Society / People - Their behaviours and me. HELP!

Hi all, new to the forum so no doubt this may have been covered somewhere in past history but i'm in a bit of a 'stuck' place at the minute and have been so for the past 3 or 4 years and really looking for some advice as to how best get out of it.

I'm nearly 40 and on the face of it just a usual bloke who likes football and having a pint but i'm currently awaiting diagnosis for aspergers which will take anything up to 3 years. Initial interviews and questionnaires has confirmed i am on the spectrum and it is believed i may have high functioning aspergers which has allowed me to live a life that any NT could reasonably expect to live thus far. Trying to function as an NT all my adult life when you may have dominant aspergers traits has been an absolute nightmare but so far i've pulled it off. I have a NT partner and a young NT daughter and up until the past few years i worked in a public focussed role.

I'm paying for it now though, i have quite severe anxiety disorder (especially social and new situations) as well as being diagnosed with Chronic Fatigue Syndrome and other medical conditions which also tap into my positivity reserves. I am of the belief that the pure stress of trying to function effectively and in this world whilst at the same time being true to my strong autistic beliefs has finally caused my body to start cracking.

Anyway, my problem is simple. I have very strict and exacting standards of behaviour and conduct that i feel is inherent within me and when these are not displayed by others i get stressed, agitated and upset/angry. The problem is that the levels of poor behaviour, manners, consideration for others and common sense in our society in general is rife and i have no way of dealing with it. I cannot change it nor can i escape it. Therefore i need to try and find a way of dealing with it so that i may once again find the motivation to get out into the world again and 'tolerate' people once more.

As it is now i've given up. I have no interest in people anymore, they bore me and especially through working the past 20  years i have discovered that most are self preserving and disingenuous. I've resigned from jobs because morally what i was being asked to do was against what the organisation stood for and i wasn't able to do this. The rest of the staff and management decided their jobs were more important than doing the right thing.

Society is so alien to me.  I often feel that i am an alien put on earth as some sort of experiement to see how i get on. Obviously that's ridiculous but living amongst many people day in day out and the banality of life i do have to wonder. Even people who you least expect will ask you if you are on facebook or some other pointless internet sharing website where we can see the triviality of others lives and as soon as they have said that i have instantly made a decision that i need to restrict contact with this person a much as i can because immediately i have decided we have nothing in common.

I go to the cinema with my kid and grown adults are sat with their kids flicking through their mobile phones. That's bad enough but it's the lack of consideration for others. I am sensitive to the light given off by the phones in the dark cinema as it's distracting but now i no longer am able to sit and relax and enjoy the film with my daughter but now i have been put in a stressful position by someone else's inconsiderate behaviour whereby i have to either sit and endure this or go up and confront them about it. This happens every time i go.

I drive the 4 miles to my mums house to take her to the shops and i drive calmly to reduce my stress and try to be mindful at the same time. I drive at the speed limit usually but during my 4 mile trip i find myself having to pull over 4 or 5 times in order to let some idiot go past who is drving bumper to bumper with me. Again, i endure the stress of others behaviour for the 4 miles or i am inconvenienced into pulling over several times during the course of a car journey.This happens every time i go out anywhere in my car.

I take my little kid to school and mums and dads are fighting for parking space right outside the gates where if they set off 5 minutes earlier they could park around the corner, walk and talk with their child until they get to school and in addition they aren't causing disruption or a danger to children. The school have to call in the police and parking wardens to do something about the problem even though parents have been warned monthly in school newsletters. My daughters school is in a reasonably affluent area too. This happens every school day.

Summer comes and the barbecues come out in force. Not a problem with that generally but then the rap music makes an appearance at a hundred decibels. Why? Why is it not enough to be enjoying the company of your friends just chatting and laughing? Why has a barbecue got to be turned into some sort of dining / outside rave experience? There are other people in your street who want to listen to the birds outside and not some blinged up neanderthal making grunts and coarse sexual references every 2 seconds.

