when you’re that committed to giving yourself what you need, everyone around you seems to cooperate without you having to verbalise it. I was too tired for that. And now I’m coming out of it with a clearer mind and heart. The effort was all worth it.
Much love to you X
In the end I also stopped going to the job centre. I just told them I’m not going in any more, it’s not helping me, I need to not leave my house at all. They didn’t sanction me and they’re making it so I don’t have to go in any more. When I need that time for total shut down, I am so committed to getting that time that I will not accept anything less but I also don’t put any conditions on it. If it meant living on the streets and eating out of bins I would have done it. And I think when you’re that committed to giving yourself what you need, everyone around you seems to cooperate without you having to verbalise it.
Golly! You really must walk an exalted path, BlueRay. How come you weren't sanctioned? When I failed my ESA assessment, following my suicidal breakdown, they stopped all of my benefits dead. I had nothing to pay rent or anything. I nearly went under. I appealed, so everything was reinstated - but then I had to go through all the stress of the appeal, and then later a tribunal. All of it nearly finished me off. I count myself lucky that it didn't, because it's finished off many thousands of other people. When the DWP were finally forced to reveal the figures on sanctions deaths, it was shown that over a two-year period between 2012 and 2014, 2,380 people on ESA died within a fortnight of being told they'd been deemed fit for work and would lose the benefit. An horrific proportion were suicides. But you're saying you simply went to the Job Centre and said 'I'm not coming in any more because it's not helping me', and they just happily went along with it? Even though we hear countless stories all the time of people having JSA sanctions simply because they were half an hour late turning up to sign on, or didn't go because they were ill. They clearly saw how committed you were to your shutdown, I suppose. I also find it remarkable how light you make of living on the streets and eating out of bins - as if it's a valid and wonderful life experience. Who are all these people, too, who magically co-operate when that happens? All these friends you have?
The description of laws is accurate. However, the natural universal laws and the commandments that Jesus spoke of are irrefutable, they are like the laws of electricity, they are exact and precise. Jesus was wholly against anybody making oaths to anybody, ever. He said to do so, you cut off your connection to your true nature.
The natural universal 'principles' as 'consolidations' Jesus spoke about for your father in the heavens that a 'covenant' (or agreement) be formed with God in principle, with the first being to honour/respect the wife of him and the Mother of you ~ by aspiring to firstly love the spirit of you in the heart of you, in the soul of you and in the mind of you. This is the greatest of the consolidations. And the second greatest likewise is ~ aspire to love the neighbour of you as doing so the self of you. For on the embodiment of these dual consolidations ~ all of the teaching suspends and the prophets.
Oaths yes are not too be made, wrong word session on my part there. Jesus was not though against people making covenants/agreements or consolidations/pledges/compacts/contracts/promises, but if one's promises are made in respect of god and humans ~ breaking those 'covenants' was not advisable. Consider for instance that Jesus said: "Render to Caesar the things that are Caesar's; and to God the things that are God's." Matthew 22:21. Or in other words pay dues to the Father of you in the heavens and to the Mother of you embodying the society of you upon the earth.
Keeping covenants strengthens the connection to the true nature of one as a human of earth (in terms of flesh) and a being of heaven (in terms of spirit) as living in harmony.
This universe could not continue if it was not run by laws. They are what makes a tulip seed into a tulip. They are the laws of cause and effect. This was the bulk of Einstein’s work, little of which was ever published.
Recalling that 'Law is a system of rules that are created and enforced through social or governmental institutions to regulate behaviour. Law is a system that regulates and ensures that individuals or a community adhere to the will of the state.' - thus it is in stating that 'This universe could not continue if it was not run by laws.' you have done the absolute classic that involves societal governance running the universe. :-)
Of course humans have not been been around long enough for laws to have had anything to do with running the universe, and if they did the universe would not exist as there would be nothing to enable no one to discover nothing and to not state that nothing ran nothing! ;-)
What makes a seed into a tulip is the principles of nature, e.g. energetic field frequencies and the geometric integrities of the atoms and molecules involved ~ which in terms of being 'recorded' systematic processes and only 'systematically recorded processes' we describe these as laws. Laws then are the descriptions of natural processes but laws are not the natural processes themselves. So basically the proofs of existential processes do not govern existence.
