transport, especially stations & trains

I know some 26 years or so ago I was working on the railway at a small station to say there was a wheelchair user on the way . I wasn't sure how I was meant to get him off the train, luckily there were some of the "Heavy Cleaning Gang" members on the train and they lifted him off, tho coming out of the station was level access, to get his train back later would have involved an encounter with some steps. I advised him that the next station along would have better access.
my former M-I-L used to live in the town I live in back in the 50's, and she stated that there was a barrow crossing across the tracks , I gather with lights station if it was safe to cross, or a phone to the signalman, now the station apart to access to one platform is all via stairs. It seems in some ways catering for those with a  disability has gone backwards. I know these crossings and many staff had gone by the time I joined the railway in 1987. I did see a photo from one of the stations c1910 and there were about 21 staff working a shift!!!!  

I couldn't agree more.

WHen we pushed for service users to be involved in the recruitment of staff..my word the paranoia was rife amongst the staff. You'd think every service user turned into a potential stalker..what an eye opener it was to really see their perceptions laid bare.

We got it through though in the end and even managed to wangle payments for the service users taking part..mainly thanks to having a fantastic and inspiring Director of Mental Health in post. 

Sadly people like him are few and far between on committees or higher up the career ladder. Probably cause they shoot from the hip and their careers grind to a halt on the back of their honesty.

The card system you mentioned sounds really good..it'd work for many disability issues across the board. I hope it works well and is 'put together' so it is intuitive to needs. Who would programme the details into the card? Would it be carers and users..or done remotely due to  a registration process?

The possibilities would be endless if it was handled correctly. I am involved in another forum where they would welcome something like this...maybe it could be developed into an app for a smartphone?..exciting.

Keep us posted longman.

I have now discussed this by phone with London 2012 and there do seem to be mechanisms in place for improvement it is just it seems to depend on service operators taking initiative. The tool I mentioned will apparently by a card with the details stored electronically that can be used every time you need help rather than having to explain each time.

The reason disabled groups don't attend forums is about time and resources versus the ineffectuality of many forums. I was on one for a number of years where most of the discussion was about detailed issues, bin collections or loose paving on residential streets. It never got round to anything about specific disabilities.

My local authority organised two special meetings for the disabled. One was about shared pavements. It was held on an upper floor in a tiny room with little publicity. The lift was too small for one of the wheelchair users to go up with her helper. There were no records kept and we were talked to not listened to. The second was an all day event. Publicity was poor and we were outnumbered by council officials. We weren't listened to even talked down. The afternoon was spent in sessions with council officials and token disabled discussing how good everything is.

Most disability support by local authorities is ineffectual.

I would be interested to know what that is too Longman..let us know if you find out. I have worked in mental health and for training organisations in the past and time and time again we found ourselves as users and professionals fighting the corner for the 'invisible disabilities'..I actually find the word disabled problematic in itself but that's probably my thing (laughs).

It is frustrating in the extreme to hear statements like 'you don't look disabled/ill/etc etc'. Public services need to take a wider view (as you rightly state) as to how big a cross section of society there is out there with needs that are different to what providers perceive as problematic.

I hear often that disabled people don't attend forums or service user groups to help shape services more suitable to their needs. This again is an underlying lack of awareness on the part of the service providers to ensure that people are able to attend. By nature we struggle to get places, find new things stressful..it's not apathy on our part, it's just that it's so flipping hard to navigate the chaotic systems in place.

I am so pleased you are overcoming these issues Longman..they are beyond me..it just got too stressful to keep putting myself/family through it.

I previously posted about London 2012 Olympics (www.london2012.com/accessibletravel ) and I'm still trying to get somewhere over this. In principle, so that spectators and athletes can travel from outside London, comparable facilities should be available on commuter routes and main line services into London. This should bring at least some rail routes up to expected standards for disabled access.

But they still keep talking only in terms of wheelchair access. There seems to be little comprehension of there being other disabilities, so it is not surprising to see the accounts of confusion and lack of support for people who do not outwardly appear disabled. The department for Transport seems to have based its policy on a survey of wheelchair users that only asked about buying tickets and boarding trains. The bit in the middle - getting through the ticket barriers, finding the right platform, and getting to the platform - just isn't part of their thinking.

It is proposed to introduce a national rail passenger access tool to make things easier being introduced next year but I cannot find out what it does that differs from 24 hours in advance notification.

I had similar problems with my son and myself. I have neuro problems of a different nature to ASD but my sensory issues are similar to my sons even if the diagnosis is not the ASD.

My friend booked assistance at the stations where there was a train change. We did this 2 days in advance explaining someone had to take me to the platform where I was to catch my next train.Despite this I wasn't met as arranged and was thrown into complete chaos. I managed to literally grab a member of staff...but my speech was playing up so it was hard work. I finally managed to get the very begrudging person to take me to my platform..he twice tried to just put me infront of the information boards to 'find it yourself on here'. I couldn't process the info or even make sense of the words by this point.

By the time I was put on the platform I was struggling so badly that I went into a daze and still nearly missed the train. I seems that if you 'look' OK, don't have an obvious mobility issue then..well it's tough trying to get things in place (not that I am saying it any easier for other people with disabilities). You do feel you are left to the mercy of some kind soul (and I have been equally rescued and scuppered by Joe Public on more than one red faced, sweaty occasion).

The next attempt I made I booked a seat..managed to find my seat (a challenge in itself) only to find someone else in it and the reservation signs out of order. It was hellish embarrassing trying to explain to the person sitting there and he refused to budge despite me showing him my reservation..a lovely man came to my rescue and 'talked me down'..I was shaking and felt so 'shamed'. I will never do that journey again and I won't take my child on the train unless I am accompanied for the same reasons.

