Published on 12, July, 2020
Looking back over my childhood and considering various experiences within my wider family, I can trace not only what I believe to be the "path of autism" but also a fair amount of poverty, to varying degrees.
Now I'm not suggesting that there's a straightforward link between autism and poverty - certainly I can see many positives to my neurodivergent mind which have enabled me to make a fair living over the years - but the patterns do seem intertwined. I can see lots of issues with anxiety, depression and addiction too but increasingly I suspect these might be related to undiagnosed (and therefore unsupported) autism. The patterns seem to involve difficulties in the workplace (choosing and staying in jobs), education (especially higher education where independence and social factors seems to become increasingly important), accessing healthcare and applying for benefits (a stressful process in itself).
During my teenage years in particular, we went through a lot of poverty and our living conditions were quite poor, to the extent that we didn't dare invite people round and our social isolation became ever worse. Dad did what work he could, but was trapped in a low paying job and neither of my parents had much knowledge of the benefits system (I was quite shocked recently when my now elderly mother said that we probably could have claimed something to help).
And going back a generation, my grandmother's house was something of a disaster. No housework ever done, not much with which to do it, no repairs carried out, not much washing, a LOT of hoarding, alcohol consumption and gambling. It was like that with my uncles too, although they were very intelligent people and obviously quite talented in many ways.
Is this all necessarily to do with autism? Probably not. But I'm suspicious. Especially now that my sons are having major difficulties making their way in the world and a lot of our money seems to go on false starts in education and work. There's some good stuff in there too no doubt, but I'm worried.
Any thoughts?
Are we talking of just financial poverty here, or all flavours? I.e emotional, psychological self
I was thinking specifically about financial poverty in my original post but I also feel these can be strongly interlinked.
During my teenage years, for example, our poverty impinged on just about everything else. If, for example, you'd like to go on a school trip but there's no money for that, then you simply can't go. Likewise, any extracurricular activities or family times away from the home. Plus, if the home is in an atrocious state of filth and disrepair, you probably won't be inviting friends home either. And you'll be reluctant to accept others' invitations, knowing you can't return the hospitality. This all impacts on you psychologically, particularly if you're already finding it difficult to connect with others and make friends.
There was no shortage of love in my family home, so in a way many might compare and see me as having enjoyed great wealth. But I can remember feeling as a teenager that nobody should have to put up with this level of poverty and I wanted to involve social services (whilst not, of course, knowing how to go about this). It was a huge puzzle to me as well as a source of considerable distress - along the lines of, well, if I'm so loved why am I denied basic necessities and effectively excluded from most activities?
Now, as an adult, I can honestly say that my psychology has been deeply affected by this. I don't think of myself as poor, psychologically speaking. In fact I have a rich inner life. However, there are clear areas of damage that have had a long term effect.
As it stands, I find that when my finances are secure I feel buffered in the world, I can buy myself out of some difficult situations, my confidence levels increase and my general relationship with the world and other people is altered. It definitely has an impact on my sense of self.
Totally agree, when financially secure, it's much easier to have self-esteem and to feel a sense of security and wellbeing. I had the inverse of your childhood 'balance' - my father came from poverty but we were 'petty bourgeouis' (he went to night school) and the home was orderly and comfortable if shabby - but I didn't feel loved, on the contrary. I was made to feel like some sort of monstrous embarrassment and disruptive burden on my parents. I went to a posh grammar school and was bullied by teachers and other girls alike, I've never been able to separate to what extent I was bullied for AS or for being lower-class. I always thought that being loved and accepted was far more important than material things but I also see how pulverising it is to be socially excluded because you can't afford restaurants etc and to have people look down their noses at your home, and to get sneered at because you don't know 'the form' - and the incredible value of being able to 'buy yourself out' of practical/emotional crises. Poverty is relative, as they say. If everyone lives in a mud hut that's just normal.