Again, these inconsiderate behaviours and lack of any standards in our society as i go about my daily life aren't just amongst the stereotypical ruffian types (i hate to stereotype but i just wanted to try and get the point across that selfishness and ignorance is rife in all sections of society and not just amongst groups of people you might at first think of (perhaps unfairly though) but across all areas of society and i can't tolerate it. I struggle to form friendships because basically if the other person is not pretty much identical to me in terms of outlook, morals and interests then i dismiss them. Customer service in this country is appalling, cleanliness and attention to detail in a lot of things are appalling.

So many apologies as this is turning in to a bit of rant which i never intended but basically i have got to the point where my limited interests and severe judgements of others has resulted in me not wanting to do anything because no matter where i go or what i do there will be an overwhelming percentage of people who i have to interact with who show behaviours or interests that i just cannot accept.

I think it's a case of i'm right and others are wrong if they don't agree with me which obviously cannot be the case but often i feel that i have to bring my kid up to be a self obsessed, material driven, arrogant, social media junkie because these are the traits that most people i come into contact with display to me and by being kind, considerate, humble, helpful, selfless, respectful she won't stand a hope in hell in fitting in with the world as it is now.

Of course i wouldn't do that, it's against my suspected aspie nature but if there are very few people out there like me then where do i go from here? Sorry, all a bit doom and gloom i guess but i don't want for it to be like that. I welcome your advice and experiences and to be honest, with the way in which successive Governments have let autistic people and their families fend for themselves the past God knows how many years, your input will do much to help. Don't soft soap, if you have a view on where i'm going wrong and i could benefit then please tell me. Thankyou.

  • And, of course, you get the nutters who will cynically accuse many people who see a GP over a mental issue as 'malingerers' and 'attention seeking.' As has already been said, the trouble with a mental problem is that it is often invisible, therefore, for some it doesn't exist. Even though someone may not have a severe problem on the AS it can, nevertheless, have a mojor impact on their life and the problem is unless they can identify what may be causing their unhappiness will simply put it down to anxiety and or depression and feel it is up to them to pull themselves together. I have often wondered why I can't seem to make changes in my life in order to make living a little more fullfilling and have agonized over my inability to do things other people seem to do easily. In the end, you assume it is because of some kind of character flaw and just accept it, which makes you feel something of a failure and inferior to other people. This is dangerous, since going through life without gaining an insight into one's nature can cause many years of suffering without much hope.

  • There is a difference between trained and educated. Trained people can do their job without necessarily understanding why they are doing it. Some people will work these things out but a lot of care is done on a rote basis.

    I think the fundamental problem is that mental health issues (not just autism) are invisible as you say and are much more difficult to understand and discuss compared to physical ailments. I broke my leg last year falling off my bike and consequently discovered I have bad arthritis so ended up with a hip replacement. For this sort of thing the NHS is very good - I had very good and very sympathetic care. The MH system is a cinderella service where diagnosis is much more of an art than a science (for very understandable reasons) and you practically have to be suicidal before you get much help. No point getting angry about this fact but it might motivate one to do what one can to help and fix it.

  • recombinantsocks said:

    When I was getting severe depressions, before my diagnosis, he didn't want to know.  I would get the usual 'Look on the bright side', 'count your blessings' comments - and that was all.  Following my diagnosis, I did my best to explain things to him, to show him literature, etc... but I might as well have been speaking ancient Greek to him!  He simply doesn't get it at all.  He'll say things like 'You need to get out more'.

    Unless you have been through depression, or have been trained to deal with someone with depression, it really is difficult (or possibly unreasonable) to expect them to know how to deal with this situation. A good place to start is to do some research and look at articles like www.psychologytoday.com/.../6-things-you-can-say-support-someone-whos-depressed or go to http://therecoveryletters.com/ where you can read the experiences who have gone through this. I had no idea about any of this for most of my life, I am learning (somewhat belatedly) how to do things that I didn't know anything about until now.

    As an autistic person with two years since diagnosis I still really struggle to explain what I am going through. Given that part of this package is communication problems it is well nigh impossible for us to explain (communicate) to non-autistic people what the problem is. I no longer expect people to get it at all - I don't really see how they can get it. What you can hope for (note the "hope" rather than "expectation") is to come across a small number of people who have enough empathy and sympathy to be a little more tolerant and accomodating of one's differences. Try to count the people that do get it rather than counting the number of people who don't get it and you have something to measure that can only go in the right direction. Treasure those people and nurture those relationships and don't resent the people that don't get it - they can't help it, it isn't deliberate or inconsiderate it is just that they don't see the need and don't know what to do.