I think services are so over stretched and money so short there is no long term solution..maybe better awareness in the public is our only way forward...but I for one still feel upset that despite all my efforts and planning I can still find myself feeling bad and embarrassed just trying to get from A - B.

Thank you Longman for keeping in there, we do appreciate your huge efforts to raise awareness.

x

as a collee student on the spectrum, i thought id post here to say how taking the bus regularly for 2 years has been for me.

at first, it was tricky, bus's going into weston super mare were fine, but i found it very tricky to read the four digit times on the bus stops and even of which bus stop to go too, i was calling my mum most days to ask for help on what bus id need to get home to clevedon and when the next one would be, because i had no one i knew went back to clevedon. after enough weeks f routine it got easier, and i can handle the bus system alone no problem.

Travel is definitely an issue. I made one train journey with my son, who has ASD, from Manchester to Aberdeen - and haven't made one since, preferring to use the car even though it's rough on me as a driver, wear and tear on the car and more expensive to pay petrol than train fare. I found that it was difficult negotiating some train stations with luggage and a bewildered, acting-up child in tow: Edinburgh Haymarket being a case in point where there were no information stands/screens on the platform, a large flight of steps to negotiate to get to them, only to find that my train was coming in on the platform I had come from. I also found that even upon seeing my son tantruming because he didn't understand why there wasn't a seat for us (as a single mum paying for his ticket when he was young enough not to pay just wasn't an option) on a very full train, the vast majority of people turned a blind eye, assuming I guess that he was just badly-behaved and not stopping to think there might be a medical issue. In the end on that occasion it was a kind-hearted member of the public who worked something out to give us a seat and helped me talk my son down; just as on another occasion after a flight home from Lisbon to Manchester when he was tantruming not coping with the journey and a kind member of the public dealt with my bags for me; not a sign of any help from transport staff at all.

Another angle on this is the Accessibility Transport Strategy for the London 2012 Olympics and Paraplegic Games published May 2008 on the website www.london2012.com (ref ODA 2008/012).  In theory this is supposed to make London easily accessible for all disabled to get to the Games, but from what lozenge describes, and what I've heard elsewhere, this doesn't seem to be materialising that fast. Certainly people on the autistic spectrum don't seem to have been considered.

I had meant to add some of the policy document links, but some of these don't seem available at present. They can mostly be found on the Department for Transport website www.dft.gov.uk/.../access pages, also the Strategic Rail Authority has policy documents. DfT also has a survey carried out in 2008 called "Assessment of Accessibility Standards for Disabled People in Land Based Transport Vehicles (HEL/DFT/061496/RT02 version 2; 7th January 2008). This was carried out by Human Engineering Ltd and Guide Dogs for the Blind, mainly with wheelchair and blind users. It seems to be the main document guiding policy. One of the mysteries in the rail section (5.5. pages 52-57) is there is no mention of automatic ticket barriers, which does make me wonder how representative this study could be.

The whole issue of transport is "gridlocked" - forgive the metaphor. For one thing disability equality action seems to have shifted to bringing actions for disability discrimination, which is beyond most peoples' means. The Department of Transport issues guidelines to transport service providers, but these are fairly toothless. Stations have to meet certain expectations, but mostly it is about the areas outside the automatic barriers being free of obstruction. There's nothing about going through barriers (except that there is a requirement long term to install wheelchair width automatic barriers). There's nothing about life once you are on the platforms.

It is difficult to raise any concerns successfully. Transport services have long deferments for implementation of DDA requirements. For buses it is 2014 for minibuses, 2015 for single deckers and 2017 for double deckers to be wheelchair accessible. But as the bus operators point out low level access buses cannot be used successfully in rural areas if the road surfaces are uneven. Rail service deadlines have been delayed and delayed and some are beyond 2020.

The Rail Service providers always say they are complying, but the Department for Transport is making it easy for them. Intercoms at ticket offices and counters that are wheelchair friendly is all very well if the queue barriers make it difficult for a wheelchair user to queue or manouvre away from the ticket office. There is no joined up thinking.

The worst of it as I say is that the twenty four hour rule is still being used. You can get a disability strategy guide from any rail service provider. All it will offer is help if you give 24 hours notice of intention to travel, same as existed before the DDA came into force. Ask the rail companies any question and they'll respond they'll cross that bridge when they reach the deadline.

There needs to be a campaign for disabled use of transport. Because any meaningful outcomes are now lost in red tape. Passenger Focus now covers rail and bus services, but it has made staff redundant lately and really cannot function. I honestly don't know who is speaking up for the disabled, let alone those of us on the spectrum.

hi,

yes, travel is still an issue.  i'm speaking on behalf of my son, who is 13 - ASD, ADHD, sensory processing difficulties...

train guard does or doesn't speak on the train/underground.  picadilly is ok, but can be crowded (we take it to go to South Kensington where the museums are); Victoria line is well known for being noisy and we think it's too hot too.  Waterloo and city line is a nightmare.  Central line is not great.  I always bring ear defenders.  not ideal, but they lessen the pain, i hope.

i'd love to hear what people suggest...making vehicles wheelchair accessible is feasible (although, hum, the stations you can get on and off at on the underground are few and far between!).  What is it like for blind people? particularly when they get their automatic announcements wrong!

i'm trying to think of practical solutions: never getting any of the announcements wrong seems unrealistic.  giving staff proper training so that they can show understanding of people in difficulty is a MUST.

when you (longman) flag up issues with transport for people on the Autism Spectrum, what do you suggest as possible solutions?

i have a friend who is hearing impaired and interestingly, she flagged up very similar issues to my son, vis a vis noise levels! just not the announcements/ guard thing...

best wishes,

L