Class

1. Working class (but parents now middle class)

2. Working class (but have middle class tastes, I think mentally I feel middle class but financially I am working class)

3. Unfortunately yes

4. Yes. Though I do think it’s based heavily around finance, if you have money you can afford to live better, live in better areas, afford a better education, and likely to mix with other middle class)

5. Yes I think people can. For me not so much. I’m too old now for my life to change drastically financially.

But, I wish there were no classes. We’re all human. I hate the way there is such a huge divide. In a perfect world (for me) everyone would have the same piece of land, the same financial situation etc. 

Working class (but have middle class tastes, I think mentally I feel middle class

I think that's a bit similar to me, which is why I'm unsure about myself.

In a perfect world (for me) everyone would have the same piece of land, the same financial situation etc. 

I think that's similar to Communism, + very dissimilar to Capitalism (please correct me if I'm wrong).

It's how I used to think as a young idealist but as I've grown older I'm more realistic/cynical.

Human nature doesn't allow for it and Communism in actuality (rather than as an ideal) tends to be very controlling.

Thanks for this.

Food for thought.

Though I do think it’s based heavily around finance, if you have money you can afford to live better, live in better areas, afford a better education, and likely to mix with other middle class)

There used to be the idea that people who are 'born' into money have real class whereas those who make it don't just work their way up to another class level by having the money.

The education bit you mention really matters though doesn't it.

In some ways I think the school you go to defines you and sets a mould for your life ahead (or can do unless you break out of the mould).

I have a huge distaste for all politics (I can’t remember if it’s a rule here we can’t discus this). As much as I have a huge dislike for inequality. The entire government needs to be taken down, they have absolutely no interest in the working class or any idea of the kind of lives we lead (nor do they care). The only time I became interested was when Jeremy Corbyn was up for election, and it’s the only time I have voted in my entire life. He gave me hope. It was clearly turned into a hate campaign by the tories to dirty his name.

Whether it’s unrealistic or not, my perfect life (please note the my) would be everyone to be equal, for there to be no such thing as money and for people to trade skills/food etc. There is enough food and land for everyone to live a good life. There shouldn’t be any reason for anyone to be homeless or hungry. There shouldn’t be any reason for one person to look down on another due to their assets and finances. I know realistically this cannot work, but it would be nice if it did. The world is incredibly unfair, and the way it is right now simply does not work - not if you want to include everyone and not just the fat cats at the top in charge of everything. 

The entire government needs to be taken down, they have absolutely no interest in the working class or any idea of the kind of lives we lead (nor do they care)

Of course, politics can be aligned to class too (although that's not so distinct an alignment).

I've voted Labour all my life and do vote in each General Election and although I think Labour are more 'caring'  (it would be hard not to be) I tend to always feel (to a degree) let down by them once they are in power.

for people to trade skills/food etc.

That's what (some) people did in the distant past.

I wouldn’t vote for them now. They’re basically tories in disguise. I can’t stand Kier Starmer. 

Anyway I’m going to respectfully step away from this thread, I don’t know enough to contribute anything of any worth. I just know how I’d like life to be for me  

1. I was born working class
2. Financially I'm middle class, but I don't have any of the understanding or experience of middle class life that you get if you're raised that way, so I feel like I'm culturally still working class- the same way that a footballer has an income like the aristocracy but nothing in common with them, except I'm not that well off
3. I don't *believe* in them so much as acknowledging they exist. We have a class system in the UK, I don't like it much but it's still there.
4. See above!
5. To some extent, yes- you definitely can change class in the financial/income sense. I think that your personality is formed by the way you're brought up though- I'm never going to feel or fit in as middle class really because they behave differently and have had different experiences to me. I'm not sure I'll ever stop feeling like an alien around people who were raised in significantly more fortunate circumstances than I was.

battybats said:

I'm not sure I'll ever stop feeling like an alien around people who were raised in significantly more fortunate circumstances than I was.

That's true of me too.

The thing I hugely lack, and a lot of middle class people seem to have an abundance of, is confidence.

My lack (+ social anxiety) will also be to do with autism though, so it's complex.

1. Working class.  My Dad was a Postman when i was a child and my Mum a school cleaner.

2.  I still consider myself working class.  I'm a Unite Community and Labour Party member.  I'm not in the workplace because of the way my Autism, Mental Health and other Health issues effect me.

