Social services removing children from parents with ASD

Hi I was hoping someone could help. I had my baby  months ago. My partner at the time was undiagnosed with autism. He had a autistic melt down and resulted in me being hit by a gate the social took our daughter away. Made me stay away from him. Now I’m hoping to get her back however im worried they say he can’t have anything to do with her or me because of autism, anyone been in similar situation 

I take it you decided to stay with your abusive partner? When people do this, autistic or not, they often feel the victimised parent cannot protect their child. After all, you have chosen to take the risk of violence against yourself, but you have no right to accept that risk on behalf of a child, and they have to assume that someone with the lack of control to stop themselves being violent against their partner likely lacks the same control against anyone, including children. 

My mum was in an abusive relationship with my dad as a very young mum. She made the best decision for me and separated from him and had an injection against him from approaching us. Needless to say, social workers didn't need to remove me. 

This isn't a problem about autism, this is a problem about staying in an abusive relationship. It takes a lot of strength to walk away from any relationship, even a violent one. Especially when that person is the parent to your child. If you want to remain with him though then you will likely need to accept that they aren't going to return your child to you to be at risk of his violence outbursts. 

You take it I stayed with an abusive partner? Actually he’s not abusive never layed a finger on me or anyone. He was undiagnosed with autism and never new he had it at the time of our daughter being born. The whole new change lead him to having an outburst. I was not present at this time however I did walk into the house he was in and as he kicked a baby gate out the way of him it hit me. My ex partner was jealous that I moved on and filled the social a load of lies about him, moving forward to today we have heard a couple of social workers and professionals tell us it shouldn’t of went as far as it has. I do believe the social worker we had didn’t like us. We do have her back eventually 

Where I get advocate services do you know the number 

are u supposed to put people at a disadvantage or make sure everyone has the same advantage but reality very different to perception 

well all that if u was familiar with some people dont do jargon very confusing why its good to not generalise autistic people because what worked with one might not work with others every one of us is different but due to the differences we have an experience 

well thats another problem when with autistic individuals and ur a professional with experience u dnt see the problems......how is someone going to work with a stranger expectations - what if to work with that person properly they need to build a trusting relationship if they dnt find a solicitor looks like they dont care or not engaging again lack of support and failure to follow autism act 2009 so those professionals should be following. ALL there statutory laws which from time they interact with an autistic person they cross different law thresholds including discrimination by association alot of so called professional tell parents the minimum amount of information so they can reach there agenda kinda of like triangulation in a narcisttisc relationship only using colleagues who will support them reason for lack of MASH,MDT and wider agency work 

A legal "advocate" in England is a barrister or solicitor who argues cases in court. They must be legally qualified and hold a "practising certificate" from their professional body.

A lay advocate is someone who "speaks for" another person. The word is used for supporters and helpers and may be family members, friends, volunteers or paid helpers.

A lawyer will present your case in court and give you legal advice, but they are paid professionals, not your friends.

no im talking about an advocate that can do both as some people do have many skills and extensive knowledge can be very distressing to then be EXPECTED to work with a stranger who will have an insight but no factual information on the reality of that individual and there autistic behaviours and traits I am constantly met by professionals who say they haven't met someone with my characteristics. and as the autism act states professionals should work with friends and family NOT STRANGERS to gain expert knowledge of the person its law. they can then be appointed a legal advocate to help them with their rights if laws aren't being upheld. 

I presume you are talking about an advocate in the sense of a supporter rather than legal counsel. Normally if you are a party your solicitor will make arrangements with the justices' clerk. If you are a witness, there is a witness support service that will advise "vulnerable" witnesses - usually the solicitor calling you will make these arrangements. The details are on HM Courts Service website.

I was in a court room and the judge refused me an advocate so what should happen and what really happens are two different things 

Advocates are separate to social services, it isn't something that they are able to refuse. You also have a legal right to advocacy services if you have any need which would prevent you from being able to be fully engaged with social services and their assessment processes. 

