Government want to look at disability bank accounts to see what we are spending on: this is not good for us autistic.

Don't EVER stop using cash.

DO NOT ADOPT CBDC's "for the convenience". 

FFS stop using direct debits, and paying "interest" on everything you own! The first takes all control away from you under the guise of helping you manage, and the second is financially speaking like voluntarily submitting to having leeches attached to your financial (metaphorcal) body.

Learn the difference between your annual turnover of money and your net cashflow, and (if you can of course, according to some members and people I meet in real life, some concepts I find obvious and "basic" are too difficult to follow) work out just HOW MUCH of you weekly income directly benefits you and your family.

I think you will all find (as I did) how incredibly unselfish with your money you all are. You literally throw it into the hands of rich strangers at every turn, who in exchange enact rules to further restrict and tax your activities, using those taxes to do what exactly?

Once they get you hooked on digital money, it'll be worth whatever (((they))) say it is on any given day, and your access to it will depend on a dazziling variety of ever changing factors completely outside of YOUR control. And the amount of financial fleas will multiply...

Sorry, I'll keep using direct debits and contactless payments because otherwise I would never remember to pay everything and I abhor touching things too many people have touched.

For me increasingly digital systems are a massive benefit, the less I have to interact with people and physical things to do things the better.

To each their own, the option to have the choice is the happy medium.

I can see your reasoning, and for those people who's income exceeds their expenditure by a moderate amount consistently, and who have enough self control to keep a wary eye on their own consumption and expenditure our modern "conveniences" are wonderful.

As to your last line, providing we have the option to have a choice between cash and digital, that will be fine by me.

Well said 

If I was ever accused of being right wing I'd stand up for myself and my own beliefs.  No one ever accuses me of being right wing though.

There's a lot to unpack there.

Your idea for how we should be governed is unworkable. Even given advances in technology for voting, there would need to be an organisation in place to create policy to be voted on by the public, which would need to be appointed somehow, perhaps by being voted for by the public since their role would be instrumental in advocating policy. There would then be different people, with different stances to select from who wanted that role, which isn't any different from what we have now. Some form of government is unavoidable for a large society. History has proven that over and again, regardless of technology. What that government should look like is the issue.

Perhaps they call your views right wing because they are. If you support a party like the Tories, as you have in other threads, then you are supporting a right wing party. That is unavoidable.

You're painting the middle class as some sort of devious, manipulative cohesive entity that are all out to get you. Can you not see that how you're talking about them is exactly the same as you're accusing them of talking about you? I'll be honest, most of the people I know in the nominal middle class, myself included, aren't that concerned about people from any class more than another, they're more concerned about their daily lives and trying to do the best they can with what they've got. The same as everyone else.

The people who are being manipulative are the press, the politicians, and the prominent people in society, because it's their job to do it and they get paid well for it. Some do it to a larger extent than others so some are more to blame than most. And some walk an exceedingly fine line between truth and lies, fact and fiction, spinning and twisting things to suit their narrative.

Labour's hands aren't clean by any means, but the Tories win the prize for two faced platitudes for the masses. Using everything they can to try to convince the people that they're truly looking out for the best interests of everyone, when that couldn't be furthest from the truth. Look at the COVID debacle, "Let them due" they said behind closed doors whilst giving money for contracts to their mates who then did nothing.

I'll take occasionally misguided socialists over elitist billionaires any day.

i do but even the left wing working class would be accused of being right wing with how they talk and the words they use.... and theyd all be accused of being too thick to be allowed a vote buy so called "left wing" middle classers... which then claim we dont know what socialism is despite the fact they just said working class shouldnt be allowed any political voice because we are too dumb? and yet we dont know what socialism is and they just broke the very core concept of socialism by those words lol

Do you realise that people from all different classes have all different kind of views? There are right wing posh people, right wing middle class people and right wing working class people.  There are also Left wing posh people, left wing middle class people and left wing working class people.

It doesn't seem to me that you understand that.

and what does IQ mean? lol
a person with a so called low iq is probably smarter and more respectable than a arrogant egotistical person with a high iq... and either way no one does those tests anyway. they are not mandated and mass done for you to say that. the IQ thing is often more used by so called right wingers, but it makes no sense because who has done a real recorded iq test? ... a handful of people? ...it cant be used unless it becomes a mandatory recorded thing, like a gcse result. but yeah probably later because gcse results are a bit flawed and probably done too young and not a real indicator themselves which in themselves prove a failure of society to judge intellect.

but either way, another point.. why should we bar people from voting just because we deem them below intelligence? it shouldnt matter, the peoples combined will should form the absolute unified being.... ok what if someone came along and arrested you right now and said your too stupid to be allowed freedom and to make your own decisions so they will arrest you now and make all your decisions for you?

