Advice please? Potentially Autistic - Difficulties with people... and they're everywhere!

Hello

I'm 40 and I'm really in some trouble.  I've always found social interactions difficult, and my personal life certainly doesn't look like most other people's.  I don't know if I'm autistic, it's been suggested, but I've had some bad experiences and am a bit wary of the medical profession so I've considerable reluctance to finding out.  Trouble is I'm also in some trouble and in my 40 years still haven't worked out how to deal with it.  I've done some reading and it seems like maybe people on the autistic spectrum might experience similar things so here I am hoping you might have some ideas.

Work wise I've been quite lucky on the whole, I work in a job I enjoy, but I'm running into the same problems over and over and finding them ridiculously distressing over and over.

It's all about morals and truth.  It is my thing.  I absolutely cannot stand people lying.  Theoretically I realise that people lie, for all sorts of reasons, but I've never managed to integrate the fact of people lying into my expectations, so every time I am shocked and confused.  And then angry and upset.  There is a pathological liar that I am senior to, and they lie when they've done something wrong, when they haven't done something they should, but also volunteer totally unnecessary lies seemingly to make themselves look more important.  I can't cope with this at all.  They have become progressively less valuable in my eyes over time and I have retreated to the position that I simply don't play them any attention, deliberately ignore them when they are attention-seeking, and discount everything they say as it seems to me there is no worth to be applied to them.  Trouble is people are telling me this is too extreme and I'm getting irrationally upset, and I see they are probably right but I can't seem to temper my reactions.  And once I've reacted I'm so damn upset I stay visibly annoyed and upset for hours.

I also am stunned into confusion by hypocrisy, which I clearly have no grounds to get on my high horse about, but it, and inconsistency, just bambozzles me.  And then people are messy and inconsiderate and that enrages me.

The upshot being that I'm getting continuously upset by the people I work with.  And I'm struggling to understand them, then getting angry with them and it is not a good situation at all.  I have no poker face at all so when I'm upset they know about it.   And I'm senior to some of them and that doesn't make for a great combination.

These things are quite specific so I haven't been able to find out whether these are things that autistic people also find difficult, but I've had these problems since I first had to interact with people when i was a toddler, so I was hoping someone might recognise my problems and have an idea how I might start to cope with them.  If there is some sort of training or a plan or a type of therapy or anything at all that I can do so that I can cope with these people being people. 

Parents
  • I've always been bothered by lies, but I am not always truthful myself; I may choose not tell the whole truth rather than create an entire fiction to paint me in a better light.  I'm not sure when I gained the ability to lie, and I'm not entirely comfortable with it., but I will do it to avoid causing pain to others, to avoid embarrassment (unless I know the truth needs to be told, in which case I'd tell it and accept the consequences), or to avoid giving an overly-precise answer.  Sometimes, I think I am not truthful to myself because I can't tell what I'm feeling most of the time.  When it comes to rules, my logic is that it's OK not to follow it to the letter, as long as you obey the spirit.

     

    I've experienced the harm that both truth and lies can cause so I try to be cautious with both.  As much as I don't like to say it, a subjective truth can be just as damaging as a lie sometimes.  This is going to go on for a bit; sorry about that.

     

    For the lies part, I'd like to discuss an incident from work.  I've been working in a small engineering company for nearly five years as an 'apprentice'.  In truth, I feel little better than a slave in this place most of the time.  The manager I worked under dropped work on me whenever he felt like, resulting in me working unpaid overtime almost every day, he didn't personally give me any training, he ordered me to do work for another company that he owned part of but I wasn't employed by and he would give vague instructions in poor quality English; for example telling me to use phrases like "poor colour of red" in a report to be sent to an overseas supplier, or telling me to design a "nicely curved" handle.  I passed him information about Asperger's Syndrome, in the hopes of smoothing things over but nothing changed. The only consolation is that I wasn't  the only person there dealing with this rubbish, just the one who dealt with it the most; at least three other people quit this job before I started, and none of them lasted over one year. 

