Mainstream or special?

Hi Stridesy,

We were offered a place in another local school from September. Gonna try another mainstream. Somehow, a SEN school seems too big of a step for now.

X

Hi I'm pretty sure it is illegal to exclude a child when their behaviour is caused by a disability.

It sounds like this school is not the right place for your child.

Hi Misskittykat,

What an experience! You are very brave in your moves. Hope your LA will wake up very soon and arrange the right support for your daughter. As for bad parenting, I think we all have been through the blames, getting used to it now.

We have it the other way round. A great majority of my son's meltdowns happen in public, and especially lately at school. So he was diagnosed when he was 4,5 and now, a year later, we almost have a statement. LA want to keep him in mainstream because he is quite bright. I've rung several local schools and they do not have spaces as soon as I mention a statement...

It's so difficult to know if a school is going to be right for your child just by visiting it briefly. Yet, it looks like our choice will be a school that will agree to have us:)

The Rise looks brilliant and I wish I had something like that close by for my daughter.

My own experience of mainstream school for my daughter has been very mixed.  She went to a brilliant primary school that worked hard to provide her with full support despite not having a diagnosis or a statement.  The only thing I'd have changed about that experience is the senco possibly picking up the signs of ASD in girls but thats not her fault.

My daughters first high school was brilliant too - it fed on from primary, lots of transition work plus she was in the nurture group - a class of 15 children with at least one TA in every lesson, often 2.  The children all had some sort of SEN but my daughter thrived because she became top of the class in one or two subjects due to her good reading and spelling abilility.  

We then moved house (from Lancashire to Dorset) to be near my family for support.  the school here has a good reputation however it was huge (1800), had mixed ability and large classes and they took no notice of the transition information from the previous school.  The previous senco had told me she didn't think it was the right school for my daughter after talking to them on the phone and she was right.  They threw her in at the deep end and she sank.  She doesn't attend anymore and we're currently playing a waiting game with the LA for a statement and to see what they can offer.

Your school sounds as though the HT is desperate to have a school full of NT children and an easy life.  I personally believe that inclusion isn't right for many children on the spectrum but a good understanding school can work to make the enviroment as suitable as possible.  I'm not sure I'd change my experience of mainstream for my daughter but I certainly would do for secondary.  If she'd have been diagnosed much earlier though, maybe I'd have felt differently but because she was so compliant at school, there never seemed to be much of an issue and the medics put down my descriptions of her meltdowns to over exageration and bad parenting.

Hi,

Sorry for late reply. Have been trying to reach the area exclusion manager and ipsea to get some advice but with no luck. Got lots of general info, just guidelines. You need great legal knowledge to argue the case.

Thank you for great tips. We are expecting outreach from freemantles, so will definately ask about coping strategies. Never heard of mohdoh but looks great!

J has not got a full statement yet. We have a proposed statement for 32.5h 1:1 support in mainstream school and have two weeks to specify the school. Our head told me today that there is no place for autistic children in mainstream as it's impossible to meet their needs there because of the nature of the setting. 

J is breaking down  from the effect of the recent exclusions (every two weeks or so for 2.5 days). He fears school, started heaving headaches and wetting his bed at night. I think it's too much for such a young child. Just to prove a point?

As I understood, EP is writing a report about her recent visit and to suggest a more specialised setting. 

It is quite a shock for us as everything was fine till very recently, when our SENCO resigned. Now the head is blaming SENCO for not taking action earlier. Yet, that was the time when J loved school...

We are also expecting a specialist from a new ASD school to come and observe J. Have you heard of The Rise? They open in September 2014, next borough but just 10 min drive from us. 

Thanks again for your support.

Good luck with your battle!

Xx

Hi  natali

  It has been a real battle. Like your boy my sons present very much with NT characteristics a lot of the time, however the meltdowns can be paralizing for them and such a contrast to their calm and quiet periods. It's always a shock for others to witness if they don't realize they have ASD. As they get older these meldowns can be percieved as less acceptable socially, so coping startegies are important

Having people tell you they don't believe they have ASD is not helpful to anyone and having meldowns which either manifest at School or home, but not in other environments is quite common.

Is your son statemented? I know when my son went to his specialist school he had a taxi provided by the LEA, this took a great deal of strain off us having to deliver children to various detinations especially when I had one college, some at Secondary and one at Primary. 

Exclusion from various events is another common issue when a child has been identified as having an 'issue' by a School. This demoralizes children and isolates them emotionally. My son felt very angry at being excluded from various School events which were going on whislt he was in Primary School. This does not foster an ethos of inclusivity and is really very damaging i find.

It's probable if your son has sensory issues, which many do, that the School environment can be sensory overload for him. A trained TA would be able to offer time out or a separate calming environment to chill. At Secondary my son was allowed to go to a chillout room to decompress. Once he was sufficiently calm he'd return to the environment and carry on. Have you asked about time-out to defuse any overload?

Separate sensory stimulus is another way to defuse anxiety amd meltsowns. One of my boys used bluetack in his pockets to squeeze. It was not obvious to others so he didn't stand out to his peers. Only recently have we replaced this with Mohdoh, but that is as much about reducing his migraines as it is about his sensory needs. (trial.) Could your son use something like this in School? just a thought. They have a calming one also.

www.ebay.co.uk/.../161235219284

My other son used stimming to drown out the extrenuous stimili. (hand flapping, rocking, knee bouncing, noises etc) Most find ways to indicate their stress, but if the support struggles to read the signs chaos can ensue. It sound like the staff at his School could do with some Autism awareness training. Do get some advice with regard to the exclusions. It's not right. My heart goes out to you and yours.

