Supermarket annoyance.

I ordered pasta from Amazon last night. It will arrive on Wednesday.

Yes, things seem to have eased here, too. In fact, the local Aldi was the quietest I've ever seen it when I popped in this afternoon. The only things which they were short of were loo-roll and sanitisers (no suprise there!), but I got everything else that I'd normally buy without any difficulty.

They've also changed their opening hours a bit and rationed the most in-demand items, and I have to say, have also done a good job of putting up some useful information about the reasoning behind their response and encouraging sensible shopping by customers.

As I predicted, the panic buying is almost over, today the same place was three quarters full of goods.

Go vegan, lol not had too much issues finding food.

I haven't set foot in a supermarket for years, I get severe migraines under artificial lighting and don't like busy places.

So I rely solely on deliveries from supermarkets to get my supplies. However, now everyone is panicking and all the supermarkets near me are fully booked for 2 weeks. So i have no way of getting anything. 

 I first emailed asda customer services and got an automated reply saying they are too busy and won't be reading or replying to any emails. Next I emailed sainsburys and got no reply as of yet. 

 The supermarkets are doing something to help but they're ignoring the vulnerable people who can't get to the shops. I'm lucky i have a mum who is willing to hunt the various shops for things I need, but I'm sad and afraid for those who have no one around and can't get out. 

I guess it's hard for the stores because they won't have anything like this. But unfortunately I can't eat my empathy. 

Sending love and I hope it gets easier for you soon 

I said nothing about "shouting", nor indicated that I directed my mumblings at anyone in particular (which I would not have the social confidence to do in any case). I doubt that I said anything loud enough for anyone to hear the actual words at all. In fact, I find it incredibly hard to raise my voice even when I need to, as I have conditioned myself to be extremely quiet most of the time (in part because chronic insomnia means that I'm often up and about when others are trying to sleep).

Why are people jumping to the conclusion that I don't realise it would be rude? I have already made quite clear that I found my reaction embarrassing and inapproriate. If anything, I am usually known for being excessively polite and formal in my use of language, and rarely use profanity. More generally, I try to judge people people by their intent, insofar as I'm able to judge it, rather than their ideolect - there are plenty of nasty people in the world who hide behind superficial politeness, and many kind people who curse rather more than I do.

Self-narration is a behaviour which I have encountered in many people with ASD and ADHD; and like myself, many seem to find that it helps them to overcome executive function impairments. I have also spoken with many who report finding it difficult to determine whether they are thinking only using their "internal voice" or are vocalising (not unique to autism, of course). Echolalia is also extremely common among autistic people, which may even include the echoing of profanity (as may also be true of the tics of Tourette's Syndrome).

The "evidence" so far as I'm concerned is that I have personally spoken with many autistic people who report these behaviours, and who expend considerable mental energy trying to suppress them, as they also do their stimming etc. The formal study of autism fascinates me and I take a great interest in it - enough of an interest to know that it is woefully behind the "cultural knowledge" of the autism community, and has a long history of biases and misrepresentation. Thankfully, that has begun to improve in recent decades, but there is still a long way to go. If there is any research into this aspect of executive functioning, I would be glad to hear of it myself. Absence of evidence is not the same as evidence of absence, as the old saying goes, and the sheer diversity of autism makes generalising problematic, no matter how large research cohorts might be.

The thread is on the theme of "annoyance", and I gave one small example of when such annoyance has leaked out and I mumbled something, and only realised that I had done so when I noticed a reaction from someone nearby. I have had the same reaction when I have inadvertently started self-narrating myself through tasks in the workplace, or when I'm ruminating while out and about generally, when my self-talk has nothing whatsoever to do with the behaviour of the people around me.

I am glad to hear that you are a kind, considerate person, but I don't consider it helpful to people with neurological conditions to reinforce the stereotype that talking to oneself should be taken as an indication that the self-talker is a crazy person who should be avoided, or the all too common assumption which people make that the subject of such talk is always them.

Frankly, I find it rather ironic that I have attracted so much criticism from people who could easily be read as "virtue signalling" their own compassion, yet who seem quick to jump to conclusions and cast aspertions about my character and social background based on one isolated example (albeit I accept that you apologised in advance for possibly having done so). Surely it would also be compassionate to understand that people sometimes say things which they do not really mean when they are under considerable stress and their resources for self-control have been exhausted.

That's really nice to hear

I'm finding the supermarkets tricky too - I got really bad sensory overload in Asda earlier this week. It was so busy and chaotic, I couldn't find the essentials I needed, and it was really stressful. I did notice a few days ago that Lidl seemed to have more stock and was quieter than other shops. I've also found local corner shops quieter and less stressful, even if they don't have the same range of stock. I'm currently self-isolating and doing okay (thankfully, I managed to find the stuff I needed before I had to self-isolate), but I'm having to find ways to manage my anxiety due to all the uncertainty at the moment. I think supermarkets could help by putting limits on the number of items people buy, apart from where there are extenuating circumstances (e.g. where people are shopping for both themselves and a vulnerable relative) - not sure how you'd prove those circumstances though. I think the staff on the ground are doing an amazing job, but the companies could do with finding ways to make the shops a calmer environment and prevent stockpiling.