It's impossible to separate the emotional fallout from the grinding pressure of insecurity when it comes to poverty. But as long as you have food and a warm place to sleep, it's really all about whether you can relax in a basic sense of security (will there be food and shelter tomorrow?) and of social pressures/casual bullying.
Some people will have an easier time than others in some areas of their lives but then they may struggle in areas where others may have an easier time. Some will win running races without any legs while some with perfectly good legs won't even walk to the shop. It's all a matter of how we see the world and our beliefs.
I agree - there's plenty of evidence of seemingly happy and successful people struggling in private. But I do also think that some people do have an easier time of things than others.
I'd be prepared to consider that nobody is ever prepared to thrive in the world. Some people can appear to thrive in the world but that's down to our perceptions. It's like when you walk down the street and see people smiling happily, having a laugh, holding hands with their partners & family. It all comes together to conjure up an image of a happy family who are enjoying life, which from that starting point we make assumptions about their lives and lifestyles. It's so easy to create these false images of others, which we create in our own minds, which then fuels our own problems of how we see ourselves in comparison to what we've just created in our minds of how wonderful the lives of others must be. We don't actually know what's going on with the lives of others.
Are the people we label as thriving and successful really thriving and successful?
Maybe there are those who don't consider themselves as having been equipped to thrive in life as they may have their own bad experiences, their own mental health issues, etc. Yet, maybe they're just more adept at covering such things up in the way that photoshopping images of models in fashion magazines, which presents a false image of some models, helps fuel issues around people feeling depressed over their body image as they compare their own bodies to these images.
People try too hard to strive for perfection as we are bombarded by so many messages from the environment around us that we should strive to be this or that or whatever it is that defines the expectations of what it is we should be. I'm certainly not perfect and I never will be.
I 100% agree with this sentiment. It's not our fault but we still have to find a way to learn to live in this world and that's certainly not always an easy task, especially when we have to find our own way of coping by going through a lot of bad experiences without adequate support to help prepare us.
Exactly. It's totally horrible and I don't want it in my mind. It kind of pops up when I'm feeling particularly low so it's in there somewhere unfortunately. :(
I'm finding it easier to feel more compassion towards my parents lately so I'm hoping such thoughts will retreat. I guess it's born of resentment at not feeling equipped to thrive in the world. However, there are so many areas in which I wouldn't want to thrive anyway and others to which I can happily migrate. I'm hoping my forays into the literature on neurodiversity will foster that and also that this has a knock on effect on what I'm able to offer my sons.
Oh no! Don't think that, if you can find a way to think compassionately about your parents' situation you'll find it easier to let up on yourself? We don't make the world, most of the AS people I know are kindly and tolerant, honest, decent. What's wrong with that? Your sons just need to know you value them as they are and they'll find a way of coping in a world which is often mean, intolerant, and mendacious. It's not our fault!
It's difficult. Logically I can recognise the limits to my own responsibility. I might even draw out a responsibility pie chart demonstrating that it's not all down to me.
But my emotional brain is acting as though I have been handed a poisoned chalice and then unwittingly passed it on to my sons. Just horrible.
I think I get it, I've felt so much resentment myself - strangely the diagnosis is really helping me with it though. I think cessation of the nagging doubt that it's all my own fault somehow lessens feelings of anger and resentment - I wonder if the sharpest pain is from internalising the bullying and blaming ourselves. You're not responsible for how distressed your sons are and I'm sure they'll come through it as you have. I'm so sorry you're dealing with so much - the world's retribution for failing to groupthink seems really disproportionate doesn't it?
I couldn’t agree more. I burst out laughing when I realised I had been basing my whole life on the hidden belief that I’m not good enough! I started dancing round the house saying, not good enough for what? To be a ballerina? To be a footballer? To be a doctor? What exactly was I not good enough for! Lol! I then found out that this is the bottom line for many people and many people don’t ever realise it, so they go on building their life on the subconscious belief that they’re not good enough.