As for man made laws, I have never and will never recognise them as little more than guidelines for people who don’t think for themselves, they have no meaning for me.
Aside from laws all being (hu)man(ly) made, mistaking laws or theories for principles is commonly and easily done, and you do recognise the laws of man ~ or you would not be using them to validate your statements, such as with Einstein's stuff for instance.
I live by universal laws and because of that, I always get whatever I want in life, whenever I want it and man made laws have never got in my way.
I live by or more concisely in universal love and wisdom myself, working with needs rather than so much wants, and being that the laws of society are to protect basic rights and freedoms, and to treat everyone fairly ~ they have not as such gotten in the way of me either, as they have been really helpful in numerous ways.
. said:Also spent time homeless
. said:and in a hostel for the homeless
I never did the hostel thing myself as I was too unsettled. Staying in one place did not really happen until I found my footing, which is to say where I felt most grounded, and got on the emergency housing list. Then I found a place advertised the next day in a paper ~ and the landlord turned out to be someone I used to know. He did not recognise me at first, but it was well amusing when he did, because he was really pleased and surprised ~ and memoirs and laughter aplenty did flow. He was a genius chess player type, and I had a mega bonus playing chess with him on a regular basis.
One thing I did have trouble with was that I was so used to sleeping on hard floors; that it took me a year and half's practice before I could sleep on a soft bed again.
Did you find the hostel thing to be okay?
I never went to hostels. I didn’t feel safe in them, I felt safer on the streets.
Yeah, I learned some huge lessons, not least dissolving the habit of running away.
It’s been like a baptism of fire ~ I think! Lol! I don’t really understand what that means but it feels right although I could be totally wrong.
Thanks for the info on the types. I can talk to all types but sometimes I just want to talk as me. I don’t expect anybody to understand me and neither do I particularly want to but it was fun while it lasted, talking my language.
I’ll answer these points one by one but on different threads.
I’ll put your name at the beginning so you are less likely to miss the comments because this is really interesting. I don’t understand what you’re saying, but I’m going to do my best. And maybe after a bit of toing and froing I might gain more understanding.
I don’t recognise societal laws, they have no interest to me. So when I talk about laws, I’m talking universal laws, but the description remains accurate.
Law is a system of rules that are created and enforced, through social or governmental institutions, to regulate behaviour. Law is a system that regulates and ensures that individuals or a community adhere to the will of the state.
The [natural] laws, is a system of unbreakabke rules that were created ... to regulate behaviour. These laws aren’t enforced, people have free will to follow the laws or not. They are not judged for this in anyway. The laws are a system that regulates and ensures that individuals or a community adhere to the will of the state ~ the state being the creater of the laws, for ease of conversation let’s call that god ~ unless you have any negative connotations attached to that word?
So for example, love thy neighbour as yourself. That is a law. If you follow this law you will experience bliss, freedom and happiness ~ provided you ‘know thyself’. If you don’t, you will experience any and all of frustration, jealousy, envy, hatred etc etc.
Nobody will ‘punish’ you if you don’t live by this law, you won’t be judged, but you will not experience the constant bliss, freedom and happiness it gives you in return.
If you don’t follow it, you will simply reap what you sow. You will plant the seed (the cause, the harmful thoughts) and you will experience the effects of those thoughts.
It’s a simple law but most people chose to ignore it and as such, they do not experience the freedom.
Humans create their own laws. They are not based on love and freedom, they are based on things like control, greed, power etc and as such, I do not recognise them.
I live by the law of love and as it continues to be proven in my life, this law is far greater than any human man made law so I have no reason to recognise or abide by man made laws.
Ok, so this first part, I can’t understand. I don’t know what you mean by ‘principles as consolidations’ ~ I don’t know what a consolidation is and why can’t a principle just be a principal?
I don’t understand the part about Jesus asking people to form agreements with god in principle? I don’t understand that. He said we are god.
He didn’t say aspire to love the spirit in you he said this is the law, know thyself, love thyself and love all others as yourself and you will live in bliss, happiness and freedom and you will have all that you want, and more, in this life. We were given free will to chose to live by the law or not. He was simply telling people what the law was and how to achieve it.
