After CAMHS - what's next?

No worries.  Just hate injustice.

Oh you are goooooood.  You are really good.  Thank you Intense World xx

You could also hint at the fact that even if things get delayed until it's too late (i.e. his course end) you will be looking at recouping costs for private support (even if that's not being accessed) and compensation for distress caused (especially if he fails or does badly at his course as a result of their failings).  Impress that you are still looking to work with them for a remedy before resorting to going down "other routes".

Perhaps if you hint at legal action (maybe by saying something like "I am now taking further action due to your failure to respond") that you would rather avoid, by coming to an acceptable solution together it might buck them up a bit?  It's always wise as well, to give reasonable deadlines in letters, as to when you want their response by.  Otherwise they could claim you didn't state when you needed to hear.

Thanks Intense World, I really appreciate your help.  I keep referring to them in writing of how they're breaking the law, and that's when they stop responding to my emails and calls for weeks on end.  They're hoping that by the time they are actually pulled up for it, Dan will have left.  He's in the very final stages of his course now so even if he refuses to quit, they don't have long to carry on witholding support and get away with it. :(  The director keeps promising answers but it's early days there and CAMHS aren't helping with the time they take to arrange this training session for the tutors (although they have been amazing in what they've offered, it's when that's the issue).  That LSP and Section 139a have been in place since May last year, nearly a year and not one strategy has EVER been used. :( 

Denying all knowledge seems very deliberate as they know they have messed up.  As you say, you have official evidence.  They don't appear to have a leg to stand on, even if there has been a change of staff etc. the evidence would have been in his file.  I didn't know what an LSP was so looked it up: http://www.connexions-bs.co.uk/main.php?section=5275 according to this they cannot deny knowledge:

"When are Learner Support Plans completed?

The Learner Support Plan is normally completed in the final years of compulsory education. It can be later — if, for example, the young person stays in school for sixth form.

The Learner Support Plans are completed following discussions with the young person, their parent/carers, school staff and any other professionals that may be involved. This will be timed to link in with application to colleges or training providers.

When the completed plan has been agreed, the PA will send the Learner Support Plan to the college or training provider.

Parents/carers will receive a copy of the Learner Support Plan before it is sent to colleges or training providers."

Send a copy of the above and the below to the Director that is investigating - they have and are clearly breaking the law!

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/269341/Equality_Act_2010_-_advice.pdf

"Reasonable Adjustments

8.4 Schools as employers are under the same duties to make reasonable adjustments in relation to disability for their employees or potential employees as they are for their pupils as set out in Chapter 4 (4.12 – 4.20). They must make reasonable adjustments to arrangements or practices to alleviate disadvantage and must also take reasonable steps to provide any necessary auxiliary aids and services. They are also under the duty to consider alterations to physical features of the school where that is reasonable to avoid disadvantage caused by disability."

Just a quick update to say that it has gone through as a formal complaint and we've met with the director of that "school" of the college and laid out some plans.  Can't see anything working as now teachers and course leader are saying the interventions that were on his LSP from May last year were never there and they want written proof that he needs them even though they've already been given it in the Section 139a, two meetings (one with CAMHS there), an updated LSP and the support service saying he has to have them.  He has been refused ALL methods, earphones, time outs, sensory strategies, all of them and now they're saying noone has ever mentioned them to them, their minds and memories are totally blank.  They say they're waiting for CAMHS to confirm he actually needs any help - so have entirely ignored the CAMHS OT report, his diagnosis letter and the new LSP.  They're stalling to make him quit.  I've passed all this on to their director and they're looking into it.  Sorry for boring everyone with the updates.

Thanks!  Well it has all got a bit interesting.  