50% of the population have a below average IQ, a fact confirmed by what I witnessed during the independence and brexit referendums.

see there ya go, you call the will of the people as thick and ignorant...

you have already lost to the rich elite then.... as if your people, your working class masses are too thick and ignorant to trust to a direct democracy voting system... then you are saying the only people that should be allowed a vote are the rich elite, the top 1% ... you see how you have been manipulated by them and are in their pocket? like i said they control you without knowing and thats a perfect example of what i was telling you all about right there.

Maybe I’m crazy, but I don’t won’t society to collapse nor do I want its direction to be set by thick ignorant  people who are fed most of their opinions by social media.

how would it?
the people would all get what they want in such a system, they cant complain as they would have majority voted on everything and it would reflect what they want.... if it collapses then they cant complain, because its what they wanted. this system gets rid of the toxic constant complaining about politics... you can no longer complain when you all voted for each thing by majority.... or perhaps people want to just complain about it all the time? lol

Having lived through the independence and brexit referendums, I learned a number of things.

One of the most important is that most people are completely clueless about most things, especially finance and politics.

If we implemented a system of referendums on every issue Britain would turn into something like the US in The Purge series.

I’d be on the first plane out.

im not about proportional representation, im more about the total destruction of the party system and implementing true direct democracy where we vote on each policy.... at one point that would be accused of being madness, but in this world with the tech we have now, we absolutely can achieve that type of system and everyone can casually vote for millions of separate policies. we wont even truly need a government as we know it, just a system that tallies our votes and implements it all how the people wanted. total absolute direct democracy where there is really no government but the people.

and yeah, the middle class capitalists that call themselves socialists often call the working class right wing to disregard our views. then they twist it when it comes to chavs and project if we speak against chavs and claim we are the middle class speaking down to working class when we point out we are fed up of gangs of children with machetes terrorising our neighbourhoods lol so its a funny thing that and we get called right wing and uneducated one way to ignore our views, then on another way we get called classist to ignore our views on violent criminal gangs.... its madness. and it shows its time for the middle class to end too so that this problem is no more, once there is no middle class then there isnt this issue, there isnt this divide then we can be united properly and perhaps fix things... ofcourse then it comes to the upper class, perhaps they dont want that and are the ballancer between it.

although one thing i can say too.... the upper class are always more kind to me than the middle class.... the middle class speak down to me, scoff at me, think they are better and more educated, call me racist, ignore my views, think their views are more relevant, are general unpleasant.... while the upper class they are kinder, but i dunno this kindness perhaps comes to seeing us as a beloved pet and could be patronising lol but i think the upper class hate the middle class more than the working class on this.
the middle class tend to be the supervisors that make our lives hell and treat us badly... the upper class often higher up the chain of command are often sick of the middle class supervisors torturing the working class workers and sympathise with us more... that is my experience of it anyway.

Labour and several other parties are campaigning for proportional representation which would be more inline with what you seem to be suggesting. The Tories aren't.

Labour, the Greens, even the Lib Dems are more socialist in that they all campaign for societal support systems funded through central taxation.

I'm not talking out of my *** on this, I grew up in a trade union household where politics and society were a common and regular discussion topic, studied philosophy at university, including ethics and morality in society, and have a keen interest in political theory. I'd hope that with the amount of emphasis that was placed on critical thinking and analysis during my studies that it would be quite hard to mislead me.

You appear to have a lot of very negative stereotypical views of the middle class and socialists whilst also showing that you don't really know that much about them. The language and tone you use to describe them are remarkably similar to that used by fear-mongering right-wing mouthpieces who use similar rhetoric to whip up discord to distract from the more serious transgressions of their political darlings.

I don't think it's me that's being mislead.

i vote for no party though. they are not democracy neither of them. but the issue is middle class Champaign socialists would appropriate everything by claiming they are socialists when infact they are nothing but ultra capitalist consumers and most of them are actually landlords... while also claiming they are working class, and claiming to speak for us which ruins our voice and our power. they mislead people and even you may be misled by them for all i know if your not truly one of them. they often all flock to labour. so it gives a clear mark against them for me. alot of their followers are just uninformed and misled, they use the media and other means like that to misled and spread false info.

the entire party system needs to be abolished and changed for a direct democracy system so that the true peoples will can be heard and enacted upon no matter whether the loud middle class globalist minority likes our decisions or not. 

ofcourse the party system will never be changed... thats just the reality. we have to accept we have no power and the big bad will always keep the system as bad as they want and we cant change that really so it will always be bad and they will always misled people into enacting their will and turning against one another to stop us realising and noticing them and what they are doing.

I don't think you understand what socialism actually means if you think that. Certainly not since you've been defending the Tories in other threads.