Advocacy services are run by different agencies around the country so vary area by area. If you need help trying to figure out who your local service is then I'd be happy to try to help. 

Sorry I’m also replying to Michelle aswell as you. I didn’t realise 

You are so right. Our social worker manipulated my partner and didn’t understand his way of thinking. Social workers these days still don’t have the right training when autism is involved. Yes after his diagnoses and meetings with ASD professionals after 26 years of his life being undiagnosed he is slowly but surely understanding himself a lot more and learning each day to cope with himself. He also has ADHD so yes outburst can happen. Just because you say you have ASD doesn’t mean your on the same spectrum as someone else. There’s many spectrums of ASD and each one is different. 

Replying to Sw don’t get involved for people with autism. The post from the lady above stated that when she was pregnant she had anxiety ect and she sought help from a sw then one thing after another lead to her child being removed as she had autism. So yes they do. However in my case my jealous ex boyfriend was ringing police saying things happened at my home when they didn’t and we had witnesses to prove this, number of times the police came out the obv had to get in touch with sw. The social don’t listen to other people they only listen to police reports. We filed complaints as police didn’t take other people’s statements ect.  They only listen to what they’d want to listen to. They cherry pick at everything and take things further then they should instead of helping families which is what we asked for in the beginning. We missed out on nearly 1 year with our baby daughter. All because they couldn’t help and manipulated things. 

what happens when SW refuse advocates and you are left to source one yourself is this appropriate support 

so u have stated that autism is not a reason in itself to have your child removed howeer u are diagnosed with autism due to you rbahiiur/actions so when then faced with a sw who has no professional experience or qualifications and relies on stereotypical views and discriminative opinions much like hitler for example I have been classed by a sw as a black male with mental health...??

SW have refused mdt meetings a blatant refusal of work with wider agencies. a statutory obligation....worng or right... is not the purpose of social services to focus on the child and family and offer correct and appropriate support but u can only have u ever heard anyone talk about the impacts of domestic abuse on a asd relationship 

as u confirm people who think they are a voice for the voiceless parents, friends, doctors say what they thinks appropriate but this is based of what....qualified professional knowledge and training or opinionated discriminative opinions. this is often not what the autistic individuals wants or is required this is also backed up by a lot of research from asd individuals not being listened to.

why do they need their voice strengthened? if professionals were willing to take on board what they were saying and learn from service users and raise unjust policies as statutory obligated there would be no reason for an advocate in many cases but many SW do not see there policies as unjust and dont understand what indirect discrimination is. many SW ask hypothetical questions causing obvious difficulties with individuals with autism who see the world in.a black and white way. for example sw will this could happen ASD person replies like no that could never happen this or this will happen a sw will then make out the asd individual does not understand there concerns when in reality the sw does not understand the asd way of thinking as is then manipulating these anxieties and beliefs ????

No, I'm just genuinely struggling to read what you are saying because of your writing style. 

I've been autistic my whole life, I've been a social worker for far less time. What is really important to know is that depending on the role of a social worker, YOUR rights may not be their primary interest. For example, I've come from an adult social care background and first and foremost I represent the person who is being assessed, NOT their family. Sometimes their family members will want things that are in conflict with what the person wants or needs. Sometimes the person being assessed wants something different than what I advise. Advocates just strengthen the voice of the person they're working for and help them to express themselves. It's not a negative thing to involve an advocate at all. 

The benefit of adults having an advocate in children's proceedings is that they're focused on the parent's needs and feelings about what is happening, rather than the emphasis being on the child. 

