What I've learned

Martiantom 

I just wanted to say that I'm sorry to hear about how your work situation is making you feel. It must be difficult working with people who have that "pack mentality", particularly while dealing with a relative who needs support. 

You do have a very creative streak though, as illustrated by the writing you have posted on here. Would it be possible for you to find work which would utilise this gift? 

Good luck and hope things improve 

Thanks for the replies - some interesting comments there.

In my search for an insight into the differences between AS and NT people, I have often wondered how NTs really view us. The following account is an extract from the story of an NT woman married to an Aspie, on the "different together" website:

"His sensitivities to the world around him used to be the inspiration that drove his wonderful, unconventional imagination and his "live life for the moment" attitude. Now, those very sensitivities corner him, make him aggressively self-protective, fuel his perfectionism and express themselves through anger and frustration onto the people nearest and dearest to him"

It seems to me that the stresses and pressures of life can overwhelm us. For some it happens relatively early, preventing them from having a "normal" life, while for others it happens more gradually and only becomes obvious much later in life. 

But it has to be borne in mind that not all NTs are the same - they all have individual personalities too. Some will exhibit "pack" behaviour, need hierarchy and shun those outside their pack.. Some cannot accept new information unless it comes from an"expert" or "leader". Some are unable to choose to buy things that are deemed unacceptable, or perceived to be status lowering by their identity group. These people are insecure and crave affirmation - unless they are deliberately cruel to you they probably deserve sympathy as they cannot help it.

But just as we're not all "rain man" types, neither are they all "pack mentality" types. I know a guy who scored 12 on the AQ test: although he exhibits some of the "display" traits of NTs - likes to "look good" and has a charming, socially correct approach to other people - he is kind, accepting of difference, and has a strong sense of fairness and justice.

We can't know what is going on in another person's mind. People can present different "masks" to others depending on the situation. For us, it is more difficult to determine the cause of certain behaviour in others. I've heard it suggested that in a situation where one feels intimidated (such as an interview) it may be useful to imagine the people who you feel intimidated by naked - I'm not a fan myself of imagining people's dangly bits, thank you, but any strategy to make others less scary which works for you is a good idea. I try to keep in mind that most other people get worried about stuff and feel inadequate about some things - nobody is invulnerable. Suoer-heroes only exist in fiction.

Tom's colleagues have a desperate need to be accepted by those they sub-consciously perceive as their social group, because they can't bear the thought of being alone or "different". They don't judge others on merit or individual character, only by whether a person "fits into"  the group.

We are free to make our own individual judgements, and to evaluate new information on its merits without needing affirmation from others. I feel that this is a precious gift. It should be valued. 

I've often wondered if Mary Beard (the historian) is an Aspie because she strikes me as fitting the pattern. No dress sense; comes over as a bit 'eccentric'; is very knowledgeable about Roaman history (special interest); has a independent way of thinking; says what she thinks. I don't think she's married either (might be wrong about that).

She may well not be but I just wondered. 

I've experienced similar things to that, where people will often come to me if they need someone to depend on, but when the times are good they'll go to their fairweather friends and I'll find myself shut out.  I hasten to add that not all are like that, but it's certainly a familiar situation.

Thing with cliques, though, is they're very much a double-edged sword: it's easy to get swept along in their wake and to feel apart and excluded, but I've found that once I've had time to compose myself, it's not something I want to be a part of anyway.  Even when there are common interests, quite often the group mentality spoils it for me: I've quite like to enjoy things in my own way.  Spending time online has been good for me as I've met a lot of kindred spirits (ASD and NT alike) who have the same approach to stuff; IRL, I find that the people I get along with are more often than not people who I don't seem to have anything in common with.

The workplace clique is often its own thing, though: although I've worked in some places where there's regular people who just get along (the sort where there isn't a clique and anybody is welcome), I've also known places where it does feel artificial and forced, much like The Office or The Fast Show's "zany" office joker.  Not something I would want to be a part of, especially, but as a working environment it kinda sucks.  Trouble is, it usually only takes one person to make it like that.

Tom, would this partly be an age thing?

The DWP can be unpleasant to deal with.  My experience has been mixed: last time I had some guidance to fill in every appropriate section as extensively as possible, repeating the exact diagnosis and every effect they had on me as well as the risks that would come with poor management of my conditions, giving specific details for each question even if it meant much repetition.  Continuation sheets helped both in terms of space and allowing me to type my answers.  I included proof of diagnoses from my GP and specialists and my claim was accepted

Previously, I hadn't answered so expansively and had sent some supporting evidence afterwards (which was conveniently "lost" by someone who never had it in the first place) and was turned down.  A combination of a prompt appeal and involving my MP sorted it out, but it was extremely stressful and unpleasant.

It is very alarming that people are being forced through the grinder like this, though.  It shouldn't require anything more than a report from one's GP, not putting people on trial with a presumption of guilt, and if they have cause to disbelieve a doctor to take it up with them, not their patients.

That's a great post Pixie, and I have admired your handling of your recent employment problems. I don't think I fully taken in all of what you have said here. I did have some CBT about 18 months ago before my diagnosis, it didn't work out for me. The person who I met with for CBT didn't have any awareness at the time of Autism, but have since been trained by the diagnostic team I was with. Ironically, I can no longer access her services because my needs are too complex I have been told.

I think the key word in your post is "Control", that resonates with my current difficulties.

I had my first appointment Today with the Neurology department who have now accepted me for care. It didn't really work out how I expected, but one of the questions he asked me if there were times when I had been happy. I reflected back to around 1998, although I didn't mention it at the appointment; I think the difference between then and now are feelings of security and control.

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