Published on 12, July, 2020
There is a behaviour that happens on this forum and it is worse than trolling because the poster may or may not be genuine, and you care about them but then no matter what you suggest to try help them they won't accept it. They might as well preface their original post with "whatever you say I have accepted my fate and it is bad, it just sucks to be autistic, you should feel bad too" and have it over with.That may not be their intention, but we know intention counts for nothing compared to the result. So here it is the lesson learned today, don't wast your energy trying to help those that don't want to be helped. Yes you are right to care, yes you are right to be confused but you need to recognise the cut off point.You cannot save a drowning man by reaching out to him if he won't reach back. For our own sakes as autistic people we need to maintain our own emotional energy, and self preservation is not selfish.Yes there was a specific incident that set off the need to post this, but it's not just about one person, there are others who have and will come in here and engage in this behavior. And whether they mean to or not it harms the community here because it creates the same effect as feeding-the-doom-trolls-comes-at-a-cost and takes it's toll on our collective mental health. It's great to care, I wish more people cared, but please keep yourselves safe and healthy first.
Let me share an anecdote from real life (not internet !). It concerns a neighbour I had at my previous address. She was passing by while I was feeding/weeding the lawn with a combined weed/feed granular product, carefully measuring the amount I was applying to each square metre. She walked straight into my garden and demanded to know what I was doing, she then demanded and insisted that I write down the name of the product and the name and address of the shop where I bought it.
A month or two later we met on the street and she gave an earful, shouting at me that the stuff I recommended for her was absolute rubbish and that she found a different product in a different shop which was cheaper and much better.
A couple of years later I was painting my wooden window frames, again, this lady was passing and walked straight into my garden demanding what I was doing and demanding/insisting that I write down the exact name of the product and the name and address of the shop I bought it from. This time I carried on painting and told her to go away.
The lesson is that some people like to play games, by asking for help and advice just to annoy others.
Yeah that's the thing, even with the other person saying "I wouldn't expect/want you to take it on as your problem" there's a little bit of guilt, but it's not as bad.
I think that particular event made me more vigilant. The person in question is also autistic and they were a bit drunk at the time, and I know they didn't intend to make me feel guilty for how I handled it but I still did.
In hindsight I could have directed them to Samaritans or whatever and just be honest about my ability to handle it. Because I didn't I felt like I had to feel bad about it and that continued for like 9 months.
I did my best in terms of offering words of support, maybe they wanted me to stay up and keep talking to them but I didn't know what I'd have said.
They cited it as the thing that killed whatever friendship we had - up til then we were on the road to it. I don't know, maybe there was just a big clash.
HMO said:Even though they'd never expect me to, I fear that I'd be being unreasonable by keeping an eye on my own mental health. Like I'm being selfish and don't care.
No that's pretty much what I mean. You should not feel guilty for self preservation.
HMO said:One time someone I knew was clearly at crisis point and she was messaging me (late night). I made the mistake of leaving her to go to bed because I did find it very heavy and overwhelming and I didn't know how to deal with it. She wasn't happy and remained upset with me for the best part of a year. I could have handled it better but at the same time, I just didn't know.
One time someone I knew was clearly at crisis point and she was messaging me (late night). I made the mistake of leaving her to go to bed because I did find it very heavy and overwhelming and I didn't know how to deal with it. She wasn't happy and remained upset with me for the best part of a year.
I could have handled it better but at the same time, I just didn't know.
You weren't wrong to go to bed though, this is the point: you are not a Samaritans tele-person, it's not your job to suffer for others, not being able to be their makeshift therapist into the small hours while your eyes are burning and your brain is turning into sleepy mush isn't a failing on your part because you were never responsible for them. You can love a person very much but you still aren't their keeper.That doesn't mean you stop caring and say "deal with it", it means you need to acknowledge when you have hit a wall and hand the person off safely to another avenue of support, ie an actual crisis service.
It’d be better to go full circle though..
That must have been really difficult. It's not the same thing but whenever friends would talk about something they're struggling with, I would always feel like I need to actively fix it for them.
Even though they'd never expect me to, I fear that I'd be being unreasonable by keeping an eye on my own mental health. Like I'm being selfish and don't care.
I want to add some additional context.For weeks and weeks (abt 2-3 months actually) on a mental health support discord server before I wrote this post quite a few of us there had been trying to talk another user out of suicidal ideation and the user kept making out there were no good sides to life and it took it's toll on the mental health of those who had become extremely emotionally invested, eventually one of us who had initially been in a good place started to have their own mental health decline, and eventually took their own life... it was scary to see something like that almost act as if it were contagious, and I realised although it wasn't wrong to care, it was a mistake to get too attached to a total stranger like that. And proved unhealthy for at least one of us there. That Discord server now has a new rule, we are there to support eachother but we are not a crisis service, you need to already be in a strong place yourself to do that, and those people at Smaritans have training and check ins for themselves too, which we don't, so if someone comes in to that server with ideations now we have to just direct them to actual crisis services.I'm not saying it is contagious in the physical sense but it is true that what I witnessed was someone taking on the emotional burden of another to the point it became self harming. You cannot and should not be expected to ripp yourself into peices just to keep others whole. I've noticed some of us here do duck out of the forums for a while for self care before coming back again and that is a healthy way to treat online spaces in general tbh.I didn't want to write the whole sorry tale in the original post at the time I wrote it as I know if people are already feeling down putting more emotional load on them can be dangerous and I didn't want to do that here. But I decided to add it now because I couldn't help but feel like some people may not realise this is more than just "omg bad vibes ew" it's a serious thing.
