Published on 12, July, 2020
All her life my daughter has fought the stigma that being Autistic was defined as, first a "learning disabilty" and now a "disability". It has destroyed her life, made her feel inferior and sapped her self confidence. Then to see the BBC describe autism as a "lifelong disability" made me furious. Then to find that the source of this bigotry is the definition on the NAS website makes me incandescent with rage. I too am Autistic. The NAS does not represent me or my daughter. The challenges which Autistic poeple face are not what we are but how we are misunderstood. For the NAS to insist on perpetuating these myths makes you part of the problem. I can only presume your definition of Autism was written and approved by a bunch of, perhaps well-meaning, poeple who suffer from Autism Deficiency Syndrome and who lack the flexibility of thought that Autism gives us and we, in turn, have given the world the technology which I am using to write this.
I would assume that if there's any merit in this, it would be due to the overlap in PTSD symptoms and autistic traits. But it's Jordan Peterson, so for all I know it's nothing to do with that and he's talking rubbish. Certainly wouldn't be the first time!
I don’t entirely agree it’s too late but it’s certainly more difficult. I imagine it’s a bit like learning languages. Young children pick up languages very quickly. You can still learn new languages as an adult but you have to make far more of an effort than you would have had to do when you were a child.
I think that Jordan Peterson is at best talking about autistic-seeming traits, psychology has no place in the roots of autism, though it des play a role in development like you say..:)
Thanks for your post - I might have a look at the book you mention. I’ve never found any of Temple Grandin’s books that useful or interesting before although I’ve only glanced at them. This one actually might be useful and interesting.
Yeah I agree, if empathy cannot get you there, then knowledge will have to do..
yeah its generally a thing you spot and help in children to prevent it... once you get to adult stage its uncurable. because its developmental. i think that psycologist guy who does videos spoke about this on youtube before, jordan peterson.... he said that if you isolate a child and overprotect and smother them they dont develope socially with other children, and because of that they dont know how to act or react socially and they have autistic traits. this is all due to childhood isolation and smothering. but this is why you can only fix it at the childhood development age, if you catch and prevent the smothering of a child that child still has time to get out there with others and socially develope and normalise.... as a adult though its too late, your forever broken, you never get a chance to be at that social development age again. i think this is why autistic services are more towards children, because they can help and prevent new cases in children by ensuring the child gets its social development in its social development age.
Fair enough. NAS can describe autism however they like and probably have their own reasons for doing so. It doesn’t mean you or I have to use the term. I used to say I had Asperger’s but these days I just say I’m autistic although it does confuse a few people whose idea of autism is more Kanner type autism than Asperger type autism and don’t appear to have grasped the idea of a spectrum.
Caelus said:i guess then its not social intelligence we lack its social knowledge, as knowledge is knowing a baked in set of fixed rules.
Knowledge and rules can be learned:
The Unwritten Rules of Social Relationships - Decoding Social Mysteries Through the Unique Perspectives of Autism - Temple Grandin, Sean Barron (2005)ISBN: 9781941765388
thats true, i guess then its not social intelligence we lack its social knowledge, as knowledge is knowing a baked in set of fixed rules.
I can’t actually remember to be honest (although I don’t think so - it was more their corporate culture) and I’m out of time to bring a claim anyway. I was asked to give an example of using different communication styles during the interview and thinking “what the hell is a communication style?” When they then clarified what they meant I was able to give one but they then used this and “they didn’t think I’d be enough of a team player” as their grounds for not giving me the job which I was over-qualified for. They were careful though and got an agency they used to tell me their grounds in a phonecall so although I think they definitely were discriminating against me on grounds of my disability it would have been difficult to prove. I’m in the fortunate position though that I’ve got enough savings that I don’t have to work for anybody who doesn’t want me to work for the, but it is annoying.
I don’t need to look at someone’s eyes to understand what is coming out of their mouth. Their face maybe but not their eyes. Or maybe that is why I sometimes misunderstand people? You’ve got me wondering now.
Yes developmental disability is how it is described.
Here on the NAS site:
https://www.autism.org.uk/advice-and-guidance/what-is-autism
"Autism is a lifelong developmental disability which affects how people communicate and interact with the world."
Here on a US site:
https://www.dol.gov/agencies/odep/program-areas/autism
"Autism is a neurological developmental disability with an estimated prevalence of one to two percent of the American and worldwide population."
Taltunes said:I would argue that asking for team players and strong communicators is dangerously close to disability discrimination
Did the job spec specified that this was required?
I would argue that asking for team players and strong communicators is dangerously close to disability discrimination and if I was turned down for a job and they put it in writing that that was why I was not employed I would take legal action. I have had similar said to me verbally but it becomes he said, she said if it’s done verbally unless you go around recording everything anybody ever says to you.
VLD said:But we have a lifetime of experience and knowledge.....but of course that is not valued either.
Having it is one thing but to be valued for it then it needs to be useful and for us to use it.
You could have a cure to cancer but if you never showed it to the medical world or used it to cure people then why would you be valued.
Application is the key.
Developmental disability or developmental disorder? I have certainly seen autism described as a childhood developmental disorder which while I can take or leave disorder is better than lumping it into mental health disorders which in my opinion is wrong, misleading, stigmatising etc. I must admit I haven’t come across developmental disability and I’m not sure I care for it much - I’d prefer to just class it as a hidden disability.
But we have a lifetime of experience and knowledge.....but of course that is not valued either.
Less social intelligence maybe but total lack no or at least not for me. I also think this is an area where autistic children can be helped although it is probably harder with adults.
Curious term really as intelligence is the ability to think of new concepts and ideas rather than relying on knowledge given to someone by others. Surely the problem we have is not understanding fixed and arbitry rules when talking to someone. For example the need to look at someone 's eyes to understand what us coming out if their mouth.
I have a shower room where the only mirror is just above and to the right of the toilet cistern. Unfortunately I’m 6ft 3in so thIs means the mirror is about waist high (maybe the previous resident used a wheelchair?) Fortunately I have my own mirror and can hang it from the handle of the upper window but this means the upper window is unlocked.