    [/quote]

    Thanks for this.

    It's not that I resent him exactly, and I know just how difficult it can be to comprehend something you have no experience of.  The thing that gets me, though, is that because the condition is 'invisible', it's as if you are making it up.  You have nothing tangible to point to - apart from behaviours that aren't 'typical'.  Whereas, if I said to my brother 'I have a broken leg' or 'I have cancer', his approach would (hopefully) be entirely different. I don't know what it's like to have either of those things, but I'd do my best - as an autistic person - to empathise. 

    But yes, you're right.  And it is far better to value the people who try to understand and empathise than to get hung up on the ones that make no effort.

    It's interesting, you know... for the last 10 years, I've worked on and off in a variety of care settings with people with learning disabilities.  In that time, I've worked with highly-experienced and highly-qualified people.... and a good deal of those I've encountered just simply haven't got a clue regarding autistm.  They've all been supposedly adhering to a 'person-centred approach', but they clearly don't understand the term! For example, a few weeks ago, I had cause to take issue with a senior colleague who had done the lunch ordering for that day's clients.  She likes to offer choice, which is fair enough.  But for one particular autistic client, who doesn't like green vegetables, the 'choice' of veg she'd ordered was runner beans or garden peas!  When he later refused to eat his lunch, he was told 'If you don't like it, leave it.'

    It kind of proves your point.  Although we are talking about 'trained' people. 

  • Martian Tom said:

    When I was getting severe depressions, before my diagnosis, he didn't want to know.  I would get the usual 'Look on the bright side', 'count your blessings' comments - and that was all.  Following my diagnosis, I did my best to explain things to him, to show him literature, etc... but I might as well have been speaking ancient Greek to him!  He simply doesn't get it at all.  He'll say things like 'You need to get out more'.

    Unless you have been through depression, or have been trained to deal with someone with depression, it really is difficult (or possibly unreasonable) to expect them to know how to deal with this situation. A good place to start is to do some research and look at articles like www.psychologytoday.com/.../6-things-you-can-say-support-someone-whos-depressed or go to http://therecoveryletters.com/ where you can read the experiences who have gone through this. I had no idea about any of this for most of my life, I am learning (somewhat belatedly) how to do things that I didn't know anything about until now.

    As an autistic person with two years since diagnosis I still really struggle to explain what I am going through. Given that part of this package is communication problems it is well nigh impossible for us to explain (communicate) to non-autistic people what the problem is. I no longer expect people to get it at all - I don't really see how they can get it. What you can hope for (note the "hope" rather than "expectation") is to come across a small number of people who have enough empathy and sympathy to be a little more tolerant and accomodating of one's differences. Try to count the people that do get it rather than counting the number of people who don't get it and you have something to measure that can only go in the right direction. Treasure those people and nurture those relationships and don't resent the people that don't get it - they can't help it, it isn't deliberate or inconsiderate it is just that they don't see the need and don't know what to do.

  • recombinantsocks said:

    My experience with many NTs, though - and especially those in my close family - is that they make precious little effort in my regard.

    Do you know that these family members are actually NT? Autism often runs in families and undiagnosed autistic people can be the hardest people for someone with autism to deal with. My father and his siblings fought incessantly and, in hindsight, a lot of this was because they were all distinctly autistic.

    [/quote]

    It's a good point.  When I had my diagnostic assessment, I was asked if anyone in my family was autistic, or if they had mental health problems.  The only ones that could readily apply to are my parents.  My father, who is now dead, was plagued with insecurities his whole life.  He was also a chronic alcoholic.  But he was also a very kind and generous man, and he loved a social life.  He never felt happier than when he was surrounded by other people, and he was hugely popular.  As for my mother - she has had depression and anxiety issues in her life, but they were in large part (I think) connected with dad's problems. 

    Having said that... she seems to be the only one who 'gets' me.  Since my diagnosis, we've spoken a lot about autistic behaviours and traits, and she's said on a few occasions 'I'm like that'.  Again, though, she's always had an active social life and plenty of friends - though I know that isn't necessarily conclusive.