I put in a formal complaint by email (given the urgency) addressed to the course leader but CC'ed to her boss, the head of the School of English and Maths and our Learning Support contact who's on the autism team there on Tuesday and have not heard back from any course-specific staff.  I did make it clear that it would not go down well if we heard he was formally disciplined for issues outside of his control when he came back into college yesterday (for the meeting with the manager of the building, the man involved).  I did receive a near-immediate reply by phone from the autism team contact, who said her boss had read the email with her and also was making an email complaint to back ours, as noone has contact the autism team once, not in response to a meltdown/running off, not in response to their requests for information or updates.  Apparently the boss was also fuming about the language used.  So I was quite grateful that they'd responded so quickly and it shows the message got through.

Another bit of proof that the email got through was the response the next morning in their behaviour.  Dan went (alone against my guidance) to the meeting and as he went in, the course leader and her boss came out.  Dan received no formal discipline, but was told he had to change his behaviour.  

He came home in quite a hyped up, overload state.  He was very relieved the meeting was done and he'd been allowed back in class, but clearly that relief was meaning all that pent up anxiety was coming out.  He'd also had a runin with the other autistic boy involved, who told Dan and the others he has cancer, which has turned out not to be the case.  More drama!  It's hard because I sympathise a lot with his mistake in claiming that, clearly he wants people to like him, but sadly Dan doesn't sympathise at all because he's black and white in those respects and didn't want to speak to him.  So there was added anxiety there because he didn't want to fight with him either but couldn't face him while he felt he was doing something wrong.  

When he got home it was clear he was offloading more energy than normal.  He was rocking from foot to foot (which he does when wound up, hyper, arguing, stressed) and his face was twitching again.  He also does something which I feel might be a complex motor tic (maybe others could say what they think on this if they read it?).  It's a set of movements where he puts his hand, bent at the fingers into a right angle, and brushes his hair off his face, or the skin of his face, as he talks.  He is not aware he has done it when I mention it (and I've learned when not to mention it at all).  It's as if he's awkwardly brushing his hair off his face, and it didn't strike me as obviously when his hair was long, but even when it was short he still did it.  His hair is long again now because he can't stand having it cut!  It's always his right hand, and he does it excessively, sometimes brushing it over his mouth too when talking.  I can't for the life of me make my mind up whether it's a tic or sensory seeking.

Talking of sensory seeking though, he was doing a lot of that last night too, chewing, rocking, etc.  Even with his melatonin he didn't go to sleep til after 4am.  I'm knackered lol!  Obviously because of this and because I have to take (and sleep off) strong meds too, we both accidentally slept in.  That said, Dan was awake in plenty of time to go, but reluctant to get up and actually go.  He got in at 10:30am and in my book college were very lenient in letting that be an authorised absence.  I don't know how to get through to him that if he wants to remain on this course like *HE* insists on, he has to be on time every day, particularly if he wants to progress as that may come down to tutor discretion on the sports course he wants to do (as he might not achieve the right grade in English to get on without leniency from the sports tutor).

Today he came home much quieter, in a more calm mood, without any reports of drama.  He says the man that was involved has said to go to him when he needs time out, but not sure that's in his best interests as he really needs to go somewhere where he can be alone and not stimulated more.  We'll see.  I finally got a reply from my Monday call to CAMHS (?!) - yet again the receptionist hadn't passed on the messages (and I am inclined to agree as Dan's OT is normally very quick to respond, even if I call literally at closing time, she'll ring back in the evening).  This is the good news bit coming up.

She said that one of her team (OTs) has just got back from some really intense sensory training in brand new methods of assessment.  Now, did I tell you they'd said CAMHS here don't normally do sensory profiling any more and the psychologist told me I'd have to research SPD myself and treat him myself without a diagnosis because of this?  Well all hail the new training, as the OT on arriving back asked for one case to try the new methods (it won't get rolled out for some time) and guess who got put forward by everyone?  Yup, Dan.  Now I know a few of you might think it's a bad thing to be a guinea pig for these new methods but if they're brand new, and the choice is the newest methods or no methods, then I'll go with the first option for him.

