Are we depressed?

Thats really interesting and insightful, Catwoman

Speaking as someone who's done art therapy with clients, I'd find a blank page interesting. I'd ask you if you wanted to put anything in it, or is that a state of happiness for you and then move on to explore those. If you didn't want to put anything on it, then I'd be asking what happens when something is put on it, does it cause you stress, do the things put on your page belong to you or are they thigs put there by others and which others? What stops you from being able to put the things on it that you want? All that sort of thing. It would be a way of looking at your issues sideways as it were, from a different and hopefully less emotionally fraught angle.

Given: 1. There's a communication gap between NT and Au leading to a Double Empathy Problem and 2. there has been a great deal of confusing Trauma for Autism and 3. A great deal of confusing stress-induced-anxiety or even biologically-induced-anxiety for Depression and 4. Decades of misunderstanding Monotropic 'symptoms' or Sensory differences as Bipolar (a clinical depression) and 5. misdiagnosing chronic pain, Parkinson's and other neuro-differences as 'depression' and 6. Given Depression used to be related to the body's ability to override Survival Mechanisms late in life or with a serious illness... I'd suggest to always get several opinions. 

I tried explaining to a GP once about how overwhelming society and work was (due to a great deal of undiagnosed dyslexia), the difficulty I was having with miscommunication and basically asking for a how-to life tutorial and she sent me on my way with a dose of anti-depressants. I now believe this was an abuse of power and blatant dismissal. I took one of whatever she gave me and it was like someone gave me a lobotomy. I should've called a medical board, as it made everything worse and I wasn't looking to die! And there was no check to see my blood count, vitamin/mineral deficiencies. One thing I'd learned: Just because ONE person tells you a thing does not mean it's true.

Anyone will respond like Marvin or Eeyore if dismissed and ignored enough in life. That's not depression. 

It's good to do your own self-directed research into How anti-depressants Impact biology, most further deplete the Very Thing a lot of peer reviewed research is suggesting is at the core of Autism and ADHD. There might be subtle differences in some of the drugs, but say this research is true and thousands of Autistics have tried to explain these don't work but make it worse - due to a deficiency or difference which might require the opposite of what we've been asking for, that's merely a collective lawsuit waiting to happen. 

Anyone will feel a sense of 'hopelessness' when they feel unprotected or are marginalised in such a way. But I don't want to be a victim, that's a game NT's play to manipulate each other. 

Over the years I've learned I actually suffer MORE from deficiencies and a socio-economic system that is not interested in someone like me succeeding.

Depression is a human response that is a sort of decompression, deflation, an emptying out. Good for moving into our next state of being, existence even if it's just a return to dust so that Survival Mode with it's will to live and will toward personal agency kicks in with an anxiousness, adrenaline and other internal fight modes which help us stay alive.

We experience more than most a great many barriers to living a life with purpose. Barriers to hope-FULL-ness and barriers to finding our potential for being. I could use the term "Depressed" for a response to this. But there are many other REALLY good terms that communicate better.

Me too. I often haven't a clue how to describe how I feel and as for having an image in my mind about an actual item never mind an emotion, that's not happening either 

I'm not sure about adults but from what I learnt in my course for autistic children it helps improve communication mainly - I remember doing a bit of research into studies where autistic children were (IIRC) given various art tools to use with support and the study proved effective.

I suspect my picture would be a blank page 

The way I was taught art therapy, is that the client draws an expression of how they're feeling, it can just be splashes of colour or a big black page and then the therapist asks what it means to them, not what it means to the therapist an example of what shouldn't happen was given to me as a picture of a sunny day, a garden full of flowers and a typical childs drawing of a house. Lot's of people said it was a happy picture, what a lovely sunny day, they didn't see the tiny crying face in an upstairs window, the picture was a hayfever sufferers nightmare, being shut in alone with no one to play with, whilst everyone else went out and had fun.

Hi lina-chan Is art therapy good for autistic adults? I haven’t heard of this before and like the thought of not having to try to put words to my feelings as I find this very difficult to do. How does it work? Sorry I know you have only just started so may not have all the answers yet

I have clinical depression (as of my teens) and to be honest, I don't bother taking antidepressants anymore as it doesn't really help me. I don't judge anyone who uses them; for myself personally it is a waste to continuously pay £9.90 each for a prescription which doesn't work. As I am of Carribean ancestry, depression aswell as autism isn't received well - unfortunately in my culture you are told something is wrong with you and if you live in a 3rd world country (such as Jamaica), the family often sticks you in a mental institution to avoid dealing with you. 

