Published on 12, July, 2020
Social difficulties: particularly in a group setting centered around an activity (jiu jitsu, for example). I always tend to perceive that I've been black listed. They stopped inviting me out places alongside the group. I believe this is entirely due to my inability to stay within the social norms concerning my high sense of justice and immediate need to bear my soul with everyone. I'm 36. I was yesterday years old when I learned 1. that small talk isn't painful for most people and it actually helps them feel calm and safe (kind of like a script but for allistics) 2. you will have different "levels" of relationships depending on the context you made the connection in. For example, not everyone you meet is your friend. In fact, most people are merely acquaintances. And when your bjj coach says you can text him anytime if you need something you cannot, in fact, text him any time. Especially because his wife will start thinking you're up to something nefarious. 3. you have to change how you talk to people based on hierarchy and your boss notices if you don't. And that's not good unless your boss is also neurodivergent (thankfully, I've finally found a manager that is and we work very well together and talk about our cats a lot instead of business).
Anyway, as for the group setting thing. I've never been good at group dynamics. I was tempted to try and find yet another self help book on the matter but decided to say *** this ***. these people are not interested in understanding me, why should i continue to learn masking skills for them? bastards. but also... i wanted to be part of the whole. :(
Ok, thats all for now. I'm in the good ole usa. It sucks here, too. fyi.
Special interest: psychology, because I keep trying to fix myself so Im not lonely. Also, i keep going back to drawing because it clams me down like nothing else. I feel like I woke up from a deep sleep if I just spend 30 minutes drawing and hyper focusing on it with music in my noise cancelling ear buds.
Hi I struggle in social situations...I actually want people to like me. So I am so open to do anything to keep that friendship. I do argue my opinions and I always have to be right...I don't think about the other person and I don't like being wrong . Even though some one might say do you think you might have been out of order. I think about it at a later stage. Fell out of friendships with loads of people because of it . I don't really get humour...and take things the wrong way
making art with music in your head. I love to do this too. I forget the world. I am in a gym class trying to not not mask so much with mixed results as a way to understand social situations better. I am a little less awkward than before the class. I figure I can just be myself and I will find the people who are drawn to me as I am. the rest would have been difficult to keep up a mask for eventually anyway. I do, still, find my feelings in turmoil from trying and failing at times.
I do like being interested in others. But it has to be completely on my terms. I think it's up to the other person if they want to be interested in me or not. I can't make them!
the little tree hugger said:used to ask a lot of questions, but now I'm trying to refrain from doing that as it leaves me wondering why they aren't asking me questions back. People do love to talk about themselves.
When much younger, I learned asking people about themselves was a good way to keep conversation moving because, yes, people love talking about themselves. I also realised I didn't get asked anything back. I always assumed it was because they were not interested. (After all, asking questions is what I'd learned through observation). THEN I realised - sometimes you have to take the initiative yourself to give a little bit to them and if they want more they'll respond. Also there might be indirect inference to elaborate which I don't pick up on. I think both of these is how a lot of neurotypical people communicate.
I can't naturally do this and it takes a lot of mental leaps. Also I have less bandwidth now to deal with people prattling on about themselves in an unwanted manner and trying to keep this up.. So have come to the easier conclusion that communication works both ways and it shouldn't just be me putting all the effort in. The onus is on both parties.
You strike gold when you meet someone who doesn't require all these filters. Or certainly not to the same extent.
Paper said:But due to bad experiences, I generally prefer to not say what I actually think, so usually don't say anything out of fear.
this is a pretty good summary of the autistic experience of life
Is it possible to learn this skill?
A few years ago I tried to read that book "How to Win Friends and Influence People" and it felt very nefarious and not like anything I could do. I didn't feel capable of saying most of the things it suggested because it felt manipulative and I just wanted to be honest with people.
But due to bad experiences, I generally prefer to not say what I actually think, so usually don't say anything out of fear.
But I've realised I am far too self-focused. I don't give people openings to respond, and I respond to other people's questions with "yes" or "no" answers which end a conversation, and that's something I know I need to fix, but always forget to.
Basically if I want to continue a conversation then everything I say should end with an opening for someone to reply. And when I look back on it analytically, I don't do that.
I was thinking about similar stuff the other day, that despite knowing a lot of people I don't have friends. I don't think people realise how bad my social skills are because I only bump into them once in a while or when passing by. I stick to the same conversation routine "How have you been", "What have you been up to" or if they're doing something I've done before I can share my experience with it. 5 minute conversations max, nothing about myself just focusing on them. I rely on others being the outgoing conversation leaders, even over text. If they don't make conversation, I won't either. I also feel lonely sometimes, but I think that I should accept I'm not going to find my people like others say. It's hard. I have had various jobs, managed to fit in quite well in some but not my last one. My last job was horrendous, they didn't like that I struggled with communication despite their company trying to celebrate and welcome diversity by doing all these training courses and newsletters for awareness. It was all for show.
The world is simply not designed for us ND people, all we can hope is that we find like-minded people and have access to accommodations.
Thank you, Hullabaloo. That means a lot. I used to ask a lot of questions, but now I'm trying to refrain from doing that as it leaves me wondering why they aren't asking me questions back. People do love to talk about themselves. They'll go on and on and on and on without ever realizing I've been carrying the weight of moving the conversation along and it's been largely one sided. I think it's okay to share if they don't ask, but usually if I'm inspired to share and it feels natural I've gone down a special interest rabbit hole that I can't stop myself talking about for the next 10 minutes straight only pausing once to ask if they are still interested. At first, I thought this was good of me. A good skill. However, it just dawned upon me that they will say "yes" because they are usually being polite in a neurotypical way not because they were being honest.
As for making memories with people, I'm wondering if you recall memories? I don't. I'm trying to get better at remembering good memories I have with non-family members. I think I'm usually so anxious in every interaction, making sure I'm responding well with my body language, controlling impulsive outbursts, maintaining appropriate eye contact, etc. etc. that I often am just exhausted by the end and then I go home and pick apart the interaction for the next few days... my mind keeps snapshots of every small change in body language and registers facial expressions and tone of voice changes so rapidly I often obsess late as to what it could've meant. I sometimes feel comfortable asking, but then I second guess myself because again... people are rarely honest if they think its against the social rules of polite society. You know?
I don't like small talk because it's boring, but I realized that if you can take something that's boring and say it in an interesting way, and leave an opening for the person you are speaking with to chime in with their response, that will build the bond between you two.
If it's awkward, I choose to be the one to "break the ice" and make small talk. I learned to just say things with confidence, and just speak my mind, yet I mainly just allow the other person to talk while I listen. People love talking, and I just try to create openings for them to discuss something they're interested in.
I learned not to be too quiet, because in a social situation, if I don't say anything at all, the other person just gets so tense that they start getting paranoid and they assume that I'm thinking bad things about them, or that I don't want to be there with them, which is not true. So in any awkwardly silent situation, I start saying whatever I'm thinking, even if it's "I'm not sure what to say at the moment" which is honest, and doesn't leave them guessing at what's going on in your mind.
But anyways, I hope that you can bond with people, so that they'll invite you out to places, and that you can have fun and make memories with them.