Problem at school, but can't explain...

Hello

I just wanted to reassure you that you're not on your own, unfortunately this appears to be a frequent problem for aspie children. My almost 10 year old would come out of school and not speak for days on end to anybody about anything because if something that had happened at school, he would meltdown over anything. It took us to breakthrough to him once and then it became easier from there step by step. I had to keep plugging into him that he needed to tell me in order for me to help him, we started with a drawing, then a word, now I get a sentence or 2, he's starting to vocalise his problems too. Fortunately for us he's got a wonderful teacher and ta this year, I'm dreading next. 

Take care

There needs to be a distinction between bullying in the neurotypical sense and bullying where the victim has aspergers. The problem for people on the spectrum is their higher sensitivity or sensory overload and often obvious difference, whether clumsiness, pedantic speech, understanding of humour including metaphors, organisation or appearance.

This means that you are likely to be targeted by bullies because you are recognisably different, which finds more acceptance to the silent (condoning) majority, there are more behaviours to target, and you can be sure of an entertaining reaction due to being oversensitive or sensory overload.

As a giant even at school age I was considered by teachers and my parents as perfectly capable of defending myself, and was given tuition in self defence. That isn't the point. I couldn't not appear different. But moreover my contemporaries quickly found that a combination of sounds and movements, especially towards the periphery of my visual field, caused me to become extremely agitated and distressed, and therefore entertaining. In such a state physical size and ability to throw anyone else just added to the entertainment value.

In those days of course it was seen as necessary to toughen up softies, and my over-reaction was deemed as deliberate and that it attracted attention my fault. It intrigues me that I have otherwise avoided meltdowns, or let things go when I was in private, but I had frequent meltdowns in school.

Therefore I am very concerned when people apply neurotypical bullying guidelines.  You have to address this in terms of behavioural characteristics of autism.  It is unfortunately going to end of as the autistic victim's fault, even in these more enlightened times, and often the bullies are doing no more than they would with a neurotypical victim better able to adjust and evade. And victims on the spectrum cannot merge into the silent masse of condoning onlookers, as can most neurotypicals.

Can I just add that sometimes it is not just pupils who bully - reassurance needs to be given that if there is a problem with an adult at school it can be resolved aswell...

oh.. sorry all the marks that J had were self inflicted, she was never physically bullied, only verbally

and yes i did get the 'you could be prosecuted if you dont send your child to school' letter...

chasz

hhhmmm.... now this is something that is very close to my heart!!!

my youngest daughter has always been 'different' or 'special', my older children always said we were too soft with her and she was spoilt...  

anyway... 

all the really big problems started when J moved into secondary school, she would come home with teeth marks all over her forearms, red marks on her forehead and she started soiling!!!

no matter what or how we asked school was 'ok' and 'no there isnt a problem'... we had already had J referred to the local CAMHS and at our request J's caseworker observed her at school without her knowledge, witnessing at first hand some of the bullying that was taking place!!!

we had several meetings with school  including CAMHS and Parent Partnership...each meeting finished with promises of help but an underlying disbelief that there was a bullying problem at the school. J did by this time admit that she was being bullied and we reassured her that she was not at fault, this in itself was a major breakthrough

so her last day at 'that school' was last may 19th, i got a phone call from J, she was very upset and was hiding behind the wheelie bins, the bullies had been taunting and teasing her all morning. i went to the school told reception i was there to pick J up and she came out of school and we left!!!

that was at 12.15pm... the Student Support manager called me at 3.20 to ask if i knew where J was....

J has not been back to that school, it took until november to get a new school, and even now we are still waiting for her to be statemented to guarantee her place...

so.... i know i've gone on somewhat, i think you need to start documenting everything, get as many professionals as possible involved. THE SCHOOL WONT ADMIT THEY HAVE A PROBLEM.... keep trying to get your daughter to confide in you or as in our case J had built a really close rapport with her CAMHS case worker and she told her things, try getting your daughter to write down what is happening, this also worked for J

oh and dont forget you may have a duty to send your child to school BUT the school and the local education dept has a duty to provide a safe enviroment for your child to learn in...

chasz

Homeschooling works well for some families - I know of one family with 2 aspies for whom it works particularly well, but many people aren't aware of the option. Do bear it in mind if you cannot get your child into an appropriate school (i.e one that values and protects them).

My son struggles to articulate what worries him but can sometimes write it down - have you tried that?

Hope it all gets sorted ASAP

Hello,

My 7yo often spoke through her soft toys when she was younger, these days she just won't answer/tell you. It may seem a little childish but I would give the puppets a go either as role play what happens at school or to act as a voice for her. Another option is to write some scenarios/keywords out on A5 sheets of paper, or maybe get some pictures/symbols, and get her or a soft toy/puppet to pick/indicate one. 

I also found my daughter was much more likely to spill the beans, if only a little, when settling down in bed but it was always voluntary, pressure never worked.

Why are the gov not tackling this? Does early intervention actually exist and if so do our kids not get included in this?

I am very worried about high school as primary is harsh enough. It is so unfair that our babies through no fault of anyone have this condition and they get targeted and ignored by peers school and life in many ways when they deserve all the extra help and attention they can get!

hi

I am feeling worried about my son going to comprehensive school, I have gone to a local one for a chat and visit, but its going to be quite a difference coming out of a small class of 6  to a large class of mainstream children

Hi Saneasever,

Just wanted to let you know that the NAS website has a section for young people about bullying, it may be helpful or not, as I'm sure you've tried everything you can think of to discuss the issue with your daughter.