Render to Ceasar would mean to render nothing to him because what does he have? Nothing.
So all that part was largely confusing to me.
In terms of the tulip. You call it the ‘principles of nature’ - another word for that could be law. This is what I mean by law.
Laws aren’t the natural processes ~ this is where I get confused. Let me try to understand ...
Electricity works through the laws of electricity - would you agree? If those laws aren’t followed, someone could at best not get any electricity and at worst they could electrocute themselves. You can’t play around with these laws. You can’t say I’ll follow them one day and not the next. If you want to have the benefits of electricity, such as light, you have to follow the laws.
Like wise, the tulip seed follows the laws of its nature and becomes a fully grown tulip. When all the ingredients are there, soil, water, sun, they will work together along the law of nature to enable the seed to reach its end stage, before it whither and dies.
I have no clue what that means - that the proof of existential processes do not govern existence. I can’t make any sense of it. Sorry.
I have no idea what you mean by mistaking laws for principles.
Are you saying all laws are made by man? If so, we have a different understanding of what a law is. I know there are man made laws, I don’t pay them much attention, but I know they’re there and I work with them in my work when I work for the government. But they aren’t the only laws and they’re certainly not the laws that I live by.
I live by the laws of know thyself, love thy neighbour, unity, love, the law of cause and effect, those kinds of laws, none of which were made by man. Man didn’t make the law of electricity but he discovered it and made use of it but he didn’t make it. I now drive within speed limits and follows the laws of the road to a greater degree, things like that. I recognise them but they don’t rule my life.
DeepthoughtOh absolutely, I love human laws. Don’t get me wrong, I’m not belittling them in anyway. They are a necessity because currently, most people don’t think for themselves and until they do, we absolutely need human laws.
Like you, they have been helpful to me in so many ways and were key to me getting my clients what they needed when working as a social worker. So I’m not putting them down in anyway and it’s fun to watch as they get more severe as people are beginning to learn how to think for themselves. But it doesn’t matter how severe they get, they will eventually dissolve to the degree that people start to think for themselves and no longer allow themselves to be controlled by them, they will lose their purpose.
I never went to hostels. I didn’t feel safe in them, I felt safer on the streets
Interesting statement, being that you 'never' went to hostels ~ yet you did not feel safe 'in' them?
Nice example of Autistic Black and White Thinking ~ i.e, the first part of the sentence that you 'never' went to hostels; is contradicted by the second part that you did not feel safe 'in' them.
Is it perhaps that you did not 'use' hostels because of not feeling safe when you had been in them as a visitor, or that you never actually went to one because of not feeling comfortable about using them?
In my case, I seriously needed to experience the individuality of me singularly and freely, and using hostels involved rules and collective conformity with others. Being nomadic for me meant that there was no need or imperative to be with others, nor to interact with them.
I lined up a couple of times to go and sleep there but the talk from the others who were lining up, put me off and I had a system of sleeping in the day and walking the streets at night, which I decided I would stick to. That felt safer to me and I had some good places to sleep in the day, such as pubs and I think I was more visible this way, meaning people realised I was homeless and so they would feed me, let me get a shower at their house etc. So I’ve been in hostels as a visitor (my auntie used to work in one) and in other capacities but as for me sleeping in one, my preferred method was to walk the streets at night and that just felt like a better option to me. Plus I didn’t want to line up every night at a certain time just to get in.
Oh yeah, my support worker is working with me to hammer that word ‘never’ out of me. It was all going well until last Friday then I screamed ‘I’m NEVER going back to my autism group and I’m NEVER going back on the autism site! Lol!
I am such a typical text book case aspie it’s untrue, but I love it although I have been doing much better since minimising my use of the word ‘never’. My black and white thinking is getting better by the day as well.
I’ve always been a nomad and I think I always will be. I took a few years out because my son (little weirdo! Lol) wanted to go to school!!!! It didn’t matter what I tried to do to convince him that I’m sure he’d have more fun coming with me, he wanted to go so he started when he was 6. I thought he might go for a while then get bored of it but he didn’t get fed up till the last year. He was all set to get high grades and go to uni and by that time came he’d had enough ~ at last, I thought, allauya!