    This had been going on for a while and about three years ago on a day before I was due for a day off on Friday, when I had been working overtime again so that we could go through a report I'd written and he told me to fetch a printer from 'the office', despite him having a printer right there under his desk.  I went all over the factory trying to find 'the office' and I couldn't find this printer.  After a while, I decided that enough was enough, remembering that I wasn't legally obligated to work overtime according to ACAS; I told him that I was going and that I would see him next week and when he started talking about how he was tired of my 'attitude' I forcefully told him that I wasn't obligated to work overtime and that he didn't have the power to force me and he folded.  I should have phrased it better but I was in a bad place emotionally; my parents were going through a messy divorce, my mum developed long term health problems and had been in hospital recently, my maternal grandmother had died a few weeks ago on Christmas and I was tired and angry at having to deal with this place and having him waste my time again.

    The following week I came in and partway through my day I was told to come and talk to the owner after 4pm.  The manager and I went there, and the owner claimed the material I provided about autism was interesting, yet he changed the subject when I asked what he found the most interesting.  When I pointed out that this was technically a violation of disciplinary procedure, I was told that if I wanted to turn this into one of those than that was fine (since the contract state that the owner settles disciplinary issues there wouldn't have been any point). The owner told me that the overtime and this work for their other company (he and the manager own the other business that I mentioned earlier) was part of the 'learning experience', and if I didn't like how things were done there in the office then it's fine: I could either be demoted to the factory floor or quit.  Oh, and by the way I just got a 20% pay rise, but if I chose demotion, they would just take this month's payment back and they would put a reduced amount into my account instead.  When I pointed out that I wasn't contractually obligated to work overtime, he (the owner) told me that they don't want to be the kind of company that worries about contracts.  The manager stayed quiet until the part about overtime, when he said "maybe if you worked faster you wouldn't have to do so much overtime".  When I tried to point out the difficulties caused by my AS and unrelated physical problems, he basically said 'so what, I worked 80 hours a week before I took over this place'.  

    Through all of this I was experiencing extreme rage to the point that my hands started to shake and I was trying desperately to stay in control because I had only been working there for a year and a half, so I had no legal protection against being fired without cause, I was unprepared for this and didn't know what to say and I couldn't risk adding to the stress my family was under.  I managed it, but I was so angry I couldn't sleep properly for days. When I talked to my parents about what happened, my mum made me promise not to do anything rash, and so far I've kept to that.  A few weeks later, the owner had the nerve to drop by the office and say to me "I trust there won't be any more badness from you".  Even now, the rage is not fully gone;  when I see or hear the owner I try to get as far away as I can and I speak to him as little as possible. 

    I tried getting legal advice but was told that the owner's behaviour, while immoral, was not illegal. The thing that really annoys me is that the owner can willingly ignore his side of my employment contract.  Since a contract is pretty much a legally recognised promise / agreement, him saying that contracts didn't matter to him effectively means that his word is worth nothing, yet I have to obey him.  He thinks I have to do whatever they says as long as I get paid on-time and they don't do anything that I could take him to court over, and he doesn't have to bother to change anything to make my job easier.  Perhaps this is all due to cultural differences (both owner and manager are Iranian, and related, while I am neither), but I doubt it.   

    Not long ago, some crony was being given a tour by the owner , and along the way, they stopped at the office I worked in 

    The tourist said he thought the owner was the best manager he'd ever met and asked if I agreed.  I just looked at both of them, and said nothing;  if I said 'yes' it would be a lie & I didn't feel comfortable lying at that question, but I wasn't sure if saying 'no' would break my promise not to do anything rash.  After a few seconds, the tourist announced they were moving on and they left me alone. 

    Now for the pain of truth, or at least a subjective truth.  My dad started the divorce proceedings while my mum was in hospital, having undergone surgery.  To respect their privacy, I won't disclose why.  I don't know if his claims about her behaviour are true or he just thinks that they are, but here is my truth; his actions have hurt his children deeply.  He has destroyed our hopes that there could be a peace between our parents, he has left us all less financially secure than before, and now we will have to worry about the psychological damage done to our mother and our ability to form lasting relationships for the rest of our lives.  His actions to force his truth onto his family have led to unnecessary pain. 