While I'm at home, I'm just finding ways to keep myself busy, as well as putting time aside to relax. Hope you're doing okay and that things improve over time.

In the town where I grew up in the food based market stalls, as well as the butchers and bakers, are still opening and are much calmer places to shop in than large supermarkets.

There have also been posts appearing on my local FB about small shops e.g bakers who are open and who are now doing deliveries, esp for self-isolators.

I'm an autistic and am currently studying a PhD in autism behaviour and haven't heard that shouting negative comments out loud in stressful situations as part of the diagnostic criteria. I've tried Googling it but nothing came up, therefore, could you point me to the evidence for this? Or let me know what this is if I have the wrong end of the stick.

Have you considered that your behaviour may be more to do with your socialisation than your neurotype? I grew up in a working class culture where it was normal behaviour to say negative comments loudly in stressful situations. There were a lot of people like this when I was in Tesco at 6am the other day. I always new this behaviour was wrong and had an awareness that you become like the people you spend time with. I moved away from this culture and distance myself from those that are like this, such as the step father in law. Instead I fill my life with those who are open-minded and kind. This means that unlike the peers that I grew up with, who I've seen demonstrate this behaviour, I do not say rude comments aloud to strangers when I'm stressed or anxious - even when it is really hard, like when I was in Tesco hell last week.

Has anyone tried grocery shopping on amazon etc?

Seems problem is supermarkets getting things from warehouse to shelf faster then customers emptying shelf. Big online vendors can bypass this problem. I don't like recommending amazon because of issue with their business practices, but in this case it could really help.

Its ridiculous as shops in our area are closing at mid day as theres nothing left in store! We only live in a small town! I thing the shops should do click and collect or online only at the moment and limit sales. I get angry that I see people buying just to sell on. Hand soap was going for 8 pounds on ebay. Their cockroaches in my opinion. I picked up calpol for someone as they didnt have any for their baby as people are buying to sell! Baby milk and nappies are other items that are hard to come by!

I got very down last night. I usually do my shop late at night. My first shop for a week- so much changed. Nothing on the shelves. I live very simply. Frozen foods and fresh foods, never any canned really. I thought I'd be ok but there was nothing. I'll not queue in the day time and hope very soon it will settle down. 

I believe and hope that the situation will settle down, now that most people have done their panic buying and stocked up for a siege.  They will have no more storage space at home to put things. So when the supermarkets eventually restock,  the stock will last longer.

At the moment it's madness. 

Yesterday's local Aldi's fresh meat and bacon counter.

I think you are thinking too much about yourself saying things like all 24 hour stores should be closed down and opened at 9am with the first 2 hours only for the minority. What about the people that work night shifts, and people who start work early would not be able to get in to buy their lunch in the morning. Supermarkets are a business not a charity for the few and this would make it highly inconvenient for the majority of the population

The current situation is unheard of but the solution is quite simple, if you desperately need a high demand item then you need to go (or have someone else go for you) when that store opens first thing in the morning or order it online. I have never been in a situation in any supermarket that I've had enough time to play games in the queue. I understand that the busyness can be overwhelming but find that in non-panick buying circumstances that there are quiet periods such as in the evening where the shopping experience is much more relaxed without the need for designated times barring other people just because they don't have a label

• I qualified my statement with "less than charitable" in recognition of the fact that I had later reflected upon my thoughts and found them wanting. If I didn't perceive such behaviour as rude, I would not have driven myself to burn-out so many times in my life by masking.
• I was describing an emotive reaction to a situation which I find just as stressful as you have described, not a rationalised belief about any particular individual who may have provoked that reaction.
• Self-talking is an irresistable autistic trait for me, which requires immense amounts of self-control to keep in check. When under stress, I am simply not always able to do this, and it has caused much embarassment throughout my life.
• Some autistic people's expression of their traits may indeed upset other people, whether those people are autistic or not. This is unfortunate but sometimes unavoidable. I do sympathise with how upsetting you might find my reaction were it to seem directed at you, but I may have no greater ability to control my reaction than you would yours, and I would do my utmost to put things right were it to happen.
• I was not describing mere annoyance at someone taking a little more than usual, but the prevalence of people filling entire trollies with the same few products. Certainly, I cannot say why any individual might do this, but the phenomenon is too widespread for this to be explained by all of those people having disabilities. I stand by my statement that selfish stock-piling should be discouraged, albeit that the reaction I described is certainly not the most appropriate way to do this (granted, I should probably have made this much clearer than I did).

I certainly agree with you in principle. But my emotive reactions when under duress are what they are, and I'm no more able to control them than anyone else is. I sometimes cannot help expressing them before having the opportunity to mediate them with self-reflection, which is a necessary component of compassion for any person. It is not uncommon that I am racked with guilt or embarrassment when my behaviour does not meet my own expectations.

