Aspergers Girls-Please describe yourselves as 3-4 year olds

I have been in a quandary for a while. I grew up with an Aspie brother and I now work in special education and specialise in ASC. I am also in the process of completing a Masters in Autism.  Therefore I feel I have a really good sense of Aspergers/ASC and associated symptoms. Every Aspie girl that I have come into contact with at my school has been diagnosed at the age if about 7/8, and I have often been the one to raise concerns with parents who initially thought their daughters were quiet, qurky, intelligent, sensitive worriers. I understand how easy it can be for Aspergers to be masked, particularly in young girls, however I have significant concerns regarding my own 3 (nearly 4) year old daughter.  I keep reading paediatric reports about what girls in my care with diagnosis were like between 2-4 years old, and it is like they are describing my own daughter. I have had concerns for over a year but I am reluctant to persue anything at the moment until I can be absolutely sure that I'm not 'looking' for symptoms based on my job and experiences with my brother. My husband would agree that she is odd in many ways but the things I see as her 'means of communication' he sees as intentional behaviour.  For example if she is interrupted when trying to complete a task (anything from trying to explain something, taking some rubbish to the bin or completing a puzzle) then she has a meltdown. I see this as a reaction to a break in her routine, an overwhelming desire to complete a task and inflexible thinking.  My husband would think more along the lines of it being her wanting her own way, although to be fair he is gradually seeing my point more often. The list of strengths and difficulties are quite long.  Some of her strengths include: Very intellligent, good with numbers and letters, excellent memory (she will pick up a random toy and say who bought it and why e.g. My uncle gave that to me for my birthday, and when we check with him, she is right every time.) Some of her quirks include: Desire to complete tasks, seeks sensory feedback, over expressive facial expressions and tone of voice, literal, wants people to be her friend but may overwhelm them, unaware if personal space, repetitive monologues (for example when she was 2 she repeatedly said "I've got brown eyes, mummy's got brown eyes, daddy's got blue eyes, my sister'a got blue eyes" this monologue would carry on through ever person she knew, including the next door neighbour's cats.  She would then go on to pair people up, for example saying that she was the same as me, and daddy was the same as one of the cats next door etc.) I could go on but I think you get the picture. 

I suppose my big questions are, what did your female relatives/yourself present like at this age? Do you think I am confusing things by being so naturally tuned into symptoms and am I over analysing her? I also wonder if some of these things aren't too far away from age related expectations. By this I mean that I would worry if a 6 year old girl at my school presented like this, and I keep needing to remind myself that she is younger. 

Parents
  • What you have described here sounds like me 3yr old daughter. 

    My 8.5yr old son has an adhd diagnoses and we are waiting on an ados appointment as the paediatrician thought he was also autistic. We’ve thought so for a while too! 

    I worry that because of my son I’m seeing things in my daughter a lot more than what I would have if my son was neurotypical. 

    I’m not going to go to the paediatrician with her yet as I think with a girl it’s more subtle and she’s coping with it a lot better too. I think I’m just going to keep an eye on her and see what else emerges as she develops x x

  •  there is so much I want to tell you, so many reasons I want to give but I can't get them all out to you.

    Please if you think your daughter might have problems get her referred for diagnosis as soon as possible, I'm sure you know the waiting lists are very long.

    She might well cope now but she could fall apart under the strain later on. She will go to school and not know why she is different but spend her life trying to hide it.

    She will think she is mad or bad or just wonder why she doesn't get the way the world works.

    She will wonder why friendships are difficult and why people treat her differently, she might even blame her brother,  all this and more could be avoided by you looking after her needs and getting a diagnosis. If her legs didn't work normally you would get help wouldn't you, not just wait and see?

    Please get her On the list

    Just for clarity i am a 51 year old recently diagnosed female autistic who had a very successful career, and is married with 5 children.

  • Agreed. I wasn't diagnosed until my late teens. The information about autism, and autism in girls particularly, just wasn't around.
    At the point I was first "noticed" as possibly autistic, I was deeply distressed.

    I was distressed by my inability to continue "fitting in" in the face of a massively more complex post-puberty social environment.
    I was distressed by the way I was perceived and therefore treated by my peers, their parents and my teachers, and my complete inability to change this perception.
    I was distressed by the fact that my academic grades (the thing I clung on to and convinced myself gave me worth after all, even though I was 'weird') had started to drop severely due to the stress and due to changes in the way the work was presented.

    I was SO distressed by these things that I developed serious depression.

    I was referred to CAMHS, where I was finally discovered and diagnosed, because I was cutting myself.

    If the information had been around sooner, if my parents had even heard of autism and had enough knowledge to recognise it when I was pre-school age, it might never have come to that.
    I might not have suffered so much at the hands of people (especially adults in positions of power and trust) who thought I was just being badly behaved and that they could stamp it out of me. 
    I might not have suffered at the hands of my peers, because someone might have taught me how to make social interactions with those people work in a way that didn't end up in physical and mental abuse.
    People might have explained things better to me, instead of bullying me into behaving "normally", and so I might have been conditioned less towards blind compliance (which played a significant role in me being abused as a young adult).

    Early diagnosis is, as Song says, so very important.

Reply
  • Agreed. I wasn't diagnosed until my late teens. The information about autism, and autism in girls particularly, just wasn't around.
    At the point I was first "noticed" as possibly autistic, I was deeply distressed.

    I was distressed by my inability to continue "fitting in" in the face of a massively more complex post-puberty social environment.
    I was distressed by the way I was perceived and therefore treated by my peers, their parents and my teachers, and my complete inability to change this perception.
    I was distressed by the fact that my academic grades (the thing I clung on to and convinced myself gave me worth after all, even though I was 'weird') had started to drop severely due to the stress and due to changes in the way the work was presented.

    I was SO distressed by these things that I developed serious depression.

    I was referred to CAMHS, where I was finally discovered and diagnosed, because I was cutting myself.

    If the information had been around sooner, if my parents had even heard of autism and had enough knowledge to recognise it when I was pre-school age, it might never have come to that.
    I might not have suffered so much at the hands of people (especially adults in positions of power and trust) who thought I was just being badly behaved and that they could stamp it out of me. 
    I might not have suffered at the hands of my peers, because someone might have taught me how to make social interactions with those people work in a way that didn't end up in physical and mental abuse.
    People might have explained things better to me, instead of bullying me into behaving "normally", and so I might have been conditioned less towards blind compliance (which played a significant role in me being abused as a young adult).

    Early diagnosis is, as Song says, so very important.

Children
  • Emma, so well put. I wish I could write what I want to say like you do. I am going to leave this thread now because it is to upsetting .Thank you for explaining to the OP and I hope she hears.

  • I absolutely don't doubt you've got your kids' best interests at heart and that you will go for the diagnosis if you notice anything more serious.

    The thing I am trying to emphasise in my post is that it is likely to be very difficult to notice, and that's not because I think you're not looking, that's because of the nature of aspie women. Just be on your guard and remember that even the slight symptoms might be well worth a closer look in a female.

    Autism does appear, as you put it, "more subtle" for girls on the surface, but actually we can experience an even greater degree of psychological hardship than the typical boys growing up, especially if we don't get that diagnosis and intervention because we look too "normal".

    As a rule, girls mask, we do it well and we do it until we break under the strain. 

  • Emma, 

    I’m not suggesting that I’m not going to look to diagnose my daughter just that right now I’m going to jump straight into it and that also I’m still undergoing diagnoses with my 8yr Old and having finally got an adhd diagnoses back in April we are now awaiting an ados appointment which could take up to a year x x