help please newly diagnosed and behavioural issues

Coogybear has raised an interesting illustration which reflects two aspects of autism.

Firstly you cannot reliably read non-verbal signals that something is wrong or inappropriate. Secondly in the absence of ability to read those signals properly, you become heavily dependent on following examples, where you think it gains approval.

The child that Gaus observed may have picked up the idea of spitting from seeing other children do it in another context (second aspect). They may even have been encouraged to do it by their peers, who see the bidability and susceptability of someone on the spectrum as a means of getting amusement. But more commonly the spitting may have arisen from a misunderstanding of whether or not spitting was appropriate, or even a misconception of spitting as a good gesture.

Most children would pick up on disapproving reactions, but the first aspect is not being able to read disapproving messages properly, or to detect collective disapproval messages. Disapproval need not be expressed verbally, or if expressed verbally the emphasis on the verbal disapproval may have been misinterpreted from being a sigfnificant rebuttal to being a playful reaction, perhaps seen in the original context.

The child simply repeats the practice because it seems acceptable, and the unacceptability has never been explained properly until Gaus demonstrated it to the child.

I myself frequently do something similar, whether or not this is down to AS. I pick up that some personal remark in jest is clever or approved, and I keep doing it, because I think it acceptable, until someone very clearly explains to me they don't like it and would I stop it. I keep getting into this predicament. Something seems to me to be right, and I just keep doing it, thinking it is appreciated, until it comes to pretty firm rebuttal.

Maybe that's just me....but it would be interesting to know if others have had similar experiences.

Some of what rach06 describes may be conventional AS reaction to environmental/social distress. He communicates that it hurts him by hurting others.

But you do need to explore whether to any extent his peers are inciting these reactions through subtle bullying or more blatent provocation, to get such a reaction as entertainment.

Is rach06's son being buillied at school? The teachers may well not know this is happening.

Can I ask? This may seem a little odd as a question, but are you sure your son has a full understanding of what he is doing to you?

The reason I ask, is because I read a book by Valerie Gaus recently, where she describes been repeatedly assaulted by a child with Autism that she was supporting. This child regularly spat at her I believe. One day, she spat back at the child and to her amazment the child protested that it was unpleasent for them. When she explained that it was unpleasent to have it done to her also, the child never spat again. It turned out that the child had no concept that what he/she was doing, was unpleasent. Only when they became aware did they alter their behaviour.

Obviously you need to be careful here. I'm not suggesting that you adopt tit for tat fight behaviour toward your son, but it may well be worth looking into CBT or other support for your childs issues. Does your son receive DLA? If so, are you able to channel that into some private therapy from an autism aware therapist? I had to do this for one of my sons to help with his behavioral issues and in fact it was way more helpful than CHAM's who could only offer around 6 sessions.

Their is a link on this site re behavioral issues, but you may prefer to call the NAS helpline for advice.

Thinking of you,

Coogybear.

There is also a 'sticky' relevant to this topic, at the top of the threads under Diagnosis and Assessment, entitled "Different behaviour between school and home" It was set up in October 2013 by Intenseworld.

The problem with school is the extreme pressure to fit in. It really becomes essential to conform, both to school authority and to his peer group. This is why things get bad in teens when it just gets too difficult to conform.

Home provides a refuge and escape and an opportunity to let go. The pressure that builds up keeping things bottled in at school has to have a release and it comes to the surface at home, away from the presence of his contemporaries. Ironically that means hurting the people who most give him sanctuary and love.

Schools do not understand this enough. Also there is still astonishingly little understanding of living with autism (as distinct from theorising about the Triad of Impairments which is a diagnostic tool not a measuring rod for describing the condition!).

It is appalling that no-one at the school understands it and puts the blame on the parents. But until we start treating autism in terms of how people live with it daily, rather than squandering resources on electrode based/MRI based scans of obscure relationships, help for people on the spectrum is never going to improve.

Our son is now being statemented for special needs school but as i say his behaviour at school brill at home its like walking on egg shells the whole time to make sure he dosnt kick off and go into a full blown fight with me trying to stay calm but being hit slapped punched headbutted spat at ect he had a big one today over the xbox was tryin to sort situation when he flipped i am now coverd in bruises and took 2 hours to calm him down which i ended up bruised and in tears he then apoligised and then was like nothing had happened but i try to explain to school they send me in direction of parenting classes im sick off parentin classes make u feel wee small but his anger is affectin hole family and everyday were walking on egg shells any ideas . But when hes nice hes lovely couldnt help u more c

H.a.m.s wont take him on as he dont fit critere.

Hi rach06,

 You may find my advice on a previous thread helpful then. I suggest you read the whole thread so you can see the links also posted.

community.autism.org.uk/.../29683

As a parent you are entitled to submit a statement about your sons needs yourself for consideration to the LA. I strongly advise you do this.

During the statement process for one of my sons the LA stedfastly, refused to assess his needs. My son was diagnosed with speach and language difficulties, auditory processing difficulties, Dyslexia, Developmental co-ordination difficulties (Fine motor skill issues) and ASD. Even then, the LA felt justified in refusing to assess.