    He didn't have to deal with the psychological damage his actions have caused to mum, or with the people who he chose to drag into this.  He doesn't have to ask himself why he is even here at all sometimes, or what he should have said that would have prevented things escalating.  He put his own desire for revenge about a perceived injustice above his duty to protect his children and I have yet to fully forgive that.   

    I sometimes think about how my rage at work mirrored his rage at mum, and if I would go as far if given a chance and I don't like the answer.

    As much as I hate when people lie to big themselves up or go back on their word, I also accept the need to lie, as long as you aren't doing it for yourself.  I think Sir Terry Pratchett had the right of it in his book Hogfather, in which it states that many of the intangible concepts that we believe in, such as justice and mercy, are technically lies.  We cannot weigh or measure them, yet we choose to believe that these ideas exist, because if they don't then they can never become true.    

    As for the truth, when I have to tell an unpleasant truth, I try to put it gently, to avoid violating the other person's subjective truth like my dad did.  When it comes to the truth, I think how it is told is sometimes more important than what is being told, if that makes sense.

Reply
  • I've always been bothered by lies, but I am not always truthful myself; I may choose not tell the whole truth rather than create an entire fiction to paint me in a better light.  I'm not sure when I gained the ability to lie, and I'm not entirely comfortable with it., but I will do it to avoid causing pain to others, to avoid embarrassment (unless I know the truth needs to be told, in which case I'd tell it and accept the consequences), or to avoid giving an overly-precise answer.  Sometimes, I think I am not truthful to myself because I can't tell what I'm feeling most of the time.  When it comes to rules, my logic is that it's OK not to follow it to the letter, as long as you obey the spirit.

     

    I've experienced the harm that both truth and lies can cause so I try to be cautious with both.  As much as I don't like to say it, a subjective truth can be just as damaging as a lie sometimes.  This is going to go on for a bit; sorry about that.

     

    For the lies part, I'd like to discuss an incident from work.  I've been working in a small engineering company for nearly five years as an 'apprentice'.  In truth, I feel little better than a slave in this place most of the time.  The manager I worked under dropped work on me whenever he felt like, resulting in me working unpaid overtime almost every day, he didn't personally give me any training, he ordered me to do work for another company that he owned part of but I wasn't employed by and he would give vague instructions in poor quality English; for example telling me to use phrases like "poor colour of red" in a report to be sent to an overseas supplier, or telling me to design a "nicely curved" handle.  I passed him information about Asperger's Syndrome, in the hopes of smoothing things over but nothing changed. The only consolation is that I wasn't  the only person there dealing with this rubbish, just the one who dealt with it the most; at least three other people quit this job before I started, and none of them lasted over one year. 

    This had been going on for a while and about three years ago on a day before I was due for a day off on Friday, when I had been working overtime again so that we could go through a report I'd written and he told me to fetch a printer from 'the office', despite him having a printer right there under his desk.  I went all over the factory trying to find 'the office' and I couldn't find this printer.  After a while, I decided that enough was enough, remembering that I wasn't legally obligated to work overtime according to ACAS; I told him that I was going and that I would see him next week and when he started talking about how he was tired of my 'attitude' I forcefully told him that I wasn't obligated to work overtime and that he didn't have the power to force me and he folded.  I should have phrased it better but I was in a bad place emotionally; my parents were going through a messy divorce, my mum developed long term health problems and had been in hospital recently, my maternal grandmother had died a few weeks ago on Christmas and I was tired and angry at having to deal with this place and having him waste my time again.

