Aspergers Girls-Please describe yourselves as 3-4 year olds

Hi, I'm a 52 year old woman currently seeking diagnosis, so there's a chance I don't have Asperger's syndrome. But I'm pretty sure that I do, so hope this reply is helpful.

As far as I know, I didn't have a speech delay in fact I had a good vocabulary for my age. My dad remembers me reading newspapers without much help by the age of 4. But I was clumsy, tripping up often and hopeless at catching anything. I had a teddy bear which had been played with to the point of falling apart, with both legs and one arm missing, which I carried around everywhere and slept with at night.  My parents bought me a new one, but I never took to it. I also had an early interest in insects and caterpillars, and spent much time in the garden searching for them.

I wasn't aware of any social problems at home, but it was very different as soon as I went to infant school, at the age of 4. I was bullied from day one, and had no idea how to deal with it. I can still remember the first day, in the playground surrounded by children running around shouting, being terrified by the apparent chaos, and not knowing whether they were shouting in happiness, sadness or pain, or what for. I spent most of my playtimes with my back against a wall, waiting for it to end. Sometimes I hid in the outside toilets. Once a bully came up to me and said, " get out of the way or I'll kill you", and I thought he meant it literally. It never occurred to me to tell a teacher, or I suppose I could have been reassured.

In class, my favourite activity was painting, but I used to paint the same image (a house, with a garden and flowers) over and over again. I found it comforting. One day the teacher came up to me and said I couldn't keep doing that because I was wasting paper, and I couldn't think of anything else I wanted to paint, and had a major tantrum. After that, I didn't paint again for months. I was always being told off by the teacher about my handwriting, which was terrible, even for my age. (It's still not very good)

I rarely attempted to play with other children, and when I did it usually didn't work out well. If I thought the game they were playing was boring or stupid I would just say so. Before long, they wouldn't let me try to join in, so I stopped bothering. I was able to amuse myself by daydreaming, anyway. I never learnt most of their names, I didn't feel the need.

One of the punishments for bad behaviour at the school was to stand in the corner facing the wall until the teacher said you could move, but I quite enjoyed it. I could stand quietly for ages.

At 3 or 4 my verbal skills had deteriorated, up to 18 months I had been using grammatically accurate sentences. I had whooping cough at 3, which might not have helped. There were horrendous power struggles over bowel issues (ugh! Vile bodies. Good old Freud 'n'all....).

A lot of fried food, especially fried eggs and lard, made me feel sick, but this was not understood. 

I used to scream if Mum sang tunes I did not like. There was a pair of maroon red shoes I screamed over too, but that might have been earlier. On some level, I realised that might have been a bit mean. Mum used to talk a lot about going to a place called school on the future and I did not understand why the definite article was left out. I thought it would be some kind of bike trip. Mum delayed my starting school until 5, guessing that I might not be ready for it: it was certainly a huge shock to the system when it did come to be time for it. 

Emma, so well put. I wish I could write what I want to say like you do. I am going to leave this thread now because it is to upsetting .Thank you for explaining to the OP and I hope she hears.

I absolutely don't doubt you've got your kids' best interests at heart and that you will go for the diagnosis if you notice anything more serious.

The thing I am trying to emphasise in my post is that it is likely to be very difficult to notice, and that's not because I think you're not looking, that's because of the nature of aspie women. Just be on your guard and remember that even the slight symptoms might be well worth a closer look in a female.

Autism does appear, as you put it, "more subtle" for girls on the surface, but actually we can experience an even greater degree of psychological hardship than the typical boys growing up, especially if we don't get that diagnosis and intervention because we look too "normal".

As a rule, girls mask, we do it well and we do it until we break under the strain. 

Emma, 

I’m not suggesting that I’m not going to look to diagnose my daughter just that right now I’m going to jump straight into it and that also I’m still undergoing diagnoses with my 8yr Old and having finally got an adhd diagnoses back in April we are now awaiting an ados appointment which could take up to a year x x

Song - I do get what you are saying but right now I’m not sure I have enough to go to the GP to get a referral with and would rather wait a few months til she’s at preschool and see if they notice anything. 

I am used to dealing with my sons autistic traits so I think I’m fairly well equipped to deal with my 3yr old too - no offence intended. 

We have also as a family (grandparents) discussed the fact that we suspect she is autistic like her brother and I’ve discussed it with some close friends too so most of the people surrounding her are aware that we think that way. 

Even without a diagnoses I can as her mum guide her through her difficulties anyway. 

I am also considering a diagnoses (possibly ADHD) for myself at 35yrs old as going through my 8yr Old sons diagnoses has made me think about myself too x x

Agreed. I wasn't diagnosed until my late teens. The information about autism, and autism in girls particularly, just wasn't around.
At the point I was first "noticed" as possibly autistic, I was deeply distressed.

I was distressed by my inability to continue "fitting in" in the face of a massively more complex post-puberty social environment.
I was distressed by the way I was perceived and therefore treated by my peers, their parents and my teachers, and my complete inability to change this perception.
I was distressed by the fact that my academic grades (the thing I clung on to and convinced myself gave me worth after all, even though I was 'weird') had started to drop severely due to the stress and due to changes in the way the work was presented.

