Let me say from the start that I have a strong faith and although I’m willing to discuss it, I have not started this thread to try and evangelise anyone. Simply I’d like to discuss with other autistic Christians how they cope with church, other Christians and trying to resolve their head around everything.
I've seen it argued that the existence of penguins is evidence of a loving God, because no animal like that could arise by sheer chance...
It all goes back to the adam and eve model in genesis. Adam and Eve are male and female created by design to reflect God in his image and who he is. So the angel called Lucifer or Satan chose to rebel and chose to take some buddies with him to work out their purposes on earth banished by god from heaven. Satan seduces Adam and eve so do their own thing in their own way for their own glory and purposes rather than live gods ways. We have inherited that system of choice and it defines humanity. We chose to rebel against what is Gods way and plan. No person is born innocent. Not even a baby. We have to actively chose to do good and follow god because we are now genetically flawed thanks to Adams choice. So all the sin in the world is ultimately mans responsibility and fault. To consider god in who he is or anything about him is an act of faith. We have to chose to believe in the unseen and take him at his word or nothing. simply live our own created world order with our own chosen values and our own chosen outcomes. That ultimately results in spiritual and physical death.
There is no man generated logic that allows for the existence of god because outside of salvation there is no incentive to acknowledge god at all. Because that was the choice we have from adam. Unless you can accept a need for god or a desire to know him then there is no hope of relationship. God leaves the initiative to us to seek him unless you experience the impact of his spirit to connect then that that's it.
My experience was that god pursued me and I experienced conversion. Now I read mike parsons teaching on how to connect to god in a different way through tongues and other formats that complement my autistic nature. Worldly thinking and values are not designed to be autistic friendly. Knowing god inside of me helps me to find completeness security and hope. These values I have not detected in worldly systems or philosophies or religions. Ultimately in god you earn or thrive for nothing. you just receive grace. unearned or merited favour and more relationship with God.
Religions give you a format of believe and a practice with other people they dont provide a solution to the fallen human condition. you need an active relationship to deal with that one. Hope this helps this is my picture of the answer to your of whether you should believe. The why is up to you. everyone needs to see god for themselves. Answer the question yourself.
I agree with StephenHarris, but I wasn't brought up in the church. I was an atheist until the age of 24, and only set foot in a church then because I was having a personal crisis. A work colleague (who I was shocked at the time to find was a Christian) invited me along. But while I was there I mixed with people who really believed, for the first time. In my family, no-one said "Jesus" except as a swear word.
Gradually I got to a point where I wanted to believe, but couldn't see how to. I could accept that Jesus probably existed, and was a great teacher, but not the Son of God. Then one day I had a "lightbulb" moment, when I realised that, if there really was a God who had had brought into being the whole universe, that the stuff about the virgin birth, the resurrection and the miracles was peanuts by comparison. The next Sunday, during the time of prayer, I prayed (silently) that if God was really there He would somehow show me, because I needed to know. Within seconds, I felt a sense of peace and calm come over me like I had never known, and I felt sure that it was God. I know that probably sounds a bit naff to an unbeliever, because it would have done to me before.
Regarding your earlier message, the best I can say is that people have been created with free will, and as such can (and do) make either good or bad (sometimes very bad) choices. But following the teachings of Jesus helps me personally.
I have to have some hope that there is something better after we die. I was brought up in the Church and without its moral grounding, I don't know what I'd be like.
Awesome.... Not many autistic people are religious. I'm not at all but would love to debate it with you.
I just can't logically believe there is a god/s. To me it makes no sense to create imperfect life by design. Unless god isn't perfect & punishing all mankind for Adam&Eve mistake is like punishing you for WW1 warcrimes. You are innocent and were not alive but it's your fault anyway....
I'm not challenging your faith, just don't understand how to believe.
18! //
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You and me alike. I was once sat on a bench looking out to sea with my daughter asleep in my car behind me and I just wanted to walk into the sea and keep on walking. The lord tapped on my shoulder and said “she needs you” and that snapped me out of it and I went back to the car and became a better father.
Does raise the interesting question as to what an autistic friendly church would look like and an autistic friendly service would be like?
I used to love an evening service we used to have where a bible account was read, and then everybody got a chance to give their thoughts about what it meant for them, or to ask questions about it. Those of us who knew the Bible well could help those who did not, just as hose who did not got to help those who did ~ in terms of new and old insights being shared aplenty.
Although I must add this Sunday service was more for the younger congregation, and which sadly ceased some years back due to a new Vicar taking over, as the old one was retiring.
I totally agree, especially with the ego bit. Early Christians hid. im more into finding a church that preaches the Bible lol
we are meant to confess our faults to one another (James 5:16) but our sins only to God (1 John 1:9) as we are only human...we will either judge or temp one another. (Romans 14:13-23)
I'll just say that if it wasn't for my faith, I'd have probably attempted suicide by now.
Thanks for your message, I will try the book you recommend. I have always struggled in social situations, but have only recently found out that I might have Asperger's syndrome. Although it is easier at the church, perhaps because many of the people there are actively trying to be inclusive and polite, I still have never really felt like part of it. I always assumed it was my fault.
