Hi everyone

As a scientist, I agree that the analogy of a spectrum is poor, as all spectra are linear and  have upper and lower limits, even if some of these are fairly arbitrarily imposed by human beings. What autism is, in reality, is a bunch of characteristics, which, when posessed in a relatively poorly defined number and severity, will receive a clinical diagnosis. So people who fall just short of having sufficient number and severity of these characteristics, can logically be regarded as 'somewhat autistic'.

no not Mariusz ! we will all die aaaaaaaaargh everyone run   

☕Tassimo ☕ said:

they might be encouraged to change themselves

nothing forceful I know. it just sounded wrong. you are much better with words, It would probably be easier for me to chop them (words) with an axe like I used to chop wood back home. 

☕Tassimo ☕ said:

the ones who are responsible for all the violence and suffering in the world

put autistic in charge is a receipe for tyrant, I used to say in my previous job to rebuff their attempts at making me a manager

You can't change the world for the better, Mariusz. You can only change your own world (the world inside of you) for the better. And then when other people see how you have changed for the better, they might be encouraged to change themselves. And then the world does change.

There is a lot of truth in the old saying, "Be the change you want to see in the world." 

People who want to change the world, for whatever reason, are the ones who are responsible for all the violence and suffering in the world. Because, as sure as eggs is eggs, what one person sees as a change for the better, another person else will see as a change for the worse.  And then you have conflict. This is how every war, every atrocity and every injustice has started—two opposing ideas, two ideologies, two visions of how to change the world to make it better.  

Thank you for reading to the bottom of my post! :-)

Oh PS to those who call me "anonymous poster" - I'm pretty new to this site and still trying to get myself a "cool handle" that will show up in posts. Since this hasn;t happened yet, I did sign my original post.

If you go to the bottom of the post you can find my name and you are quite welcome to call me that :-)

welcome Keith to this forum

Well, thanks indeed everyone for such thought-provoking replies! Though I have to say, I don't like the either/or idea idea of a spectrum that you  are either "on" or "off". My hackles rise when I read throwaway comments such as,"It is very likely that Einstein was somewhere on the spectrum". Neurotypicals ask what it is like to be "on the spectrum",but I'd like to ask what it is like to be "off the spectrum" - I'm guessing that such people do not have routines, for example, in the morning they are delightfully free to brush their teeth and comb their hair completely at random.... No, perhaps not.

Also thank you everyone for the alternatives to the linear idea of a spectrum, but I'm afraid your colour wheels didn't help me much. The reason being that yes, you can take only the visible light part of the electromagnetic spectrum, and yes, you can fold it round on itself to make a circular shape and  - lo and behold! gamma rays and microwaves are no longer "on the spectrum". But they don't cease to exist.

I think the problem arises when an analogy is taken too literally. The spectrum is an analogy, and it is only useful as far as it explains and has some predictive use. It doesn't "exist out there" and was only waiting to be discovered. it is a human construct. Other constructs such as intoversion-extraversion or intelligence  continue to be used because they have such predictive power. Even though IQ has come under assult more recently, it has been used in the past to determiine educational needs of children, for example. 60% of adults will have an IQ beween 85 and 115, so you might decide to allocate resources to those whose IQ is below 85. This is tough on kids with an IQ of 86, who might still benefit from extra educational resources, but this is precisely the intention of, and the probelm with, "either/or" classifications.

The Autism Spectrum Quotient (AQ) suggests that scores below 30 indicate that an individual is "in the non-autistic range". That's not really the same as saying "Not on the spectrum", although it sounds very close. We don't classify people as "hopelessly stupid" or "very bright" depending on an arbitrary cutoff (IQ>85).The AQ is similarly unfair to people who score 29, as they might benefit from support but won't get it as they are regarded as "not on the spectrum".

Thank you Plinky for a very interesting article. The author seems to be arguing that an "either/or" approach is necessary to determine allocation of resources, which I can fully understand. Just why not use an (arbitrary) cutoff point?

Finally, I should point out that we are talking here about analogies, about artificial constructs and that "the map is not the territory". A map is useful for its descriptive and predictive capabilities - "if I climb that hill (shown by the contour lines} I should see a river (shown by the blue line)". I guess I don't find the spectrum analogy helpful, but then, it is not my job to allocate health resources.

Perhaps I am waiting until we have a better map, and as research continues that day may yet well come.

I have a constant fear of hubby dying before I do and I wanted a formal diagnosis in case I needed assistance if that happens.  I think it's a personal choice, but many feel relieved or validated after obtaining a formal diagnosis.  I had many, many dark days as an undiagnosed adolescent because I never "fit in" anywhere and was "weird" or "odd."

I try to better the world. I would if I could, but I can't and I try anyway.

I probably know nothing at all as well, except that I tend to forget about it often 

Happily everafter has been sent away into a distant future 

All I know for sure is that I know nothing at all. And I lived happily ever after 

Thanks, Plinky. That's a decent article.

☕Tassimo ☕ said:

the way the traits manifest in behaviour or cognitive performance can be similar in different neurotypes even though the cause is different.

exactly all homo sapiens, icluding those sociopathic as well, autistic have more of them than others, sociopathic the least

☕Tassimo ☕ said:

you may be mis-diagnosing yourself. 

I am a victim of one of the traits we often posses - sense of righteousness, so it did not occur to me LOL

Your comments lead me to this search result saying yes and no - 

https://autisticandunapologetic.com/2019/03/16/is-everyone-on-the-autism-spectrum/

Hi Anonymous Poster. Welcome to the forum!

1# Yes. You will find it much easier to access support employment adjustments, medical support and societal understanding (either now or in the future) with an official diagnosis.  Aside from that, the main danger of self-diagnosing is that you may be mis-diagnosing yourself.  And a mis-diagnosis can be more harmful than no diagnosis at all.

2# No. This is a common fallacy. And, in my opinion, it is one that is frequently perpetuated in order to diminish the struggles of autistic people, or to dismiss them completely. It's called the Autism Spectrum and and not The Neurological Spectrum. The Autism Spectrum is a "spectrum" of developmental traits shared by autistic people. What people they are pointing to when they say that everyone is a little bit autistic is that the way the traits manifest in behaviour or cognitive performance can be similar in different neurotypes even though the cause is different. 

The above is just my understanding, opinion and reasoning. It's not, in any way, meant to be taken as truth or as more correct than other similar or differing opinions. 

RegularLogic said:

As for #2 try not to think of it as a linear spectrum stretching from left to right... think of it like the colour pallete in paint. All different kinds neurodivergent traits and aspects of your personality in there

For #1 I feel much of what Mariusz has said. Always felt very uncomfortable with self diagnosis, but once I had my formal diagnosis it was a weight off my mind. Allowed me to accept myself and was oddly reassuring.

As for #2 try not to think of it as a linear spectrum stretching from left to right... think of it like the colour pallete in paint. All different kinds neurodivergent traits and aspects of your personality in there

I think for the proccess of accepting the fact, that someone is autistic to be complete both are necessary, self-diagnosis and official diagnosis.

just self-diagnosis often means you feel like a fraud

just official diagnosis.means nothing, it is just an empty word

Hello,

Yes to number 2. Does a spectrum have to have only a pair of ends  - it is more likely shaped with many dendrites. Only you can answer number 1.