Considering the lower value of a university degree in the current society I'd agree, but education seems to be a key requirement from the definitions I found when I looked it up.

no but it makes me more socialist than any of your remainers claimed to be and sets the class divide and the context lol

also i think theres a wage requirement for middle class, like i dunno 40k upwards?

BeckyThump said:

The general consensus is that you need to be a university educated professional who owns their own home.

I don't agree with regard to the university education.

A teacher by definition is middle class because it's a professional role. The general consensus is that you need to be a university educated professional who owns their own home.

Brexit is a big, stinking mess that I'm not going to touch with a barge pole because we definitely don't agree on it, but calling for the eradication of an entire section of society doesn't put you in the moral high ground, just to be clear.

i dunno it maybe the london middle class or something, or the higher middle class.

but yeah you see them claim to be working class themselves for political points and claim to stand with the poor to look good... but then when it comes to something like... brexit? .... oh, now were all uneducated ignorant racists who are too thick to be allowed a vote and note educated in their fancy schools? lol yeah after brexit i think the middle class should be abolished, i will never forgive them for the things they said and did and spoke down to us like all while claiming to be the good moral kind caring side.

but yeah, i know working class people who get teaching jobs. just because your a teacher doesnt make you middle class anyway so chances are you could actually still be working class... but i do understand how there is even big wealth divides in each class anyway, as i own my own flat now and just in property ownership it kinda makes me feel higher than working class because working class often cant afford to own a home and end up in rental poverty. but despite me thinking my home ownership makes me feel more middle class im still working class and it would likely require quite a bit more to be classed as middle class.... how much more i dont know... but yeah i spoke to a AI chat bot about this one time and that said yeah im just working class still but have attained decent social mobility.... it said i need a better job though and perhaps some stock investments to then be middle class lol 

i dunno it maybe the london middle class or something, or the higher middle class.

but yeah you see them claim to be working class themselves for political points and claim to stand with the poor to look good... but then when it comes to something like... brexit? .... oh, now were all uneducated ignorant racists who are too thick to be allowed a vote and note educated in their fancy schools? lol yeah after brexit i think the middle class should be abolished, i will never forgive them for the things they said and did and spoke down to us like all while claiming to be the good moral kind caring side.

but yeah, i know working class people who get teaching jobs. just because your a teacher doesnt make you middle class anyway so chances are you could actually still be working class... but i do understand how there is even big wealth divides in each class anyway, as i own my own flat now and just in property ownership it kinda makes me feel higher than working class because working class often cant afford to own a home and end up in rental poverty. but despite me thinking my home ownership makes me feel more middle class im still working class and it would likely require quite a bit more to be classed as middle class.... how much more i dont know... but yeah i spoke to a AI chat bot about this one time and that said yeah im just working class still but have attained decent social mobility.... it said i need a better job though and perhaps some stock investments to then be middle class lol 

Of course not.

If you are genuinely nice as well as of high intelligence, the world can be your playground. 

I Sperg said:

138 is just 7 points shy of official genius. You get all the problems and difficulty with down converting to dumb people language, but none of the recognition or opportunity that true genius brings...

i dunno i think most people wont actually understand what anyone means if they tell someone they have a iq of 138, it would go over most peoples heads.... infact it would go over my head too because i simply dont measure intellect that way and each iq test will give you a different result for sure, which means its a flawed measurement anyway and doesnt actually mean anything.

Not everyone is feared and distrusted for being intelligent.  It might feel like that at times and that might be your personal experience.  It's not Pol Pot's Cambodia where we are about to be killed for being intellectuals.

I'm sorry, but putting a Mensa sticker in the back of your Mini Metro car is the most attractive thing you could ever do to the wrong sort of person, perhaps a "jerk" on a motorcycle such as myself back in the nineteen eighties...

If you guys are pulling the bigger numbers, my recommendation (and practice) FWIW based on over a half century of knowing my own number is; "keep it to yourselves". 

138 is just 7 points shy of official genius. You get all the problems and difficulty with down converting to dumb people language, but none of the recognition or opportunity that true genius brings...

Those 121 people in the other thread are close enough to Joe Normal to be able to be unnoticed down the pub and take advantage of their gifts unnoticed but YOU stick out just enough to be feared and distrusted.. 

But all those problems must pale into insignificance on the some motorcyclist pulls you over to a stop, gets you to wind down your window and before riding off laughing maniacallly looks down and asks you with a deadpan expression:

"If you are in mensa and that's the intelligent peoples association, how come you drive such a *** car??"