Let them know this impact on you and if it persists the stop going. In the bible it teaches being tolerant of each other then that has to be practiced or its not real Christian living. Jesus expects us through the spirit to practice and demonstrate what love is. We need the space and freedom to be ourselves and not feel condemned about it.
I have found the following book helpful. Peterson, Toby Autism and prayer. From my point of view is a crunch point. Its where it all starts and finishes. AS is a different way of existing that mostly in the church don't get. My experience is at 51 and going through assessment now. I have been a Christian since 19. To the outside world this does not matter. To me it is everything and just the start. The whole church experience is for a neuro typical one because the mind set is roman in its origin. it is controlling and it conformist in its spiritual roots. So mostly established churches will by default will be conformist to a certain pattern. o identify the pattern and decide whether you fit into it. Then comes the whole interaction bit. If you know you are an aspie and are comfortable with sharing then inform the people around you that matter if their behaviour or conversation bothers you. God will drive the lonely into relationships and community and fellowship because we exist to demonstrate part of gods nature that Nero typicals cant show. Don't use your condition as an excuse but an explanation. Master your senses and your abilities and plough them back into god. Be obsessed about knowing and finding and experiencing God. Know and be comfortable in your own unique and god given body. Explore your senses to relate to the community of god in a level that many church folk don't even know exists. I follow Mike Parsons who has some useful teaching on self identity. Know your enemy. Satan is there to lie kill cheat so recognise how he does that in you and stop him. up till last year I was on anti depressants. not any more don't need them and no condemnatory thinking gone. with this assessment and using the 50 question online assessment I have Partnered with the spirit to allow transformation peace joy and self control. Paul went into the dessert and found himself before doing mission and the same for Jesus. They are my role models. church is an okay physical experience but I cant do the whole relating the church people thing anymore. I just go for the worship and being with the body as a whole. IF people chose to want to know me for who I am and what I am then that's different but I don't go looking for it. I look for the most charismatic expression of the body because that's where the most tolerance is of the unusual and where mostly the more genuine Christian folk hang out. Ive attended a lot of stuff in my Christian walk. there is more to the Christian experience than is encountered in churches today and aspies are part of the key to helping the church unlock more.
I have found the following book helpful. Peterson, Toby Autism and prayer. From my point of view is a crunch point. Its where it all starts and finishes. AS is a different way of existing that mostly in the church don't get. My experience is at 51 and going through assessment now. I have been a Christian since 19. To the outside world this does not matter. To me it is everything and just the start. The whole church experience is for a neuro typical because mind set and it is roman in its origin. So mostly established churches will by default will be conformist to a certain pattern. o identify the pattern and decide whether you fit into it. Then comes the whole interaction bit. If you know you are an aspie and are comfortable with sharing then inform the people around you that matter if their behaviour or conversation bothers you. God will drive the lonely into relationships and community and fellowship because we exist to demonstrate part of gods nature that Nero typicals cant show. Don't use your condition as an excuse but an explanation. Master your senses and your abilities and plough them back into god. Be obsessed about knowing and finding and experiencing God. Know and be comfortable in your own unique and god given body. Explore your senses to relate to the community of god in a level that many church folk don't even know exists. I follow Mike Parsons who has some useful teaching on self identity. Know your enemy. Satan is there to lie kill cheat so recognise how he does that in you and stop him. up till last year I was on anti depressants. with this assessment and using the 50 question online assessment I have Partnered with the spirit to allow transformation peace joy and self control. Paul went into the dessert and found himself before doing mission and the same for jesus. They are my role models. church is an okay physical experience but I cant do the whole relating the church people thing anymore. I just go for the worship and being with the body as a whole. IF people chose to want to know me for who I am and what I am then that's different but I don't go looking for it.
Sorry, got a bit defensive there. No offence was taken.
There are two verses in the bible that always make me laugh when I think about what it means to be a Christian on the spectrum. They are:
John 17:16 They are not of the world, even as I am not of it. (Because of the whole 'other planet' feeling, this one could have been written for Aspies)!
1 Corinthians 9:22 I have become all things to all people so that by all possible means I might save some. (This reminds me of how we mirror other people to fit in).
Of course they are both verses out of context but they still make me smile.
I am a theology student and for one of my essays I would really like to explore how churches could better support us. I wonder if anybody on here might be interested in answering some questions, and if there might be a way I could distribute them that wouldn't break the community rules? It wouldn't be until the New Year so plenty of time to figure it out :)
To be honest I do not think anyone benefits from ultra long sermons, except perhaps the minister’s ego.
As for church seating, I have an intense dislike of forward facing rows of seats as they do not allow inclusive worship, far from it. Early Christians shared worship and fellowship over meals not sat facing a minister.
Does raise the interesting question as to what an autistic friendly church would look like and an autistic friendly service would be like?
Sorry it wasn’t meant as any sort of criticism, just a question, it’s difficukt to know what to say about such issues as trying to do something can also make things worse as I found out with my daughter’s primary school.
I just find it upsetting myself when another Christian gets put off.