    My only other 'close' family member is my older brother.  He's my exact opposite.  Always popular at school, and good at school.  Always a team-player.  Always surrounded by friends.  His life is defined socially.  He can't stand to be alone.  When I was getting severe depressions, before my diagnosis, he didn't want to know.  I would get the usual 'Look on the bright side', 'count your blessings' comments - and that was all.  Following my diagnosis, I did my best to explain things to him, to show him literature, etc... but I might as well have been speaking ancient Greek to him!  He simply doesn't get it at all.  He'll say things like 'You need to get out more'.  He's happily married, enjoys a good income, has a comfortable life.  I know that's only on the surface, of course - but I can just tell that he looks upon me as a failure, using excuses to justify the fact that I earn minimum wage, have no friends, behave oddly (as far as he's concerned), etc.

    There's no genetic test for autism, sadly.  I can only add that, in relation to my aunts, uncles and cousins (except one cousin, who I definitely think is autistic), I'm the non-achiever, the loner, the black sheep.

  • @footyfooty:

    You are displaying a lot of autistic behaviours there! The preference for black and white rules and the inability to apply any give and take are clear signs. As you say, you need to get a balance and perhaps, quite deliberately, look for situations where going with the grey bit in the middle might be the happier path.

    One thing that I keep being told is to not do someone elses job. If you are in the cinema then you should complain to the ushers rather than directly to the other customer. The cinemas do not want people to be interrupted whilst watching the film and they should normally intervene and sort out this sort of behaviour.

    A lot of this takes time to re-program one's responses. Firstly you have to identify things you can improve but you can't expect to fix this overnight. I have had 56 years of learning bad habits and only 2 years since diagnosis to learn to adjust - I know I haven't got there yet but I think I am on a much better trajectory than before.

  • Martian Tom said:

    My experience with many NTs, though - and especially those in my close family - is that they make precious little effort in my regard.

    Do you know that these family members are actually NT? Autism often runs in families and undiagnosed autistic people can be the hardest people for someone with autism to deal with. My father and his siblings fought incessantly and, in hindsight, a lot of this was because they were all distinctly autistic.

  • Some excellent replies thanks everyone! Much appreciated! There are lots of posts that have mentioned subjects that i myself have already tried to use to my benefit. For example getting interested in Buddhism, i like the basic premise of trying to 'let go' of all negatives and uncontrollable events and learning to accept but again with this my issue is that what does one choose to accept and what does one choose to accept as unacceptable and therefore act upon? I don't want to become a doormat for the general population if you see what i mean?

    This ties in to my point about having issues with many peoples behaviour in society, for example the cinema example i gave. I hate confrontation but i also hate rudeness and somebody else's behaviour impacting on my life (with reasonable cause) and so the incident in the cinema makes me have to make a judgement call, do i accept it as 'just some ignorant idiot' and try and enjoy the film regardless (which, like Martian Tom has said, if you are distracted initially by something that is irritating then it's really hard to accept and continue as if the distracting thing wasn't even there. On top of that,i have burning inside of me the fact that what this 'offending' person is doing IS unacceptable and although it may on the face of it appear to be a trivial example ,i strongly believe that anyone who considers themselves a considerate and decent human being would realise that using a mobile phone in a cinema isn't considerate to others and therefore they need to be held to account.

    Look, i'm not the gestapo, there are some people who use their phones before the film kicks in and i'm ok with that and they do then put their phones away during the film so no problems there but the probem of phone use during the film happens every time and with more than one person. This again is another issue, the frequency of bad / inconsiderate behaviour as you go about your daily life. As i have said to friends and family, the events that i find so unacceptable happen many times daily and in many different circumstances. It's not just the odd isolated incident. The way i feel it best to live life without impacting on others is not shared by so, so many and when you are faced with the onslaught of complete morons on a daily basis then it causes so much stress, disillusionment and unhappiness.