Accusing an autistic person of "lack of compassion" because of an honest description of their traits when highly stressed may also be extremely hurtful to that person. Advice regarding how best to get along in the world is certainly most welcome, but your post strays perilously close to "thought policing", IMHO, albeit that I unconditionally accept that this was with the best of intentions.

As to whether I am compassionate or not. I post here often enough that I am happy for other members to judge that for themselves!

Hello there. I feel sorry for those that have had difficulties buying their essential supplies, food or otherwise.

The one obstacle that people face when going shopping is the inappropriate behaviour of some fellow shoppers. Some stores, especially Tesco Extra stores that normally do 24-hour opening times, would open their stores at, say, 0600, restock everything, and then things like toilet rolls and hand sanitisers get snapped up quickly. In my opinion, these 'priority' periods, which the likes of Iceland have done, ought to become a permanent fixture, even when the coronavirus crisis is over. These 24-hour opening times ought to be reviewed, possibly changed for more appropriate times (perhaps 9am to 8pm or something), with the first hour or two allocated only to the elderly and the vulnerable (the autistic and their carers included). If this scheme is more widely implemented and successful, perhaps another priority period should be implemented, such as at lunchtime.

All stores should ensure that the elderly and the vulnerable (including the autistic) get the best possible shopping experience. In the current situation, I would advise that any shoppers consider drawing up a shortlist of as many supermarkets as possible that are within a reasonable road travelling distance of their home. They should create a shopping list, either on paper or using a mobile phone app, and start the search from the most distant of those stores (perhaps 3 stores within 10 miles or something). Every item that they successfully get should be crossed off, and any unavailable items should be searched for in the second most distant store, if not the third, or however many more stores they can get to. Such a procedure would be a bit like using a semi-fast train service, where you go to location 1 for Tesco, location 2 for Sainsbury's and so on.

Any autistic shoppers should be prepared for anything, especially at the checkout areas. If they have a mobile phone, they should download as many games as necessary, as playing even the simplest games (e.g. wordsearch, connect four, board games etc) will help with the anxiety of the queuing. Seeing or being in a queue can be very stressful even to myself. If, for that matter, you were to get everything you need in the first of these stores, and if every shopping list item is crossed off, you should select the first checkout that isn't busy, pay the money, and head back home. It would then be a waste of time to search any more stores.

Hopefully this advice will help you, and anyone else reading this message.

I'm one of the individuals whose autism means their hypersensitive to taste and texture. As such, my diet is restricted to a few meals and a few brands. One of these meals is pasta with a homemade sauce. All of the supermarkets near me have been out of passata for over a week now. I only have the ingredients to make four of these meals now 

If most of the world's workforce are self-isolating or ill it's highly likely that there will be shortages. I have had sleepless nights and panic attacks about being able to adequately feed myself. Last night, I went to the local Indian supermarket and stocked up on a few large bags of rice, so at least if everything else I can eat runs out I can survive on bowls of boiled rice and water. I did sit and cry at the prospect of having to live like this before I set out, especially as I have a 6-month-old daughter to look after, which means being adequately nourished to have the energy to be a good mum is key.

Trogluddite said:

I have had a few dirty looks already when some of my slightly less charitable thoughts have inadvertently slipped out ("sure you've got enough there?") - not knowing when I'm speaking out loud is probably an autistic trait I could do without right now

I don't think it because you voiced a thought out loud Trogluddite, its more to do with the fact that you're being rude to someone when you do not know their circumstances, plus you're showing a lack of compassion. You have no idea why they need all of that shopping. For example, they may have a large household, adverse reactions to sensory stimuli that make being in crowds difficult or mental health issues, such as suffering from anxiety in crowds based on previous traumatic experiences. 

I usually shop on-line due to finding busy places challenging but my local supermarket have no slots available for the next three weeks and I can not get through to the phone line to register for priority disability shopping. I went to Tesco at 6 am this morning to be able to try and get the bits I needed. It was mayhem and I had to work really hard not to have a panic attack. The lack of sleep, fear of not being able to feed me, the crowds, lights etc was hell. If you'd have spoken to me in the way you have been doing to other people Trogluddite it would have had me in tears.

If we want society to show us compassion and understanding, when others are experiencing challenges, such as overwhelming anxiety around being able to feed themselves, shouldn't we behave how we'd like to be treated? E.g Do what we can to protect ourself and not speak in a derogatory manner about others who are experiencing mental ill-health?

You have to go first thing in the morning after they have restocked. I think it will get even worse soon

I went shopping on Monday, and just bought a little bit more than usual, not to hoard, but so I could delay going shopping again for a few days longer than usual if necessary. Then I got home and found that my van has a fault and will probably be off the road for some time. So I booked a delivery from Asda for just over two weeks time (the earliest available date), and walked to my local garage to buy a few things to last until the delivery. It's the unknown element of this that worries me, as I've tried to look after myself, and act responsibly, but who knows what might happen? I'm sure it's bad enough for many NTs, and I'm not as badly affected by anxiety and a need for certainly than many of us, but I'm not in a good state to be dealing with any of this.