Now I go more on, am I at ease with what I’m doing? Am I enjoying what I’m doing? If this was my last day on earth would I be doing what I’m about to do now or today? Do I feel joyful, alive, happy, content etc etc.
As you said, it’s a never ending journey so we might as well enjoy it. I pay no heed to social norms or what other people do or don’t do or their thoughts about me are or aren’t etc etc and I’m not bogged down with the thoughts of others through tv and films and music etc. I live my life according to me and I learn as I go.
Well, thank you for that. Like everyone else here I am also in a continuous process of learning. Over my life I have come to realise how I have also become my own obstacle at times. I think the hardest thing for me to start to learn throughout my life was to stop focusing on one single thing at the detriment to other things because we have various needs in life, which can be both hard to achieve at times as well as finding a balance between those needs so that we can find a sense of fulfilment in life. I suppose that's why I feel like many people can be restricted by these barriers they place on themselves when those barriers don't actually need to exist in the first place.
A good example for me was the belief that my life had no value and the only value I could find in life was through work, the only way to find success was through work. So now I am seeking to re-evaluate my meaning and value in life, which is an ongoing process.
Life is simply a journey without an end, so instead of trying to focus on an end so to speak just try your best to live the journey with whatever challenges may come along. There will be challenges that you can deal with and others you can't but no matter what the journey will always continue even if you have to walk a different path than the one you were expecting to walk along.
We get out of life what we focus on most. So if we focus on not being poor, we will end up poor because our focus was on poverty and not on abundance.
And I know how you feel about wanting to provide for your family. That's the very thing that has driven me. So of course, I got what I focused on, a need to provide for my family!!!
Now I understand that. I can take a different approach. I will however always give whatever I have, to give my parents a better life. See, talking is good. I am uncovering many hidden limiting beliefs in me, although most people, if they read this, probably won't know what I'm talking about. But I do so thank you ShadowPhantom, by sharing your experience you have helped me uncover a few false limiting beliefs in me.
It's not always due to a lack of not knowing what we want or being committed to that want, that prevents us from getting what we want. It's also these hidden road blocks that have to be uncovered so they're out of the way. Thank you
I can agree with that.
My father did have wealth but when I was extremely young my father was basically stabbed in the back (metaphorically speaking, not literally) by the people he was working with so he lost everything. Like you say, poverty is relative, so if someone feels superior because they're richer than someone else it can lead to bullying behaviour. I had to live with many children insulting and bullying me while insulting my family too for their poverty. My father didn't choose for those he worked with to do what they did but he had to live with the consequences.
Combined with the moving from home to home and school to school with my parents struggling to afford things, it led to me feeling like life was insecure and unstable. Therefore, this fuelled me to see that getting educated, getting a career and getting a decent job would get me out of that. I wouldn't get bullied for being poor, I would get recognised for what I was capable of rather than just being seen as poor, I would have the money for stability and security in my life as well as being able to demonstrate that hard work and ability would pull me out of the poverty trap. I could then help my parents because I feel like I can never repay them enough for what they've done for me throughout my life.
I came from a background where love and family were considered extremely important so I was raised with those values. Of course my parents weren't perfect but I don't think any parent can be perfect. They tried their best, which often meant that my sister and I weren't always the first priority. I have a lot of admiration and respect for my parents though considering what they went through as well as how they managed to keep going no matter how bad things were all to be able to earn enough money to survive. It also did give me trauma in a way, because as someone who was more prone to mental health issues, I saw myself as a burden and often thought that maybe if I hadn't been there then maybe that could have helped make a difference to their lives.
I also think that due to my behaviour, which our family didn't know about, my mother became very over protective of me, while my father (who isn't diagnosed but my sister and I do believe he has autism) was always angry and often venting on those around him, which only made me feel worse about myself. So, as I say, my parents weren't perfect but all my experiences came together to make me say to myself "I will not follow in the footsteps of my parents. This will not be my life." Yet here I am still completely reliant on my family to help me given my current circumstances.