They're also going into college around the 25th to "educate" them (the same day we will all be there to feed back the reports to them).  I'm relishing that because the course leader claims every teacher there is extensively trained in autism to the highest degree and doesn't need to hear from a lowly parent what it's like for her son.  *Ahem* bull!  

Then I (and hopefully my hubby if he can make it around his support at the local blind charity) will be getting some one to one training on Dan's sensory needs, and anything else I want to ask them to help me plan in his care.  AND alongside that Dan's getting what I'd already shared with you - one to one in college (as much to make sure the college behave as to help Dan with his social skills and emotional vocabulary) for 6 weeks, followed by a 6 week "Positive Transformations" course (NLP and hypnosis) at CAMHS.  I can't even begin to say how much his care has turned around there since the old care coordinator got taken off casework and put back in an office.  The OT who is Dan's care coordinator now, is just lovely, really really lovely, as is the member of the team she manages who did Dan's assessments.  They really have pushed the boat out.  I know it's still early days but the old one dragged her feet, lost files, never contacted us, and generally kept us waiting for 6 months messing the job up, and after a month long "no man's land" period of noone coordinating, the new one got his diagnosis sorted from a really in depth OT assessment and pushing for psych appointments within ONE month.  I know it would've taken longer without the ADOS having been done way back at the start, but the mismanagement since meant that was revisited and reassessed by the head psych on the new coordinator's pushing.  I now pray to her as a God.  XD

Sorry for War and Peace again and sorry we've strayed so much from the title of the thread.  Thank you all again.  xxx

I doubt they can legally exclude/suspend him for a meltdown which is part of his disability.

Maybe you should quote them the well-worn adage: "if you've met one autistic person, you've met one autistic person".  Ask them if every individual with a heart attack gets the same symptoms.  They really need educating.  Maybe you can send an "and another thing" addendum... 

Hi everyone!

Thank you so much urspecial and IntenseWorld, you are both lovely.  

College wise everything hit the fan yesterday because Dan had a meltdown at college and staff handled it badly.  He ended up in a real state, but he's ok now, although they have suspended him for today which I'm not happy about.  Took him 5 hours of rocking in foetal position in bed to calm down.  I was foaming and have made a formal complaint, very much in depth and holistic in that it includes all our concerns about what's happening or not happening there.  They didn't even ring me and then when I rang them, the things they said were pretty abysmal.  There's another autistic boy who was involved and he calmed down and apologised so if Dan "really has autism he has no excuse not to act exactly the same as him".  "It's totally ridiculous that he's scared of Malcolm, he's not an ogre and Dan has no excuse for pretending to be scared of him to get out of trouble", "Dan should act exactly like everyone else", "Dan is lying about a section 3, there's no such thing, I don't even know how he would've come up with that" (and then going on to say he may get a Level 3 disciplinary - hello, that's obviously what he meant!).  Accused him of lying to me about a certain boy being present as he's no longer a student, despite knowing he was there and teachers have confirmed it, AND Dan didn't even tell me he was so wasn't lying at all.  It was just awful.  So it is all in the complaint and it's a formal complaint.

He's had a full OT assessment, which was really good and in depth.  Really grateful for the SS advice and for the 139a extra bobbins advice as his consultant paed wants him doing extensive daily exercise to lower his anxiety and hyperactivity levels, which he was doing before Christmas as part of his course but is now down to twice a week.  He stays in most of the time outside of college, so we have been hunting down things he might engage in.  

Managed to swing him a placement in a football coaching club on a Friday afternoon, and (because they know he wants to coach) they've said they're looking for two of the students to be picked to do a coaching award through the NUFC foundation.  That's a big deal!  Dan's very excited!

Sorry this is compact tonight, I must have repetitive strain from that email complaint.  I'd copy and paste it in here but it might crash the server, it's that long haha!!   

Hi Kathy,

Urgh, I know the feeling moving on from NHS Children and Adolescent's Mental Health Service (CAMHS).