Coogybear

XX

Oh my, you have been through a lot. And still going. You can give inspiration to anybody.

I feel so lost at the moment as I do not know what is actually going on. Our life had been quite ordinary, with ups and downs, till our SENCO resigned and our school suddenly was not able to meet J's needs. He is a bright boy and understands quite a lot what's going on around him. Those exclusions completely knocked him down, made him even more sensitive to failure and resentful to school.

J presents so normal that some of my friends still don't believe he's autistic. His language and social understanding are still not on the same level as of his classmates', and he gets greatly distressed by noise and proximity of other people, but only at the times when his anxiety level has gone past sertain point. I do not know if he is HF or not as his diagnose just says ASD. But when he looses it, he looses it completely.

His last exclusion happened on the day when his 1:1 was sent on a training, along with class TA, and there was nobody to cover for them. Afterwards, he was described as a beast, how many people have been hurt, kicked and so on. Yet, it almost looked like they planned it... Sometimes they make me believe that J is really so bad. And then I see him at home, so sweet and calm, so caring... and I just want to cry.

Our 'normal' daughter is in the same school and quite happy there. I do not have a car in the morning, and the school is just on our doorstep. It would be a big problem to do all the logistics taking the kids to different schools and me getting to work if we move the school.

All other local schools are either full up or have reached their limit for SEN children, as they say.

Oh well, we'll see. Let's the battle begin...

Good luck with your other boy.

x

Hi,

I'm in the next county over, but no I haven't heard of any. It is a lottery though. At the moment, I have one who travels 80 miles (1 1/2hrs) a day & does a 12 hour day, and it's just transpired he's got virtually no support, despite a comprehensive LDA (Learning disability Assessment.) My other travels over an hour, but with some extensive intervention on my part, is now well supported and thriving academically. His health however, is another issue. Both are older than your child though.

One went to a specialist primary for a short while; which again was an hours journey, (after a disasteroius mainstream primary experience) and this was a great stepping stone to secondary, but both my boys are high functioning and needed stretching so at the end of thier primary we opted for mainstream Secondary. It's worth mentioning at this point that the School we opted for had no specialist ASD unit and focused on inclusion. We were offered a School with an ASD unit by the LEA, but turned it down in favour of the one we chose.

You know your child best and must go with what you feel is right.

I agonised for months over it. Many sleepless nights worrying (in addition to the sleepless nights spent with them. They don't sleep well.) over the decision i'd made, but the School offered a good transition programme with regular visits and tappered transition into full time. Named mentors/liason persons for communication of any worries, so the boys knew who to go to and had regular reviews (in addition to annual statement reviews & pupil reviews) with direct e-mail/phone contact for us to convey any meltdowns or concerns. More importantly they had nurture groups for their core subjects which meant small numbers and additional staff. Perfect for someone on the spectrum who is high functioning, but who struggles with noise and sensory issues.

Their were moments, don't get me wrong, but you had a sense the staff really cared. I couldn't fault them.

I was contacted recently by a moderator  from NAS with regard to some issues I have with my child who has had no support and she also suggested.

http://disabilityrightsuk.org/

He's been very badly failed at FE and now appears to be suffering some mental health problems as a result. It's been the worst educational experience of his life so far, bless him. The DR uk may also be able to give you some advice with regard to exclusion.

I so sympathise with your plight. I've known parents move counties to get the special needs provision that they need for their child, however the only advice i can give is that their maybe a Gem on your doorstep you don't yet know about. Look at things holistically though. Mind, body and soul. A School that deals in two will be good, but one with a holistic aproach could transform their life. 

From a lad who was home tutored due to School refusal and who suffered daily with MAJOR meltdowns, I have a lad who's now coping so much better in an NT world.

My other boy is in need of some seroius support. It's always a work in progress and both will need ongoing support throughout their lives, but you do what you can as the issues arise. 

Good luck hun. Sounds like you are very resourceful. Far much more than i was. Very trial and error.

Regards

Coogybear

Goodybear,

Thank you for your reply. I have emailed the Exclusion Service. Also, I have been trying to ring Surrey Exclusion Manager, ipsea and sos!sen but couldn't get through. Left a message where I could.

We have been to see another mainstream school with ASD unit. Their kids there presented with such severe learning disabilities, besides, they are full up. Another similar school in an hour drive away, and we think it's cruel for a young child to spend so much time getting to school and back. All special schools in the area are for really severe cases, non-verbal or self-harming children.

It's so good to hear that there are schools where ASD kids can get a good provision. We live in Ashford. Have you heard of any good inclusive primary mainstream schools in the area?

Many thanks

Hi,

You may find this link helpful re exclusion.

www.autism.org.uk/.../School-Exclusions-Service.aspx

However, the choice of mainstream over special is a very personal one. I have two with ASD and both went to a good mainstream Secondary School where they had an extreamly progressive and inclusive ethos. You need to visit both and assess what is best for your child based on your extensive knowledge of his needs and what each School professes to provide.

Sorry if this seems a bit vague, but as I understand it it's not an exact science.

Regards

Coogybear