I don't blame people for wanting to lash back when people lash out at them, it's one of the most natural human emotional responses, it's not toxic to want to defend yourself, but I made this thread originally to try help preserve people's mental health. Not platform a space for folk to be rude to eachother. I explained the full context of why I actually wrote this thread months ago to another person in DMs and I'm gonna just reveal that in a moment because as much as I didn't want to talk about such an oof topic aft the time I now think the context was actually pretty vital to fully understand the post. But if people cannot stop namecalling eachother I'm just going to ask a mod to close the whole thing down.
You’re not toxic I Sperg , we just seem to have gone down this one rabbit-hole atm, but I wouldn’t characterise you by your reaction to aggravation anyway.
Additionally, it’s probably worth mentioning that Judge has had an unusually rough fortnight anyway, if I may be so bold as to state that, so I just consider this series of replies to be an unfortunate melting-pot of bad vibes.
Such as this interaction is, I’m counting the characters until this clash is done with, we’re only giving each other palpitations by perpetuating it..
Seriously dude, read what you've written since you joined and the words you choose.
Your baseline posts kinda matches many peoples "extremely annoyed" postings.
I will admit, That I should have been more precise in my words, and have written "You PRESENT yourself like a thoroughly.." Etc.
You've actually got something to say, of value to this community when you aren't trying to be needlessly annoying, but your chosen method of presentation is even more toxic than my own.
Martin said:I presumed it was triggered by a specific poster who appeared to be making a plea for help, but then just insulted autistics generally and also specific people whose initial concern and goodwill became quickly exhausted.
Oh I've seen that happen since, quite a few times, but no, it wasn't what specifically prompted me to write the original post, I'd have had to be a time traveler otherwise.
I presumed it was triggered by a specific poster who appeared to be making a plea for help, but then just insulted autistics generally and also specific people whose initial concern and goodwill became quickly exhausted.
Martin said:I think it is fairly obvious, given the specific trigger for this thread.
Actually there were 2 different events that led to support burn-out for me just before I wrote the Original post (which I have not eddited since day one), although there have been newer members here who have showed similarities and this thread unexpectedly revived since. The original post wasn't about them specifically as some folks arrival on the forum came after this thread initally started. And the 2 events that prompted it ... well the people involved in those actually haven't been involved in this thread yet. Not least because one of those events was not about autism specifically and happened on a Discord server instead.So sorry but to me it was not so obvious.It is a good analogy you made though, I can see why the connection there.
I think it is fairly obvious, given the specific trigger for this thread.
The parallel is reasonably close. Both black and autistic people are a minority in this country, are subject to prejudice, suffer from higher rates of mental illness, are more often un- or under-employed, are more often killed by the police, suffer more harmful restraint techniques etc. than the majority community.
Oh, yes, I see what you mean upon consideration.
Quite a few of us, probably... :c(
To whom are you referring Martin?
Imagine a black person who decides that all his difficulties, disappointments and perceived inadequacies throughout life were due to being black. He then joins a specifically black online support group, and starts insulting the other black people, denigrating the black online community, and projecting his self-hatred for being black on everyone who is black. How would that be received?
Judge Dredd said:Probably Spergy is accustomed to speak like that to the support worker that comes to his council house to check on him. Poor worker, I feel sorry for them!
I feel very sorry for anyone who has to relate to you in real life Troll.
You debase this forum with your nasty aggressive trolling.
As you seem to be the one who is constantly mocking others who you assume to not have jobs, why don't you go back to your own job - haven't you got anything better to do than this cr*p.
This is you all over the forum:
https://www.endsleigh.co.uk/blog/post/what-is-internet-trolling/
And this is your portrait:
"Don't waste spoons on people who are actively seeking to generate and promote unpleasantness."
Such people will proclaim how happy and together they are in themselves, or the opposite - and mainly both.
These people are not here for community, nor seeking advice from it, but are here to divide the community.
The best way for members of that community to handle such matters = be passers by = walk over the bridge, stand one side or the other, shout at each other from either side all you like.........but discount the voices that choose to lurk under the bridge.
My thought for the day.
Reminder of Rule 5:
Be nice to one another and enjoy chatting with others. We encourage conversation and respectful debate; please be aware that individuals may give opinions which are not shared by other members. Insulting posts or comments making personal jibes will not be tolerated.