Public executions WTF?

Update: Trump has officially declared the execution will not be live-streamed. There will still be an execution, though. AP News on Trump and the Public Execution

“Trump said on social media that publicly airing the execution “might have been a strong deterrent for the World to witness how America deals with Terrorists and SCUM like Hasan."
But, he continued, “many very good and well meaning people would rather not watch him die, through streaming, or through any other visual device.””

Let’s be clear that it is not an apology. It’s almost like he’s wistfully longing for a chance to show others how big and tough he is, but also saying he doesn’t have a choice because of “good and well meaning people”. This really sounds to me as if he was completely on board with the idea of making it a spectacle.

What’s interesting is VP Vance’s reaction, which this article I linked mentions. When I first saw in another article that Vance had stated he wouldn’t participate due to religious reasons, but didn’t outright say it was morally wrong, I was amazed. While that’s a weak statement that obviously panders to both supporters and deterrents of the public execution, it shows how perilous his position is. Since he’s essentially the golden child for the next presidential election (that is, if Trump decides not to), he’s stuck balancing a party that I believe is fracturing into three distinct parts: The MAGA hardliners that still worship Trump for his extremism, the center-right folk that regret voting Trump for a second term and want to go back to him being less (obvious) of a raving lunatic, and the church goers who only vote Republican because the Democrats are Satan’s beloved (or because Trump may be the anti-christ, but that’s a topic for another thread, probably).

So yeah, Vance is in a very tricky spot. How do you take such a polarizing idea like a public execution and satisfy the desires of all three camps in the Republican Party? Also, remember how Trump and his cronies threw Pence away after he condemned the Jan. 6 situation? That could easily happen to Vance any day now. Trump LOVES firing people; That’s his whole schtick. So if Vance wants any chance at running for president, he’s gotta do what he can to avoid that dreaded “You’re fired.”

Vance’s response is, I agree, weak for a politician. He hasn’t featured much on the news on this side of the Atlantic for months. 

I wonder if things would be better in the future if he were to be fired. Would there be an even more nasty person ready to replace him?

ArchaeC said:

Would there be an even more nasty person ready to replace him?

That was exactly my fear with Pence lol

I think it's Taiwan they really want and anywhere else that was historically Chinese. Whilst they're very proud of their military and are probably right to be, it's good that they don't seem inclined to use it, just show it off, thats what a good deterrent does. If Europe hadn't been so keen to reap a peace dividend after the cold war, or at least not reduced our military strength in the way it has, especially successive UK government we might not be so worried about Russia now

TheCatWoman said:

I don't dislike the Russian people, but I don't like their government.

Oh I think that is an important note to make and I fully agree. I actually brought this up to my students when Russia attacked Ukraine in 2022, since I had a student who was previously very proud of his Russian heritage. I wanted to subversively protect him and encourage him by making it clear that we should be angry at the current leaders, not the culture or people of that nation.

TheCatWoman said:

I've had the feeling that China dosen't want to conquer the world in a military sense, but it doe's want to own it, war's bad for trade and they love trade.

That’s a really good point and I hadn’t thought of it that way. I’ll have a think about that perspective, but given how proud they are of their military I currently think it’s only a matter of time before they launch huge attacks on nearby Asian countries for further land grabs. I’m not sure what they’re waiting for, but it feels inevitable to me.

It's just what I've picked up reading and watching news programs here that have American talking heads, like Scaramucci and some top pollster. I know Scaramucci is can be full of himself and probably isn't to be trusted on a number of things. But when otherwise respected people in the US media and political establishment are saying that ordinary Americans support Ukraine, I believe them, they're not all from one source, although I'm sure they don't want to pay for Ukraine any more than we do, but accept it needs to happen for the greater good. I think you (Americans), like us, brought up through the cold war have a bone deep distrust of Russian and China and its very hard to erase that because someone like Trump comes along and says otherwise. Even after the end of the cold war, we've had Russian mafia to deal with, I'm sure that the ordinary Russian people feel the same wariness about us, I don't dislike the Russian people, but I don't like their government.