First things first, I would push for a full assessment by the Occupational Therapists (OTs) and/or Child and Adolescent Psychiatrist. This is to look into his needs (e.g. lack of social skills, vulnerable to "mate crime" etc) and areas of particular weaknesses due to his Autism (i.e. get sensory/motor skills etc assessed as part of the assessment if you can).

The reason why I am pushing towards some assessments/reports from OTs etc at CAMHS as this can then help with referral to children social services.

As Dan is 16 he is as Intense World said legally a Child in the eyes of Social Services (SS). They may try to fob you off but they are their responsibility, again I'm just repeating what Intense World has already mentioned.

I would say to SS that Dan is a "Child In Need". This means that from a legal point of view he has a "mental disorder of any kind" and in SS law this means he is disabled and therefore a child who is in need (i.e. of support etc). You can find out more about this on the National Autistic Society's (NAS) partner charity website (Council for Disabled Children - and look for their free electronic Legal Handbook). You may also wish to call NAS or try other charities such as Contact a Family. You can also search for my posts on this forum regarding SS and advice from the legal handbook. I have also given advice about Section 139 Assessments too. As Dan is not offically at the college, from what I gather then you could try exploring specialist colleges prehaps.

Have you also looked at the "training" part of the Section 139A Assessment which could include things like:  

- Vocational training,

- Recreational training,

- Physical training,

- Social Training   for Dan.

There are no definitions of what "training" or "physical training" etc actually mean. So social training could mean to include lessons from a provider to teach Dan social skills, confidence building etc. The charity Disability Rights UK can offer more advice on this and specialist colleges. They may be able to offer advice regarding the Connexions issue as they usually conduct the Section 139A assessments. Best to email or call their free student support line, which is open at selected times during the week and is displayed on their website.

You can approach SS with his diagnosis alone as things stand at this moment in time but as you've indicated he may have other issues too, it's well worth to put the time investment now.

I hope this helps,

urspecial.

BTW his "progression coach" is not qualified to comment on his autism status!  Next time they make such a comment, say "Oh, I didn't realise you had qualified as a clinician!"

Look here for an NAS document:

http://www.autism.org.uk/global/content/search%20results.aspx?q=camhs

"You-Need-To-Know-QA-For-Parents-About-CAMHS.pdf"

Education support for people with autism is now confirmed for people up to the age of 25:

http://www.autismeye.com/overhaul-of-sen-confirms-education-to-25/

He is not legally classed as an adult until the age of 18 so social services can offer him support and then at the appropriate time they can pass him on to adult services.

Here is information once he reaches 18: http://www.autism.org.uk/living-with-autism/at-home/caring-and-planning-for-the-future/parents-of-adults-with-autism-your-rights.aspx

So until that time, he is legally a child and they have to support him whether they like it or not.

Ahh I see thank you very much for clearing that up for me! 

Hiya :)

CAMHS is Children and Adolescent Mental Health Services, who are the place you get diagnosed at up here.  A Section 139a is what they call the college version of a Statement of Special Educational Needs - both outline a child's extra needs within a learning environment, and are legally binding. 

Technically I was wrong calling them CAMHS as they have recently changed their name to CYPS, Children and Young People's Services xxx

Hi kathym

I was wondering what CHAMHS is? And what section 139a is? Please? Thanks

I forgot to add something that's quite relevant to my fears when it comes to Dan moving out.  Both myself and my husband are also disabled - my husband is blind and I have neurological problems meaning I am often in a wheelchair or laid up with chronic pain.  Ideally Dan would want to live with us forever but that's my wish not his, and in reality he has a girlfriend he has had for over 18 months (who is lovely, sweet, caring and understanding but also young like him) and he wants them to make a home together eventually.  I'm not sure she would feel the same if she was in the thick of it as she's not that aware of his issues - she knows he is autistic and she does her best to keep him safe but I don't think she knows the extent of it all.  I know she loves him dearly though.