    The following week I came in and partway through my day I was told to come and talk to the owner after 4pm.  The manager and I went there, and the owner claimed the material I provided about autism was interesting, yet he changed the subject when I asked what he found the most interesting.  When I pointed out that this was technically a violation of disciplinary procedure, I was told that if I wanted to turn this into one of those than that was fine (since the contract state that the owner settles disciplinary issues there wouldn't have been any point). The owner told me that the overtime and this work for their other company (he and the manager own the other business that I mentioned earlier) was part of the 'learning experience', and if I didn't like how things were done there in the office then it's fine: I could either be demoted to the factory floor or quit.  Oh, and by the way I just got a 20% pay rise, but if I chose demotion, they would just take this month's payment back and they would put a reduced amount into my account instead.  When I pointed out that I wasn't contractually obligated to work overtime, he (the owner) told me that they don't want to be the kind of company that worries about contracts.  The manager stayed quiet until the part about overtime, when he said "maybe if you worked faster you wouldn't have to do so much overtime".  When I tried to point out the difficulties caused by my AS and unrelated physical problems, he basically said 'so what, I worked 80 hours a week before I took over this place'.  

    Through all of this I was experiencing extreme rage to the point that my hands started to shake and I was trying desperately to stay in control because I had only been working there for a year and a half, so I had no legal protection against being fired without cause, I was unprepared for this and didn't know what to say and I couldn't risk adding to the stress my family was under.  I managed it, but I was so angry I couldn't sleep properly for days. When I talked to my parents about what happened, my mum made me promise not to do anything rash, and so far I've kept to that.  A few weeks later, the owner had the nerve to drop by the office and say to me "I trust there won't be any more badness from you".  Even now, the rage is not fully gone;  when I see or hear the owner I try to get as far away as I can and I speak to him as little as possible. 

    I tried getting legal advice but was told that the owner's behaviour, while immoral, was not illegal. The thing that really annoys me is that the owner can willingly ignore his side of my employment contract.  Since a contract is pretty much a legally recognised promise / agreement, him saying that contracts didn't matter to him effectively means that his word is worth nothing, yet I have to obey him.  He thinks I have to do whatever they says as long as I get paid on-time and they don't do anything that I could take him to court over, and he doesn't have to bother to change anything to make my job easier.  Perhaps this is all due to cultural differences (both owner and manager are Iranian, and related, while I am neither), but I doubt it.   

    Not long ago, some crony was being given a tour by the owner , and along the way, they stopped at the office I worked in 

    The tourist said he thought the owner was the best manager he'd ever met and asked if I agreed.  I just looked at both of them, and said nothing;  if I said 'yes' it would be a lie & I didn't feel comfortable lying at that question, but I wasn't sure if saying 'no' would break my promise not to do anything rash.  After a few seconds, the tourist announced they were moving on and they left me alone. 

    Now for the pain of truth, or at least a subjective truth.  My dad started the divorce proceedings while my mum was in hospital, having undergone surgery.  To respect their privacy, I won't disclose why.  I don't know if his claims about her behaviour are true or he just thinks that they are, but here is my truth; his actions have hurt his children deeply.  He has destroyed our hopes that there could be a peace between our parents, he has left us all less financially secure than before, and now we will have to worry about the psychological damage done to our mother and our ability to form lasting relationships for the rest of our lives.  His actions to force his truth onto his family have led to unnecessary pain. 

    He didn't have to deal with the psychological damage his actions have caused to mum, or with the people who he chose to drag into this.  He doesn't have to ask himself why he is even here at all sometimes, or what he should have said that would have prevented things escalating.  He put his own desire for revenge about a perceived injustice above his duty to protect his children and I have yet to fully forgive that.   

    I sometimes think about how my rage at work mirrored his rage at mum, and if I would go as far if given a chance and I don't like the answer.

    As much as I hate when people lie to big themselves up or go back on their word, I also accept the need to lie, as long as you aren't doing it for yourself.  I think Sir Terry Pratchett had the right of it in his book Hogfather, in which it states that many of the intangible concepts that we believe in, such as justice and mercy, are technically lies.  We cannot weigh or measure them, yet we choose to believe that these ideas exist, because if they don't then they can never become true.    

    As for the truth, when I have to tell an unpleasant truth, I try to put it gently, to avoid violating the other person's subjective truth like my dad did.  When it comes to the truth, I think how it is told is sometimes more important than what is being told, if that makes sense.

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