I'm the opposite. I absolutely love it when I don't have much money. And it always seems to happen at a time when I don't actually need much.
For example, for the last two years, I've been living on benefits, which started in debt, so I rarely have enough money to buy food and rarely, in fact I never have enough money to meet my full financial commitments and I pay nothing towards the debts.
It's so freeing. So empowering (to me), probably because I'm so s**t with money. Honestly, it doesn't matter how much I earn, in fact, the more I earn the worse I am at 'managing' it, so no matter how much I earn, I never seem to get the life that other people have ~ I must have thought that those things, homes, cars, holidays etc, were brought to you in the night by the elves, at the end of each pay cheque and they somehow forgot to drop mine off!
So having less money, to me, is a relief. I'm not saying I will always live off benefits, on the contrary. But I need to find a way to earn money in a way that enhances my life and this time, I will get help with managing my money. I've already got more awareness around it, since I got my diagnosis. And having no money has really helped with this.
Also, I've never put my idea of security in money, people, jobs or houses or any of those things. I could never understand why people did that. I used to think, and sometimes I would even ask them, what if there were no jobs or your house got destroyed or the people die or whatever - what happens to your security then? It seemed crazy to me to put your faith in such things. So I don't define myself in any way by the amount of money I have or don't have or the amount of things that I have or don't have etc and I always seem to have what I need, even if it's not what I thought I needed.
I live in a constant state of gratitude, due to having very little money. Gratitude that I live in a country that at least keeps a roof over my head while I'm in this burnout. But if it never, then my freedom simply goes to the next level and I become homeless, or sleeping rough, as I prefer to say because the whole earth is our home and you have more freedom when you don't have an actual home. I've lived rough a couple of times. You simply accept that that is where you're at and like anything else, you make an adventure out of it ~ don't you? I do.
I like going to restaurants to eat because it's a change of environment and it means I don't have to sort the food out. But when I don't have the funds to go then I simply don't have the funds to go. I don't give it any more meaning, such as, this means I'm poor. And when I don't have food to eat, I fast. I recently did a ten day fast and I swear to god I've been thanking god ever since for making sure I had no food because I certainly needed to be forced into that fast. I had got out of the habit and doing it made me realise how much I needed it.
Christmas is even more special when you have no money or energy to put up any decorations or cards. You are forced to acknowledge what's really going on. The spirit of Christmas. It's so stress free, exciting, childlike, and the chocolates and treats are extra special after being without them for quite a while.
I even got a fray bentos pie in the bags of food I got from the food bank. It's something I would never buy but something that holds good memories for me. So I can't tell you how much I enjoyed that pie. And I'm a raw vegan! Lol!
The Christmas spirit is alive and well. It's just that when we're busy buying presents etc, we don't notice it. So being in the position of not having the money and energy etc to get involved and do what others are doing, I was able to really get to experience the Christmas spirit, which taught me so much this year.
I love trees so I'm in raptures at Christmas and I like to get the biggest and best real Christmas tree that I can find. I spend hours just looking at it, enjoying it and missing it when it's gone. But I haven't had a tree for the past few years due to me focussing on getting my life together and it hasn't lessened my enjoyment of Christmas one bit. And it doesn't mean I'm poor. It's just what it is. The trees never gave me pleasure, I got pleasure from looking at them, but the pleasure was always in me and doesn't disappear just because I don't have a Christmas tree.
I agree that a steady flow of income can make life much easier in many ways but I would be seriously worried about myself if I felt I was deriving my sense of self esteem, wellbeing and security on how much money I had coming in each week. But then again, like I said, I lean more towards a simple, minimalist life and by living without money, it doesn't get much simpler and it's enabled me to concentrate on myself, to find ways of supporting myself financially in a way that doesn't burn me out and that more importantly, enhances my life.