It's really common for people to be angry at EVERY social worker when they've had a bad experience, but I genuinely try to share useful advice on this forum for people struggling with the social care systems. I'm not a children's social worker but my training covered it, and now I don't work as a social worker because I too had my own issues with the system. Advocacy services are independent to social services though and are a really valuable resource. It's optional though so if you don't want to explore that option of support then that's your decision. 

lol ok maybe the change of topic is difficult for u but if u break down each topic by yourself your understand  I stated people like u claim to be a voice for the voiceless.....I referred back to statements u have made too which u are unable to reply instead knowing autistic people suffer with sensory issues instead of wanting to clarify what is meant tell someone to seek an advocate when in fact if u was more empathetic and understanding you would of been able to understand what I meant but again like a normal sw time is limited etc etc so people who want to offload information are unable to as they have procedures and policies that they have to stick to which could be indirect discrimination in itself

An advocate would help you to share your views and to understand your rights in the system and what you need to do to challenge what they are saying about you. You refer to yourself as the voiceless, which is exactly what an advocate is for. It is very difficult to understand what you are trying to say in your messages so if you have the same difficulties verbally then it will benefit you that way too. Plus they are independent to social services so they are there for YOU and not the social worker's interests.

so u have stated that autism is not a reason in itself to have your child removed howeer u are diagnosed with autism due to you rbahiiur/actions so when then faced with a sw who has no professional experience or qualifications and relies on stereotypical views and discriminative opinions much lie hitler for example I have been classed by a sw as a black male with mental health

 u also go on to say I should as for an advocate they being there so I can challenge what a sw says and be heard why do I have to have an advocate and not be listened to anyway discrimination due to being autistic when un reality the sw needs help so they can understand the message a autistic person is trying to Coney. hope many sw don't write exactly what a asd says but put there own twist on it changing the context in which things are said coercively controlling and manipulating asd anxieties and beliefs also controlling behaviour if in a domestic relationship but professionals can get away with this. people in positions of power fail to accept that being a nice for the vocieless has never existed u can Make some depressed and demeaned by thinking your a nice for the voiceless when someone who I perfectly able to tell u how they feel and why but you are unwilling to take on boards u think u knowledge better normal nt behaviour. you may not of but you manager could of or colleagues and lack of whistleblowing due to discriminate behaviours is what a lot of sw lack due to not wanting to be a real nice for the voiceless which hLA policy caters for asd individuals who which sw framework assessment caters for asd parents 

Kicking anything in the household can be considered emotional abuse and/or violent. I have a real disdain for people that give autistic people a bad name by blaming violence on autism, like we all lack self-control. It is the rhetoric of journalists and defence lawyers to get a certain reaction from their audience, and generally very damaging to the rest of us. 

That being said, I'm glad you have your child back. I hope he has learned to control his outbursts so he isn't at risk of hurting himself or anyone else again. 

I still stand by that being autistic is not a reason in itself for social services becoming involved. Most of us who are parents will never have social services involved in our lives. There are usually a combination of factors, especially to meet thresholds of removing children which are actually very high (due to cost and availability of social care). I worked with adults and have never been able to just do what I want because I didn't like someone. It is a very difficult job. 

Kicking anything in the household can be considered emotional abuse and/or violent. I have a real disdain for people that give autistic people a bad name by blaming violence on autism, like we all lack self-control. It is the rhetoric of journalists and defence lawyers to get a certain reaction from their audience, and generally very damaging to the rest of us. 

That being said, I'm glad you have your child back. I hope he has learned to control his outbursts so he isn't at risk of hurting himself or anyone else again. 

I still stand by that being autistic is not a reason in itself for social services becoming involved. Most of us who are parents will never have social services involved in our lives. There are usually a combination of factors, especially to meet thresholds of removing children which are actually very high (due to cost and availability of social care). I worked with adults and have never been able to just do what I want because I didn't like someone. It is a very difficult job. 