But the page that outlines for young people what bullying is could be useful -
http://www.autism.org.uk/living-with-autism/education/bullying-guide-for-young-people/what-is-bullying.aspx

hallo

my son who is 9 has high functioning autism and at the age of 3 was taken out of mainstream nersery and placed in a behaviour unit of another primary school which he still attends and he has been getting bullied and has been for years the school is aware and i have got very angry with the school because the bulling is still happening, the other boys in his class have problems with behaviour but not on the spectrum. it is so hard i have cryed many times over the bulling my poor little boy has had it hard.

Hello

I am so sorry for your little girl. My oy is 8 and is getting punched kicked pushed to the ground and verbally abused at school and in our home area. Other kids seem to sense they are different and vulnerable and use this. If she is finding it hard to vocalise how about using finger puppets or little dolls and saying to "lets play what happens at school" maybe through them she can give you some insight into what is wrong.

Routine is so key to them and when they start to have sore tummies or cry and dont want to go to school you know its serious! wishing you luck.

Saneasever said:

 Hi. Hoping somebody reading this might be able to help. My daughter (A. 9yrs old, Aspie) has a problem of some description at school. I say 'a problem of some description' because, try as I might, I can't seem to find a way of getting her to find the right words to explain exactly what it is without her getting so anxious that she starts to cry. All I've managed to glean is that it's something to do with a group of children at school, and the problems getting worse (her words). She hates school now (as a result) and will find every cuss word that isn't swearing to vent just how much she hates it, or she'll cry and get herself really worked up. She's never been one to act like this about school, and I don't know what to do to help her. She's only been diagnosed for 5 months, her peer group isn't aware of her diagnosis as yet (she's hoping to tell them at some stage after this half-term with the help of the ASD outreach team). How can I help her if she wants to explain but can't? (Incidentally,(A.) saw me writing this. She wants me to tell you that it's VERY IMPORTANT). I know that she really wants to tell me and get some help, but she just can't. What should I do???

Hello

I know how hard this must be for your daughter. I'm an Asperger's Syndrome sufferer myself and went through the same kind of thing at primary school, then again when I moved into secondary school.

What I recommend you do is contact the school and ask to book an appointment with a senior member of staff (such as a Year Head or Deputy Headmaster). Ask for the Learning Support Specialist to be present at the meeting. (All schools should have one). Then sit down with your daughter and try get some names. It doesn't matter if she doesn't know them all as the school will be able to fill in the blanks with a basic description. Hopefully if the school is efficient it should be sorted within the week.

I do feel for your daughter and wish you all the best. This may act as a good experience for when she moves to secondary school as she will know what to do if it were to happen again (like it did to me).

Also, I think it is best if it is out in the open that your daughter has a special need. Some kids won't care but hopefully some will be more understanding and may realise what they think is a joke isn't seen as a joke by your daughter. Doing that worked for me, but every case is different.

All the best and good luck

how's this for an explanation from an autistic person who never liked school...

studying causes stress. mandatory education is like child slavery.

and the bullying... the way to deal with bullying is to leave the environment where the bullies reside, to move on and avoid the conflict... but school won't let that happen... i have sympathy for your 9-year-old daughter and also for yourself as the parent who is bound by the government to force your child into the education system!

to sum up, please avoid at all costs saying this is the girl's problem when she's only behaving naturally, she's a victim of the environment and is behaving very elegantly considering the circumstances

Bullying is often the reason for our kids difficulties at school. 9/10 years old is about the time that kids start to change and join peer groups that make their own rules rather than follow the norms that are given to them by parents/teachers. Anyone who does not pick up on this step change is marked out and picked on. It is ironic that, in order to assert their emerging sense of self, children should insist on conformity to a new set of norms and punish those who, for whatever reason, do not or cannot conform. 

Marc Segar famously wrote about the unwritten rules by which most people live their lives. Neurotypical people seem to learn these rules by intuition. Autistic people struggle. They are picked on because they do not assimilate the ever changing norms of emerging adolescence. 

The best way to help is by the buddy system. If the school gets it regarding autism they can recruit the kids on the A list - smart, sporty, popular - to adopt the autistic kid in their class. One, they keep them safe from bullies. Two, they take on the job of providing positive role models and guiding them through the minefield of puberty. In some places it is called Circle of Friends or peer mentoring. 

If you are embarking on disclosure at school this would be a good time to set up a buddy system. The other side is that autistic kids at this age often discover that the do not belong at exactly the time when they want to belong. Coming to terms wth difference at a time when you want to be like everybody else needs specialist support. There are resources like the books by Peter Vermeulen as well as published accounts by young autistics. The NAS publications department ought to be able to help here.

The bottom line is that there are problems here affecting your daughter's mental health. Help is available. The NAS You Need to Know Campaign has a page called Help Now It also might be worth considering keeping her off school for a while until you can get to the bottom of this, unless she needs the school routine. With hindsight I wish we had pulled our son out of school before we hit the crisis. But every child is different and only you can make that judgement.