I wouldn't mind somebody looking down their nose at my home. It would give me an opportunity to pray for them because it must be terrible to live your life, thinking you're better than people while not doing anything to help them and often times, trying to make life even worse for them. They are the type of people who need our love and understanding the most. They're living under a terrible illusion, believing that having what they consider a 'better' house than somebody else, somehow makes them a better person with unquestionable rights to treat that person any way they want. They've lost touch with who they are and seriously believe that the size of their house makes them who they are. They need our love, understanding and compassion.
So if they look down their nose at my house, hopefully that will mean they won't come to it, because there's one thing praying for them but to have them in your sacred space would be another thing altogether! Lol! If I'm going to share my space, I'd rather it be with someone who's more like me, who doesn't judge a person by what they have!
So to me, poverty is a mindset. So once I've got my mind around all this earning a living business, and I've found a way how to do it in a way that doesn't drain me but gives me joy, then I will have more money. I've already decided how much I'll have, it's just a matter of bringing it alive now and with all the support I've had this year, I think by the end of next year, I'll be getting somewhere.
Yes, it'd be impossible to separate out the strands. And, because my husband had similar experiences to yours, I know the true value of feeling loved and wanted. This was never in any doubt in our home. So I appreciate what you're saying about love and acceptance. I have a certain soundness in my core being that I think arises from having been able to take these for granted from my earliest days.
But relating it all specifically to autism, our family poverty grew largely from our parents' inability to navigate the world, to relate to others and to hold down a job which would afford a basic level of comfort. I'm not saying that much of this wasn't caused by a general lack of acceptance and inclusion in the workplace and within society, and it clearly doesn't need to be this way. But practical know-how was in short supply in our family and, combined with social difficulties, our earning power was very much reduced. Especially considering that none of us had been diagnosed and so we didn't recognise the nature of our difficulties. Generally we just got blamed for it.
At home our furniture was dirty and fraying, the lino and worn out carpet were missing in places, the bathroom was full of green and black mould in summer and ice in winter and the kitchen was falling apart and, like the rest of the house, filthy. Some of this was due to a lack of money to spend on cleaning products, some due to my dad's problems with personal hygiene, hoarding and organising things while my mother eventually gave up. The one time I really tidied up and invited a friend round, she was visible shocked and later gave me some of her pocket money to help.
I wouldn't have been bothered if I'd live in the same kind of "mud hut" as everyone else - it is indeed relative. But I felt as though our family were somehow peculiar in their poverty, not only incapable of earning a proper living but incapable of using the benefits system or relying on friends or family too ("Friends, what friends?"). It all had a shameful, secretive feel to it. I can once remember our cousins turning up unexpectedly and us all hiding behind the table so's we wouldn't have to invite them in and they wouldn't see the squalor in which we lived.
Meanwhile, both of my parents were very intelligent and articulate people and it became very difficult for others who did eventually cotton on to actually understand, as if we must be deliberately choosing all of this.
I also remember being in the dinner queue at school and the girl in front of me looking at the free lunch list and then looking back at me and saying, "Your name's on there. I think they've made a mistake so you need to tell them about it." "No mistake" I said. And her reply was, "But you're intelligent so you can't be on that list!"
In many ways I wonder whether the poverty/high education combination was more generally puzzling to those who noticed our family. And for me it was also linked with great difficult in feeling accepted at school or knowing where I might belong. I got put in a top set with others who could afford the nice version of the school uniform, the school trips and the extra magazine subscriptions (they bullied me in subtle ways), but our household finances were more akin to those of the extremely rough bottom set kids (who spat on me or pushed me against the walls in the toilets).
Just a bit more money and a few family connections/friends would have made a huge difference and I suppose my sense of insecurity might have been reduced.
At the moment it's increasing again as costs associated with uncompleted college and university courses build up, plus our younger son refuses to engage with services so the necessary evidence for his ESA claim won't be there the next time one of those little brown DWP envelopes lands. It's all has that feel of history repeating itself.