Where I get advocate services do you know the number 

are u supposed to put people at a disadvantage or make sure everyone has the same advantage but reality very different to perception 

well all that if u was familiar with some people dont do jargon very confusing why its good to not generalise autistic people because what worked with one might not work with others every one of us is different but due to the differences we have an experience 

well thats another problem when with autistic individuals and ur a professional with experience u dnt see the problems......how is someone going to work with a stranger expectations - what if to work with that person properly they need to build a trusting relationship if they dnt find a solicitor looks like they dont care or not engaging again lack of support and failure to follow autism act 2009 so those professionals should be following. ALL there statutory laws which from time they interact with an autistic person they cross different law thresholds including discrimination by association alot of so called professional tell parents the minimum amount of information so they can reach there agenda kinda of like triangulation in a narcisttisc relationship only using colleagues who will support them reason for lack of MASH,MDT and wider agency work 

A legal "advocate" in England is a barrister or solicitor who argues cases in court. They must be legally qualified and hold a "practising certificate" from their professional body.

A lay advocate is someone who "speaks for" another person. The word is used for supporters and helpers and may be family members, friends, volunteers or paid helpers.

A lawyer will present your case in court and give you legal advice, but they are paid professionals, not your friends.

no im talking about an advocate that can do both as some people do have many skills and extensive knowledge can be very distressing to then be EXPECTED to work with a stranger who will have an insight but no factual information on the reality of that individual and there autistic behaviours and traits I am constantly met by professionals who say they haven't met someone with my characteristics. and as the autism act states professionals should work with friends and family NOT STRANGERS to gain expert knowledge of the person its law. they can then be appointed a legal advocate to help them with their rights if laws aren't being upheld. 

I presume you are talking about an advocate in the sense of a supporter rather than legal counsel. Normally if you are a party your solicitor will make arrangements with the justices' clerk. If you are a witness, there is a witness support service that will advise "vulnerable" witnesses - usually the solicitor calling you will make these arrangements. The details are on HM Courts Service website.

I was in a court room and the judge refused me an advocate so what should happen and what really happens are two different things 

Advocates are separate to social services, it isn't something that they are able to refuse. You also have a legal right to advocacy services if you have any need which would prevent you from being able to be fully engaged with social services and their assessment processes. 

Advocacy services are run by different agencies around the country so vary area by area. If you need help trying to figure out who your local service is then I'd be happy to try to help. 

Sorry I’m also replying to Michelle aswell as you. I didn’t realise 

You are so right. Our social worker manipulated my partner and didn’t understand his way of thinking. Social workers these days still don’t have the right training when autism is involved. Yes after his diagnoses and meetings with ASD professionals after 26 years of his life being undiagnosed he is slowly but surely understanding himself a lot more and learning each day to cope with himself. He also has ADHD so yes outburst can happen. Just because you say you have ASD doesn’t mean your on the same spectrum as someone else. There’s many spectrums of ASD and each one is different. 

Replying to Sw don’t get involved for people with autism. The post from the lady above stated that when she was pregnant she had anxiety ect and she sought help from a sw then one thing after another lead to her child being removed as she had autism. So yes they do. However in my case my jealous ex boyfriend was ringing police saying things happened at my home when they didn’t and we had witnesses to prove this, number of times the police came out the obv had to get in touch with sw. The social don’t listen to other people they only listen to police reports. We filed complaints as police didn’t take other people’s statements ect.  They only listen to what they’d want to listen to. They cherry pick at everything and take things further then they should instead of helping families which is what we asked for in the beginning. We missed out on nearly 1 year with our baby daughter. All because they couldn’t help and manipulated things. 

what happens when SW refuse advocates and you are left to source one yourself is this appropriate support 

so u have stated that autism is not a reason in itself to have your child removed howeer u are diagnosed with autism due to you rbahiiur/actions so when then faced with a sw who has no professional experience or qualifications and relies on stereotypical views and discriminative opinions much like hitler for example I have been classed by a sw as a black male with mental health...??