We had to take the LA to Tribunal to appeal that decision. Without our input by way of a written statement, it's unlikely tribunal would have had the full evidence necessary to outline our sons needs, as the School records were patchy at best. The School were also refusing to refer him to various agencies, so we had to get him referered ourselves through our GP. The waiting lists for these agencies were incredably long, so in the meantime we got our son idependantly assessed by an OT, Speach and language therapist, and Ed Psych. These reports were the most detailed as the assessments were done over a longer period of time and often in more depth.

When the motion from Tribunal found in our favour the LA were ordered to assess his needs, which they did, but still refused a statement based on the fact that any support given by the School had not had a chance to be assessed for it's impact.

We then had to go back to tribunal to appeal that decision. The School turned up to tribunal with a single piece of paper with one sentence written on it, for five years of purpoted intervention! This apparently totaled the intervention my son received. ie. Nothing. The tribunal found again in our favour and the LA were ordered to put together a statement with immediate effect. They took considerable time to complete this and when it arrived it wasn't worth the paper it was written on. Full of ambiguous statements that were of no help for my sons needs at all. It was entirely inadequate. We re-wrote the statement completely with IPSEA's support and threatened to appeal again to tribunal. Finally, the LA conceeded and issued a revised statement to cover his needs. More or less verbatum of what the Lawyer at IPSEA had guided us to write. The sad part is, that by the time the statement was issued, My son was in the second year of secondary School and had endured years of lost intervention opotunities, A real Tragedy. 

I'm not trying to scare you or suggesting your LA or School will adopt the same poor policy mine did, or even that you will have to endure the same process of tribunal as the system has changed since September 2015, but in these cash strapped times it seems the directives are all about the money they need to save, with little regard to the wellbeing of the child.

Addtionally, you mention that the School don't see most of the behaviour you witness and have to deal with at home. This means they only have a limited view of his condition and not the whole picture. They will only submit to the LA what they witness at School. If your son is high fuctioning, this may not take any account of executive function or other elements of his condition.

As You and pinkPixie have common ground it maybe and idea to exchange experiences and ideas. I wish i'd known about this forum in my time. Sadly, I endured the trials all alone and frankly, it nearly broke me having to fight such a small minded LA. Others have had much easier experiences, but you do need to be firm on what you need for your child.

Hope I've not upset you with my advice, I just feel it's best to put you in the picture with regard to some of the issues that can occur and as you say, it seems the School are not really on board, which sadly, is a familliar story.

Good luck

Coogy bear

Hes badly stuggleing at school which he is being statememted as we speck and has been advised for a special needs school  day to day is a strugle for him and his brothers and sisters set most his triggers but he cant handle any emotions at all life is hard his own bubble is his bedroom and playing minecraft everything revolves round that even simple conversations x but when he has the outbursts he cant remember them even sitting for 5 mins he has to be bugging someone

Hes been told on the spectrum he has speech annd language impairement disorder also audiology memory disorder social and communication disorder 

My sons behaviour has always been amazing at school, and then he has his meltdowns here with me where it's safe. That's not usually bad parenting. Not in our world anyways. He just tries so hard all day he runs out of steam by the time he gets home x great advice above x 

Hi rach06

NAS have a section on their site devoted to behaviour and are also able to offer advice over the phone I understand.

www.autism.org.uk/challengingbehaviour

I had significant behavior problems with one of my sons and this turned out to be educationally provoked. (Is your son 14 by chance?)

This seems to be the key age when the disparity between what the child can manage and what is expected of him; as he moves up the academic ladder, gets to a critical phase. Although having said that, if he is poorly supported in School it can happen even in primary school.

You are not alone and your senario is one frequently aired here on the forum. School say he's an Angel and well behaved, Home life is a living hell.

The truth is that he's probably had to be contained all day at School and home is actually his safety release valve. It's hard not to take this personally as it feels and often is an assault, but he's probably finding it quite difficult to regulate his emotions and feels easily overwhelmed. The fact that you mention he is stressed first thing is also an indicator that he is anxious about his inpending day

It may pay you to check that the behaviour is not related to any bullying at School, In the first instance. Once you have checked that, then you need to look at startegies to calm and stress triggers that provoke an outburst. Because of the nature of the outbursts, often our gut instinct is to retaliate when such instances occur, but that in itself can escallate things dramatically.

Food triggers can also be at play. Energy dips during the day can provoke sugar cravings and energy drinks or extremely sugary or processed foods can agrevate the situation.

Look at regular excersize also. Swimming is especially good if he is not prone to sensory overload from the achostics often found in public pools. Water is soothing to most and leaves many way calmer. I've also used Moh Doh for my son as a stress reliever and lavender oil at night time to calm.

http://www.mohdoh.co.uk/

My best advice would be to take a multi-pronged approach. trial strategies and if they don't work, tweek them or move onto others.

When my son gave up education it was like someone had flicked a switch. Don't get me wrong, he still have regular outbursts, but nowhere near the magnatude of before.

From what you say; and i'm no expert, you will probably need to teach him to manage his time a little better. Down time is often as important as commited time and should be factored into his day.

Some youngsters are not equiped for the lenth of a School day, yet as a statutory requirement are forced to attend. Things will get better if you access the right support.

I do feel for you, It's a horrible experience I know.

Take care

Coogybear

Welcome to the forum :-)

Do you have a diagnosis? and/or Does your son have a diagnosis?