    This brings me onto recombinantsocks's excellent point about autistic people being unable to understand NT's points of view. I'd not thought of it that way and it's a profoud point actually. That said, i tend to agree with Martian Tom purely because of my own experiences. I have a way of living my life that i feel causes nobody any distress or inconvenience, certainly not intentionally anyway. For example, i have a NT friend who occasionally parks in disabled bays / mother and baby bays in car parks despite not being entitled to much to my disgust and whilst you again might consider this as something to not even get worked up about, i happen to think that it's ignorant and inconsdiderate. He claims it's only for 5 minutes so he can nip in somewhere but in those 5 minutes someone with a genuine requirement for that space may need it.

    So we have a situation whereby the NT may not see he's doing anything too wrong whereas i am annoyed about it and i my sense of what is right and wrong overrides my system and i have some issues to sort out then within my own head. Do i castigate him or just tut and say nothing? My points of view and actions are always generally for the greater good and benefit of others and NOT myself - whereas the points of view and actions of, in this case my NT friend were for selfish reasons even though he felt strongly he wasn't causing any real problems.

    I went to the cinema one morning actually and saw this young girl park in a disabled bay and get her child out of the car seat and i explained to her that it was actually a disabled spot. She then proceeded to turn her daughter around to face me and then it became instantly clear that the child was obviously disabled. I was mortified! I didn't know where to put my face i was so embarrassed and apologised. She then proceeded to shout at me and get angry. This made me angry then because my actions were actually to stick up for people like her, to make sure that disabled parking bays are not abused by others so she would have space to park her car on another day to be able to get her child out with ease. It may look at though i am an interfering busybody but it's not the case. If it's wrong it's wrong and my points of view are based upon a framework that put others first which is where i am finding i differ from NT's in the main.

    Also i hate it when i park at the very back of the car park in acres of space and then when i return to my car someone has parked right next to me and worse still so their door is nearly touching mine and i have to turn into a pencil to access my own car. LOL

    I used to have a lot of problems with anger building and lack of assertiveness which i ahev had CBT for but now it's gone the other way now and i spend lots of time OVER - ACCEPTING things which has made me quite passive and apathetic. As though this is how it is, i can't do a damn thing about any of it and i'm just alive and have to navigate my way through it as best i can. I drive along just chuntering to myself "oh, another idiot" before flashing him for the 8th time that i'm letting him out of a junction then when he pulls out he ignores me. Par for the course on the roads. This i HAVE accepted that you can do nothign about.

    Anyway, apologies for the novel i've attempted to write but just to say that you have all made some greta points which i can go away and think about and i guess it's more about getting a balance between not being too sensitive to others ignorance and arrogance and deciding when the appropriate occasion is to confront someone if on a minor trangression i could try and ignore it and not be stressed by doing so. Listen, i'm far from perfect. We are all human beings and all make mistakes and do silly things myself included but i know in my heart of hearts that if i was Prime Minister then everything i do would be for others. I wouldn't last 5 minutes though.

  • recombinantsocks said:

    I struggle with anger, as Footyfooty does - the seemingly casual carelessness and selfishness of people, etc. 

    It strikes me as slightly contradictory if we complain about people's selfishness when we are renowned for failing to understand other people's points of view. Autism means, more or less, self centred. Perhaps other people are more autistic than we give them credit for?

    [/quote]

    I take your point.  But I don't think it's wrong to not understand someone else's point of view if their point of view is that it's fine to drop litter in the road, or jump a queue, etc.  I really do make an effort to consider other's points of view.  My experience with many NTs, though - and especially those in my close family - is that they make precious little effort in my regard.

  • Yes, the sensory inputs!  So many.  Social media is another 'input' that can be - for people like us - both very positive... and the opposite.

    I don't have any 'real life' friends.  Just acquaintances, like work colleagues.  Most of the people I value as friends - people on my wavelength - are people I've never met, on Facebook.  But, of course, the downside is that I find myself very easily drawn into discussions where - because of the social distance of not being face-to-face - things can boil up and over.  Sometimes, I'm ashamed to say, the anger has led me to be abusive to people.  Because I can be, because it's easy - because they're not there in front of me.  And, of course, the abuse comes back.  This is where it all becomes negative.  It's a social lifeline for me, but also a potential minefield.  I'm learning, from bitter experience, to switch off now.  To not take the bait.  To try to reach an 'agree to disagree' point with people.  Again, it's not easy because I find these things continually snagging in my brain, and keeping me awake at night.  I need to look more seriously at anger management for this reason.