SW have refused mdt meetings a blatant refusal of work with wider agencies. a statutory obligation....worng or right... is not the purpose of social services to focus on the child and family and offer correct and appropriate support but u can only have u ever heard anyone talk about the impacts of domestic abuse on a asd relationship 

as u confirm people who think they are a voice for the voiceless parents, friends, doctors say what they thinks appropriate but this is based of what....qualified professional knowledge and training or opinionated discriminative opinions. this is often not what the autistic individuals wants or is required this is also backed up by a lot of research from asd individuals not being listened to.

why do they need their voice strengthened? if professionals were willing to take on board what they were saying and learn from service users and raise unjust policies as statutory obligated there would be no reason for an advocate in many cases but many SW do not see there policies as unjust and dont understand what indirect discrimination is. many SW ask hypothetical questions causing obvious difficulties with individuals with autism who see the world in.a black and white way. for example sw will this could happen ASD person replies like no that could never happen this or this will happen a sw will then make out the asd individual does not understand there concerns when in reality the sw does not understand the asd way of thinking as is then manipulating these anxieties and beliefs ????

No, I'm just genuinely struggling to read what you are saying because of your writing style. 

I've been autistic my whole life, I've been a social worker for far less time. What is really important to know is that depending on the role of a social worker, YOUR rights may not be their primary interest. For example, I've come from an adult social care background and first and foremost I represent the person who is being assessed, NOT their family. Sometimes their family members will want things that are in conflict with what the person wants or needs. Sometimes the person being assessed wants something different than what I advise. Advocates just strengthen the voice of the person they're working for and help them to express themselves. It's not a negative thing to involve an advocate at all. 

The benefit of adults having an advocate in children's proceedings is that they're focused on the parent's needs and feelings about what is happening, rather than the emphasis being on the child. 

It's really common for people to be angry at EVERY social worker when they've had a bad experience, but I genuinely try to share useful advice on this forum for people struggling with the social care systems. I'm not a children's social worker but my training covered it, and now I don't work as a social worker because I too had my own issues with the system. Advocacy services are independent to social services though and are a really valuable resource. It's optional though so if you don't want to explore that option of support then that's your decision. 

lol ok maybe the change of topic is difficult for u but if u break down each topic by yourself your understand  I stated people like u claim to be a voice for the voiceless.....I referred back to statements u have made too which u are unable to reply instead knowing autistic people suffer with sensory issues instead of wanting to clarify what is meant tell someone to seek an advocate when in fact if u was more empathetic and understanding you would of been able to understand what I meant but again like a normal sw time is limited etc etc so people who want to offload information are unable to as they have procedures and policies that they have to stick to which could be indirect discrimination in itself

An advocate would help you to share your views and to understand your rights in the system and what you need to do to challenge what they are saying about you. You refer to yourself as the voiceless, which is exactly what an advocate is for. It is very difficult to understand what you are trying to say in your messages so if you have the same difficulties verbally then it will benefit you that way too. Plus they are independent to social services so they are there for YOU and not the social worker's interests.

so u have stated that autism is not a reason in itself to have your child removed howeer u are diagnosed with autism due to you rbahiiur/actions so when then faced with a sw who has no professional experience or qualifications and relies on stereotypical views and discriminative opinions much lie hitler for example I have been classed by a sw as a black male with mental health

 u also go on to say I should as for an advocate they being there so I can challenge what a sw says and be heard why do I have to have an advocate and not be listened to anyway discrimination due to being autistic when un reality the sw needs help so they can understand the message a autistic person is trying to Coney. hope many sw don't write exactly what a asd says but put there own twist on it changing the context in which things are said coercively controlling and manipulating asd anxieties and beliefs also controlling behaviour if in a domestic relationship but professionals can get away with this. people in positions of power fail to accept that being a nice for the vocieless has never existed u can Make some depressed and demeaned by thinking your a nice for the voiceless when someone who I perfectly able to tell u how they feel and why but you are unwilling to take on boards u think u knowledge better normal nt behaviour. you may not of but you manager could of or colleagues and lack of whistleblowing due to discriminate behaviours is what a lot of sw lack due to not wanting to be a real nice for the voiceless which hLA policy caters for asd individuals who which sw framework assessment caters for asd parents