I was SO distressed by these things that I developed serious depression.

I was referred to CAMHS, where I was finally discovered and diagnosed, because I was cutting myself.

If the information had been around sooner, if my parents had even heard of autism and had enough knowledge to recognise it when I was pre-school age, it might never have come to that.
I might not have suffered so much at the hands of people (especially adults in positions of power and trust) who thought I was just being badly behaved and that they could stamp it out of me. 
I might not have suffered at the hands of my peers, because someone might have taught me how to make social interactions with those people work in a way that didn't end up in physical and mental abuse.
People might have explained things better to me, instead of bullying me into behaving "normally", and so I might have been conditioned less towards blind compliance (which played a significant role in me being abused as a young adult).

Early diagnosis is, as Song says, so very important.

NAS38853 there is so much I want to tell you, so many reasons I want to give but I can't get them all out to you.

Please if you think your daughter might have problems get her referred for diagnosis as soon as possible, I'm sure you know the waiting lists are very long.

She might well cope now but she could fall apart under the strain later on. She will go to school and not know why she is different but spend her life trying to hide it.

She will think she is mad or bad or just wonder why she doesn't get the way the world works.

She will wonder why friendships are difficult and why people treat her differently, she might even blame her brother,  all this and more could be avoided by you looking after her needs and getting a diagnosis. If her legs didn't work normally you would get help wouldn't you, not just wait and see?

Please get her On the list

Just for clarity i am a 51 year old recently diagnosed female autistic who had a very successful career, and is married with 5 children.

What you have described here sounds like me 3yr old daughter. 

My 8.5yr old son has an adhd diagnoses and we are waiting on an ados appointment as the paediatrician thought he was also autistic. We’ve thought so for a while too! 

I worry that because of my son I’m seeing things in my daughter a lot more than what I would have if my son was neurotypical. 

I’m not going to go to the paediatrician with her yet as I think with a girl it’s more subtle and she’s coping with it a lot better too. I think I’m just going to keep an eye on her and see what else emerges as she develops x x

I work within a school setting and gone across serval children who have autism. I feel I am knowledgeable in the subject but not an expert. But like you i have concerns about my 5 year old daughter. At what age was your daughter officially diagnose? I'm currently seeing the school nurse for additional help and support. I feel like my daughters meltdowns are just unbearable some days. They can last for up to 3 hours. my younger son is starting to copy her behaviour

Hi,

I am a mum of 3y old boy who always suffered from some sensory issues, obsessed behaviours and anxiety, especially separation anxiety. He hasn`t settled at the nursery at the age of 22mths and hasn`t settled at the childminder at the age of 2.5y old. He is hopefully going to start pre-school on September.

You mention strategies you were implementing at home to help your daughter. Would you be able to recommend any books/publications I could possibly get in order to help my son to get ready for school he is about to start next year? Many thanks in advance.x

I can't believe I put this on here and never looked at replies! Thanks to all of you who did though. It was really interesting to read what I wrote about my daughter and all of your replies have elements of her in. She is 6 now and everything I previously described and so much more! There is no question that she has Aspergers and my husband is in total agreement.  Even her sister (age 8) asks us why she is so different. School have been great so far and my only reason for seeking diagnosis would be if she was struggling at school. They think she is different also, but she is highly intelligent and quite happy. If she ever struggles or becomes upset I will consider seeking diagnosis. As I work in this field I am able to implement strategies to support her at home and my husband has picked them up well also. She is responding really well to this and is generally a very happy child. She behaves really well within her routine. When broken she will howl wildly proclaiming "I'm really stressed!" But we have developed a bank of strategies which reassure her and help her to come out of it reasonably quickly. She has so many talents and such an amazing funny personality, I wouldn't change her for the world. She is currently sat on the carpet reading 'A Series of Unfortunate Events' and discussing the similarities with 'James and the Giant Peach' which suits her better than the books a typically developing 6 year old would read. She is a maths whizz and top of the class. She is also musically talented. I think if we can continue to support her differences and if school continues to support her well then we will leave diagnosis until a later age. Difference is good.  

hello

I just read a post from 2013 And I would like to know if your daughter has been diagnosed. My daughter has a very similar temper And I have Been told it is usual for an almost 3 years old. However I do feel she is different than her peers. Thanks 

My daughter is 11 and was diagnosed in August. I knew for years she had high functioning autism. Nobody listened to me untill I had a son (who is 3) who is at the severe end of the spectrum, I didn't have to fight for his diagnosis.

As a 3 to 4 year old my daughter would scream if I had my hair down (i useally wear it up). She would scream if I tried to change the CD in the car (I had the same R n B love songs on for years!). She could talk but wouldn't, she had speech therapy because she couldn't sound f's and g's. She collected things and liked putting toys and collections in boxes or bags, taking them out and counting them then putting them all back. She wanted (and had) her hair done 'like Cindy' (from the Grinch film) every day for 18 months ( a big sticking up bun on the top and two low plaits!). Other posts ring a bell with me too, obbsession with food, taking off clothes, fantastic memory and writing me notes are all things she has always done.