3.  Yes Inequality exists and many people who say otherwise have an agenda.

4. See answer to number 3

5. It's complicated.

Inequality exists

If you look at just one aspect of inequality, financial:

Can you remain middle class and be/become poor?

Can you remain working class and be/become wealthy?

What an intersting topic! I'm from a middle class family, privately educated with all that entails. I'm not dropppin my Hs as this is who I am. As you rightly say, it's all boll..ks, and people are people. As far as I'm aware, The class you are is determined by breeding and NOT money. Since most of us can't trace our lineage back to 1066, we are, by definition, all plebs! So WHAT!

All my life I was thought of as the eccentric posh girl, when in fact it appears I'm autistic. The relief is indescribable - and YES, I have the confidence to tell people who don't like it, to go swivel!

I regard both those questions as distraction from the important issue. Acknowledging that inequality exists and then taking steps to reduce it.  So in essence i do not care what the answers to those questions are.  And of course you don't have to be Working Class to be in favour of reducing inequality.  Tony Benn was born with a silver spoon in his gob but was a strong political friend of the Working Classes.

My childhood was definitely working class, my dad was very poor as a child and was determined to not be poor again. He always told us how his sister could make 4 sandwiches from one tomato, My mum always lived in Council Houses and loved her childhood.  Dad worked 18 per day, he never stopped, I was in a caravan as a baby, at 18 months old dad bought a three bedroom house. I never understood why letters arrived at the house with his name and Esq, after his name. I worked out later, it showed he owned property. 
I am most probably middle / working class. I live in a leafy Shire county, the amount of private schools is massive, the Black Range Rover owners spend more educating two children than I earn. I like people for who they are not what they are worth. I still live, week to week, I’ve never had savings.

Debbie do you remember the John Cleese sketch with the Two Ronnie’s about the class system.

https://youtu.be/UDIHrX-Jp2E

Roy said:

I like people for who they are not what they are worth.
Debbie do you remember the John Cleese sketch with the Two Ronnie’s about the class system.

Nice and yes, I do

Thank you for sharing the link.

I think it's probably a bit of both for me as well, to be honest. And then, yes, anxiety on top of that so you're extra conscious of it all.

As another Python said, “ we come into this world with nothing, we leave it with nothing, what have we lost… nothing .” I love the words Freddie Mercury shared with his father, “ Good words, kind deeds.”

That is very difficult to answer. Class in the UK has become less pervasive, but it still informs everyday life. In Marxist terms, most of my ancestry would have been from the 'labour aristocracy', that is relatively well-paid craftsmen who had served apprenticeships. I also have a couple of Victorian 'Masters', who were industrial employers, a foundry owner and a coal mine owner, in my ancestry. I would say, overall, that I have working class origins. I certainly wasn't privately educated. What am I now? I was a trades union activist and am broadly Socialist in political outlook. However, I was a professional scientist and hold an academic doctorate, I've even been to a Buckingham Palace garden party; does that make me middle class? I rather prefer the Continental viewpoint which would put me in the intelligentsia, somewhat outside the class system. Though, in the UK this isn't really a fully recognised part of society.

You forgot the under-class..

Social-economics is definitely a thing.   
Unfortunately the greatest factor in how society responds to you is class, the greatest class-divide issue is that the lines are blurred nowadays, the best of a class tend to move up the next class asap, whilst leaving the broken windows behind.  
A class was once something to be defended and prideful about, but now it just ensures lesser opportunity and lesser status, class is the difference between a disociable kid loitering on-a-corner waiting for the devil or having enough amenities to avoid criminality.

I'm Middle Class, the ones who REALLY ARE being phased out; by the Elites.

People have a romantic view of being Working Class, propagated by the Media and Schools. The Middle Class were branded pariahs, from the Sixties onwards.

In 1976, when Callaghan replaced Wilson, Britain needed financial assistance from the IMF. Socialism was no longer working. When the Middle Class elected Thatcher, the applecart was upset. Enter all the Labour-Loving Celebrities from the Eighties onwards.

The whole shenanigans from 2020 existed because the Elites couldn't bear the thought of Right Wing candidates, such as Boris Johnson and Donald Trump, winning elections fair-and-square. The whole thing became a freak show to discredit Non-Progressive Politicians.

"The freer the society, the larger the Middle Class!" (Ron Paul)