    As for the way we can use modern tech - yes.  Except for the aforementioned problems experienced in the cinema.  It's not just the phone conversations, the lights, the beeping.  It's the cud-chewing sounds of popcorn ingestion, the rattling of sweet wrappers, etc (though we've always had these).  Most people I know can just tolerate them, and tell me I should try, too.  But I can't.  I'm just extremely sensitive to it.  I can pick out even the lowest, most insignificant sound and it'll affect my concentration.  Generally, what I now try to do is go on a weekday evening, when (usually in my local cinema) there are only a few people.  If I misjudge, and there are more people in than expected, I sit down at the front, where I can't see anyone else and the sound is louder.

  • Martian Tom said:

    I struggle with anger, as Footyfooty does - the seemingly casual carelessness and selfishness of people, etc. 

    It strikes me as slightly contradictory if we complain about people's selfishness when we are renowned for failing to understand other people's points of view. Autism means, more or less, self centred. Perhaps other people are more autistic than we give them credit for?

  • And of course it is a feature of religions that people will go off into the wilderness, to a monastery or up a pole to get away from the sensory inputs of the day. Perhaps some of the people that thrived in those environments were on the spectrum too? Modern tech can be used - noise cancelling headphones, dark glasses etc can allow one to be alone amid the comotion of daily life.

    PS Pole sitting for those that haven't come across this idea... en.wikipedia.org/.../Stylite

  • Well, people on the AS are particulary vulnerable of, course, due to the sensory problems they have to deal with and although I don't know very much about Buddhism, etc., I would guess such religions seek enlightenment through self-knowledge and one's relationship with the world. Much more straightforward in more simpler cultures that have existed in past eras but today's complex world presents many more challenges so it seems even more important to find some compromise between our inner and outer worlds. I suppose this is why things like meditation and mindfullness can be of great benefit.

  • Completely agree, recombinantsocks.  I, too, like the Buddhist view that we can accept that we all have these thoughts and feelings inside of us - anger, jealousy, greed, sadness, etc - and such acknowledgment and acceptance can lead us to enlightenment and (eventually) 'Buddhahood'.  I'm not a Buddhist, but I like the philosophy.  It's the only major religion that makes any sense to me.

    I struggle with anger, as Footyfooty does - the seemingly casual carelessness and selfishness of people, etc.  The inequality in the world.  The suffering.  The bigotry and violence. I agree with you, though, that it doesn't lead anywhere and can make one ill.

    I've tried various things myself.  CBT, assertiveness training, meditation, Mindfulness.  I can find some measure of acceptance.  As well as this, I try to channel these feelings through writing.  I often find that by writing down what I think about a thing, and trying to look at it from various angles, I can actually 'write out' some of the anger.  I suppose a lot of my anger can come from my own sense of inadequacy in an argument.  I often find myself wrong-footed by people who might challenge my way of thinking and feeling about things.  I then become angry with myself for letting myself down - and angry with them for exposing my weaknesses of judgment and thought.  I suppose the true answer is not to 'get into the ring' with people, or - as people often say - let them 'take up space rent-free' in my head.  It's not easy.  But I think we have to accept that there are people out there who will always disagree with us, put us down, make us feel bad about ourselves.

    The answer, perhaps, is to use these challenges as opportunities for further thought, and seek a level of self-acceptance that we can be happy with.  And to live by our principles as far as possible.  To set some form of example... and let others make of it and take from it what they will.

    It's also important to try to be flexible in our thinking - and that's often a tough one for us, of course, because of how we're wired!

  • Hi Footyfooty

    When I became aware that I was neurodiverse, after reading a lot about being on the autistic spectrum I began to think: surely it's not just us that have problems? I wondered what makes NTs behave like they do and how their minds develop and function compared to ours.