Up untill starting school she was fine with all of this because I could do the things that made her feel better. School has been a nightmare, no learning difficulties, no bad behaviour in school, they did not support me.hence the late diagnosis.She is passive and never let teachers see how unhappy she was at school. She has never made friends and now at high school cannot attend at all, I am only just applying for her statement.

I think that if you think there is a possibility your daughter is on the spectrum, then she cannot be assessed soon enough.

My daughter went through hell at primary school with no one understanding her but me, and that didn't help because I wasn't there with her at school.The earlier diagnosis comes the better for the child. No harm done if she isn't autistic. But a world of difference made for the better if she is and is diagnosed early.

its as though i'm reading about my own daughter she was diagnosed in june age 5.

Hi my daughter has just been diagnosed at 15 years old. During childhood she was much more comfortable in the presence of adults, once describing other children as 'childish'. She was often totally absorbed in what she was doing, hard to engage, a poor sleeper, academically bright and had very few, if any, friends. One of her more quirky traits was communicating with me using little notes or letters, which she still does. She has always found it difficult to express her emotions, but when she becomes frustrated she can get quite aggressive. She can also become 'mute' when she doesn't want to discuss something, and sees most things in black and white and will not budge in her opinion.

Since a very early age she has had major problems fitting in at school. She finds it extremely difficult to make and then keep friends, which has led to social isolation and other problems which I won't go into here.  An earlier diagnosis wouldn't have necessarily changed things much but at least I would have been able to support her better in forging friendships and in understanding her own self. If you are worried get your daughter checked out..., trust your instincts. At the end of the day if you are wrong there will be no harm done and you will have peace of mind. You are only doing the 'lioness and cub' thing after all! Good luck.

Well, as far as I know I was a quiet child, but I found out recently my dad had commented to the GP (and it's on my record) that I was a "studious and at times rather emotional child" so I wonder now whether the emotional meant crying a lot or tantrums.  I think it's usually a slow boil with me, but I do remember my older brother endlessly picking on me and one day I flipped (I always thought it was anger problems as I had no idea about autism) and I went into one of my rare blind rages, during which I inflicted pain on him that made him cry.  These days, the pressures on me send me into near meltdown a lot more regularly, but that's something that is written into the DSM criteria that:

"Symptoms must be present in the early developmental period (but may not become fully manifest until social demands exceed limited capacities, or may be masked by learned strategies later in life)."

I asked my Mum! - I am high functioning autism and was diagnosed at 30ish.

Age 3/4 - I could talk but wouldn't but when I did it was in sentences which were complicated. I remember thinking that talking was pointless unless necessary.

I could read, write and do basic arithmatic. I could draw perfectly in terms of copying what I could see.

I never played with toys, siblings or anything - I was happier in my room reading or drawing.

I ate ok apparently but have my likes and dislikes. For example, I won't eat anything with salt added or near it because I hate the taste of salt. If I think there's salt in it I will not touch it.

I never slept but it didn't bother me as long as I had my books and pencils etc.

That sounds really positive - but there were other times -

If anyone touched me I would scream the place down. My Mum was allowed to touch me and that's all, anyone else was a no-no so trips to dr etc caused meltdown everytime - I actually remember having a medical check before I started school and the nurse telling me I was a very naughty llittle girl. I kicked her in the shins very hard. No regrets.

My Mum kept telling the 'professionals'  something wasn't right but they said I was attention seeking and badly behaved - how many of us have had that label.

I didn't cope with over stimulation in terms of noise, light and particularly smells so school wasn't easy for me. And yet I was above average intelligence - I have an IQ of 165.

No-one picked up at school I had a problem because I learned to stay quiet and did work quite hard but I had no friends or social life and yet it wasn't deemed to be an issue. Despite my Mum's constant haranging of my teachers.

So I was quite good really, quiet if left to my own devices and little routines but if I wa disrupted then it was mega meltdown and I have a good pair of lungs.

Still have.

I haven't actually changed very much.

Remember - all people are unique and special in some way - I now consider my autism a gift in that it enables me to do things others can only dream of.

The other thing to remember is that autism often shows more as the child gets older, so it may not be obvious at such a young age, professionals are more likely to fob off or want to take a "wait and see" approach.  There is still a bias against diagnosing girls too, which has been proven by research, even when girls present with the same level of difficulties as boys.  My youngest was very quiet and although she did have tantrums, so do a lot of toddlers.  I was apparently an abnormally quiet baby, yet my eldest cried endlessly and was so miserable.  It presents differently in everyone, you cannot compare, trust your instincts and get your daughter assessed.  Don't end up like I have with my eldest, getting fobbed off by professionals until she was old enough now to be in denial frightened of being different, despite having awful difficulties.

I was diagnosed age 21, and am now 26.

As a child, I was quiet in some situations but in others I was very loud. It was either one of two extremes, and no in-between. In fact, when I was born, my mum was told that my cry was by far the loudest on the ward. I did not cry too much, but when I did, it was extremely loud!.

And tantrums could go on for up to two hours if I was restrained in my pushchair or did not like something!