I've had the feeling that China dosen't want to conquer the world in a military sense, but it doe's want to own it, war's bad for trade and they love trade.

I know you addressed this to Iain, but I didn't know Charlie Kirk had an organisation, that's something that dosn't get covered here. Having read what you said, I can't say it surprises me, these things always seem to start with a charismatic leader, a woman gets prominence a bunch of men disagree and take over and mould it to their whims and often the original message gets lost. You could say it mirrors the history of Christianity itself, as Mary Magdalen got pushed out, then James, brother of Jesus.

TheCatWoman said:

From everything I've read and heard the American people strongly support Ukraine and distrust Russia

Generally that seems to be one of the few things that Republicans and Democrats mostly agree on. Of course die-hard MAGA will follow whatever Trump does, but I think most Republicans are wary of China and Russia just like the Democrats. However, I think Democrats tend to support Ukraine while Republicans generally could care less about Ukraine. I don’t have evidence of that, it’s just a vibe I’ve gathered.

So Trump’s history of inconsistently supporting Russia and China is odd considering it feels like the majority of his own party can clearly see they can’t be trusted.

TheCatWoman said:

From everything I've read and heard the American people strongly support Ukraine and distrust Russia

Generally that seems to be one of the few things that Republicans and Democrats mostly agree on. Of course die-hard MAGA will follow whatever Trump does, but I think most Republicans are wary of China and Russia just like the Democrats. However, I think Democrats tend to support Ukraine while Republicans generally could care less about Ukraine. I don’t have evidence of that, it’s just a vibe I’ve gathered.

So Trump’s history of inconsistently supporting Russia and China is odd considering it feels like the majority of his own party can clearly see they can’t be trusted.

I think it's Taiwan they really want and anywhere else that was historically Chinese. Whilst they're very proud of their military and are probably right to be, it's good that they don't seem inclined to use it, just show it off, thats what a good deterrent does. If Europe hadn't been so keen to reap a peace dividend after the cold war, or at least not reduced our military strength in the way it has, especially successive UK government we might not be so worried about Russia now

TheCatWoman said:

I don't dislike the Russian people, but I don't like their government.

Oh I think that is an important note to make and I fully agree. I actually brought this up to my students when Russia attacked Ukraine in 2022, since I had a student who was previously very proud of his Russian heritage. I wanted to subversively protect him and encourage him by making it clear that we should be angry at the current leaders, not the culture or people of that nation.

TheCatWoman said:

I've had the feeling that China dosen't want to conquer the world in a military sense, but it doe's want to own it, war's bad for trade and they love trade.

That’s a really good point and I hadn’t thought of it that way. I’ll have a think about that perspective, but given how proud they are of their military I currently think it’s only a matter of time before they launch huge attacks on nearby Asian countries for further land grabs. I’m not sure what they’re waiting for, but it feels inevitable to me.

It's just what I've picked up reading and watching news programs here that have American talking heads, like Scaramucci and some top pollster. I know Scaramucci is can be full of himself and probably isn't to be trusted on a number of things. But when otherwise respected people in the US media and political establishment are saying that ordinary Americans support Ukraine, I believe them, they're not all from one source, although I'm sure they don't want to pay for Ukraine any more than we do, but accept it needs to happen for the greater good. I think you (Americans), like us, brought up through the cold war have a bone deep distrust of Russian and China and its very hard to erase that because someone like Trump comes along and says otherwise. Even after the end of the cold war, we've had Russian mafia to deal with, I'm sure that the ordinary Russian people feel the same wariness about us, I don't dislike the Russian people, but I don't like their government.

I've had the feeling that China dosen't want to conquer the world in a military sense, but it doe's want to own it, war's bad for trade and they love trade.

I know you addressed this to Iain, but I didn't know Charlie Kirk had an organisation, that's something that dosn't get covered here. Having read what you said, I can't say it surprises me, these things always seem to start with a charismatic leader, a woman gets prominence a bunch of men disagree and take over and mould it to their whims and often the original message gets lost. You could say it mirrors the history of Christianity itself, as Mary Magdalen got pushed out, then James, brother of Jesus.