    I found a fascinating book called "A field guide to Earthlings - An autistic / asperger view of neurotypical behaviour" which explained a lot (it's available on Amazon) and I've also found this website: actingnt.blogspot.co.uk/.../neurotypical-syndrome-played-straight.html

    I avoid having to deal with NT's as much as possible, particularly in a social setting. I get the bus to work (have never driven, too much hassle) and read the news / blogs, etc on my phone to focus my attention away from the other people on the bus (some people use headphones for this). Luckily I have a job where I work mostly on my own so don't need to interact with others much, but I have practised small talk over the years and so can hold my own on basic things like how are you, the weather, clothes (with the other females), food and TV programmes / movies I've seen recently (although I choose more "mainstream" ones like Benidorm, rather than more specialist ones like Dr Who) 

    I never go to work social functions (suffered this for years before deciding I had to do what I wanted, not what others expected) and spend my evenings at home with my husband (also an Aspie), reading, watching TV / movies, chatting, making meals together or sometimes getting a takeaway delivered.

    A lot of my shopping is now done on line as going round shops is physically exhausting for us and we will often end up getting tetchy with each other. 

    I know you have the extra challenge of having a child to take care of, but maybe you could do more things with them at home?

  • This line of thinking is a core part of many religions and societies and I think that it probably lines up with one of the levels of enlightenment in buddhism if I understood it correctly. (the trouble with religions is often that people view their religion as superior to any other religion and they use this to start wars which entirely defeats the goal of reducing anger)

    Another thing, that is worth pointing out at this point, is that you can direct this argument at yourself. Is there any point with being angry with yourself? A lot of us are very critical and we can turn that criticism on ourselves when it really does no good.

  • rbs, reading through your post certainly does strike a chord with me. When I look back I realize now how easily I could get upset about stuff that other people didn't really worry about and now I can see why. When you have knowledge about your underlying nature it is easier to keep things in perspective and realize it is partly you that is creating the anger and, therefore, to take more control of yourself. When you think it is always someone elses fault that makes you angry you feel justified in losing control and blaming others. I now try to look at the point of view of other people more because I realize my reactions can often be out of proportion to events. That's not to say, of course, that other people are never at fault but now I am able to take a more balanced view of life, something which possessing self-knowledge allows you to do. 

  • Hi Guys,

    I've only just looked at this thread and am struck by the fact that no-one has mentioned anger management.

    I entirely get where footyfooty is coming from and, like everyone else on the thread, have been through exactly those feelings and frustrations.

    I was given a book on anger management a few years ago (for the very obvious reasons!) and actually found that it contained one nugget of information that stuck with me.

    The only affect of anger is to make yourself ill/sad/angry.

    It is a very pointless emotion most of the time. If you can decide to pity the other unfortunate wretches rather than being made angry by them I think you can find a happier path through life.

  • I know what you mean Footyfooty. I haven't been to see a movie for ages because people seem so inconsiderate nowadays in terms of making unneccesary noises and comments during the show. I know there's bound to be some noise because that's unavoidable and, after all, when in a public place you have to make some allowances, but it's the sheer selfishness of some people who only think about themselves that make my blood boil and spoils the experience for me.

    I also had problems, when I was working, with certain individuals who would were loud and rude and dreaded having to be alone with them, let alone with others present. I tried to tell myself not to be so sensitive and make allowances but this proved to be very difficult because you knew what was coming and this would put me in a very tense state. I daresay I could be annoying to others too but at least I tried to be reasonably considerate but you can't always know what someone is thinking about you at the time.

    Also, being too fussy, any change in my working environment such as an unpleasant smell or a persistent noise would cause anxiety and make it difficult to focus on the task at hand. What irritates me is seeing drivers using cell phones when it is now clearly against the law to do so and very dangerous to life and limb.

  • Hi again Footyfooty,

    I don't know if you're familiar with Craig Raine's famous poem 'A Martian Sends a Postcard Home'... but here's my recent take on it!

    A MARTIAN SENDS A POSTCARD HOME 2016
    (with apologies to Craig Raine)

    Smart-phones are electronic gadgets with many apps
    and most are treasured for their frivolousness –
    they cause the brains to melt
    and the body to contort in a stoop.

    I have never seen one fly, because
    mostly they perch on the hand.
    Humans use them all the time.
    It's all they ever seem to do.

    They don't use Caxtons much
    any more.

    They'll be a pushover...