The test I did had elements of arithmetic but no maths as such. It did have

• working memory tests where you have to repeat increasingly long string of digits, then repeat them backwards then repeat them in numerical order
• various shape manipulation tasks to test if you could rotate shapes in two and three dimensions in your head or construct a shape in a picture using a set of tiles (while timed)
• write a very long string of abstract symbols using a mapping from numbers and letters to those symbols
• explain why groups of words were similar or different 
• a short general knowledge test (I freaked her out by getting them all correct. Two of the questions were what’s the circumference of the Earth and how long does it take light to reach the Earth from the sun. I answered both exactly. She said they usually have a tolerance of 25% error. I then pointed out that astronomy is one of my special interests).

There was more but I can’t remember it all. It took about two hours.

*Dances*

maths is too big a element in them... most iq tests just seem to be purely maths tests... but not basic maths, super complicated all over the place maths questions.... if i see a maths question in anything id just rip the entire paper up and leave.

basic working maths though i can do as i worked on a old fashioned till that doesnt do any calculating for you so i had to do the quick maths there and then to calculate the change in my head myself while having no gaps in serving the customer. but iq maths tests are unrealistic and not used in the real world anyway.

I now have the Bee Gees playing in the back of my head

I am also concerned with staying alive. Funnily enough.

I have an IQ of 133 and you are probably smarter than me.

Bless. That's a  nice comment  

We will never know the answer. 

Our priorities change as we get older anyway.

I am less concerned nowadays with IQ than with staying alive!

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=I_izvAbhExY

I have an IQ of 133 and you are probably smarter than me.

Amerantin (former member) said:

My “full scale IQ” was 138 which they said was greater than 98% of the population.

Out of a max of 155 that's impressive.

I did just find that test online and started it but I got to about question 10 and realised there were another 50 and am too tired.

Also, I wondered if I was doing it under the correct conditions.

Thanks for all this.

Food for thought.

I tried a few online IQ tests before my assessment but they were all 20-30 questions and took minutes. The Wechsler test took nearly two hours and parts of it were timed so I think you’d only be able to get it if it was administered by a psychologist.

It also has a maximum IQ score of 155 so I’m not sure how it relates to tests that tell us people like Newton had IQs of 180 or whatever.

All my numbers were higher than expected with the exception of processing speed for which I got 114, which is still above average I suppose. My “full scale IQ” was 138 which they said was greater than 98% of the population.

I have since tried the Mensa sample tests and got a much higher score <shrugs>

Amerantin (former member) said:

One of the common characteristics of autistic people is a spiky profile - so for example you might be mathematically gifted but have terrible verbal comprehension. This test is apparently quite good at revealing these gifts and deficits.

If that's available online I may take a look.

I was with my autistic friend the other day who told me that he only did a test once, 40 years ago, and has an IQ of 150.

He also told me that he perceives me as highly intelligent - however, I don't think that would show on an ordinary IQ test and, in fact, I find the evaluation of my own intelligence impossible as I am not a high achiever either academically or career wise.

Also, he is mathematically gifted and doesn't have the best verbal comprehension.

You have me intrigued.

The test they did on me was called the Wechsler adult intelligence scale and as well as an overall IQ figure you get other numbers for things like vocabulary, arithmetic, working memory, visual processing and processing speed.

One of the common characteristics of autistic people is a spiky profile - so for example you might be mathematically gifted but have terrible verbal comprehension. This test is apparently quite good at revealing these gifts and deficits.

Amerantin (former member) said:

To rule out any kind of learning or intellectual disability which might otherwise explain my problems, apparently.

Ah. I see.

So not to see if you have a high IQ, but rather to check you don't have a low one.

IQ tests are something that bother me actually.

I think I have dyscalculia and maths is an element of them.

I've tried to do one or two but anything involving figures foxes me.

To rule out any kind of learning or intellectual disability which might otherwise explain my problems, apparently.

Amerantin (former member) said:

I had to do one as part of my autism assessment.

Why?

I'm really surprised by this

im not sure, the company i work at we had a vote on wages as we always do, just a yes no as to accept, ofcourse everyone just selects yes and accepts the very first offer because no one understands what they are voting for and they just see it as vote yes for more money lol mostly all dont speak english... so they dont understand.

but anyway, being a analytical thinker type i took like 30 minutes or so thinking and questioning the union guy and running the figures before i voted lol it turns out just to raise our lowest wage by 10p per hour it would cost the company overall 10 million per year.... and the company only makes around 50 million profit per year. so just 10p extra a hour on our lowest wages wipes out 10 million a year.... 50p extra a hour would mean no profit at all. ofcourse there could be alot in their spending they can cut and it could have been a trick.... either way i said they can do better and voted no because i dont like them anyway lol but it shows things are run close to the bone most of the time.

Yeah but those who live at the edge of the IQ  bellcurve tend to lack EQ so it all evens out...

Unless you believe that having a higher intelligence automatically elevates one, over other people.

That Idea of course is pure racism amongst it's other failures, based on even the most cursory viewing of the IQ statistics by country...