I think in the case of mental health services, they are very ill-equipped when it comes to the subject of autism let alone other mental health issues. Waiting lists are long and at times, you have no idea when you'll self destruct. What doesn't help is that many healthcare professionals simply have little empathy/sympathy and dismiss your concerns; of course healthcare (if I am not wrong?) is an underfunded industry and I know from experience as I used to be an admin assistant for a care provider. 

For me personally, I try to manage each day one step at a time. Even if I don't want to get up (for example I've had autistic burnout lately/depression due to the monotony of office work and am actively working on changing my job), I try to and that counts as an achievement. Even if I feel like breaking down at work, I do so alone and get back up, that is an achievement as I am trying the best I can with my tasks, letting my team know that even if I'm not 100%, I will attempt something as to not give up. I don't know if this works for other people but little things I do count as an achievement in a sense.

Also, I have recently started studying an art therapy course and am in the process to see what options are available in the council (as I have a council job); I have always been a creative person and have recently been interested in the subject as I want to try and use my experiences to help people with autism and depression get the support they need. Also, I do have a podcast where I talk about autism from my experience and other topics so that (and doing YouTube keeps me going).

I feel less depressed generally since I started asking questions of the questions, statements and assumptions people make about me as an autistic person. Things like socialising, I've been told I should do more, do it better, try and eat and drink things that don't agree with me because it's what people do, go to loud places and crowded ones. It all felt very invalidating, guilt inducing and made me feel like it was all very wrong, or rather I was very wrong and failing at being human. Unspurisingly I felt depressed and depairing, then I had a breakthrough, I started challenging the people who told me these things, why should I eat and drink things that disagree with me to make other people feel comfortable? Why should I want to spend time looking for people who were on my wave length when I know damn well they're very few and far between? What was I going to do with all these new found friends? What would I have to give up? And why the hell should I want to be "NORMAL" and who's version of normality?

Basically I started asking what was in this for me, what was it going to add to my life? The honest conclusion I came to was that it would add a lot more stress, self doubt, worry and gneral aggravation, far more than any positives I would get from it. So I stopped and started the long process of accepting that what I want and need from the world and from other people are valid, just as valid as the choices NT's make, I started asking them questions, like why is it so important to you that everybody acts the same and can be pigeon holed neatly? Oddly enough nobody really had or has an answer to that.

It all makes sense when I'm feeling ok, but when I'm down, everything becomes a complete different story.

I know what would help, but that in itself becomes a problem, for example, knowing I need to socialise to feel less isolated, makes me think about how I don't socialise and have few friends.

And If I have a paranoid thought that knocks me down a bit, either about friends, relationships, work etc. there's no way to get past it, it's like I become irrational just to avoid believing the people who try and help. 

It's definitely a cycle, I fight through it and eventually it'll be ok, but I know it'll come again. I'm not sure on the exact breakdown of time between"ok and not" , but I feel like I must spend more time on the way down, being down then trying to get back up, than I do "up".

It's exhausting at times, you can probably tell this is one of those times!

I wish I knew how to avoid the downs. I thought I'd got better since diagnosis as I knew more about what I was fighting, but I reckon I have a big one, every year around the same time (November to spring) and with all the new knowledge I have, I'm still in it.

Medication might be an option, but given what I've seen of it for others , added to my likely ADHD alongside diagnosed autism, I worry it'd make me worse.

It feels like it's rooted in self belief and confidence, but telling myself "you're brilliant" doesn't seem to improve it, if someone else says I am I second guess it as "they're saying that because they have to, they don't mean it" , a bit like the emperor's new clothes.

I think the answer to many of lifes problems is to be more cat.

I think children are more maleable and can be moulded into a certain pattern of being that NT's can cope with. Like many things that are considered childrens conditions, nobody ever thinks about what will happen when you turn 18 and havwe to move into Adult Services which often mean going back to square one and being diagnosed all over again. Problem seems to be that adult services don't know what to do, they can't catagorise us to thier satisfaction, theres no medical or surgical path, nor does there seem to be a psychiatric one, so we get left to cope as best we can, if we're lucky we'll get a good GP who inderstands ND. I think it will change when enough of the current generation of newly diagnosed ND's get into the positions of power and influence to make changes, so probably a couple of hundred years if you compare it to equal pay in the work place.

I do not know if I am truly depressed as I have had medication on and off for so many years. I only got my diagnosis in 2023. I do know that I have so many traumas imprinted in my mind that I was diagnosed as complex PTSD. EDMR or whatever it is called did not work for me.

Is the not coping with life a product of my autism or is it depression? Either way life can suck at times.

I am beginning to think that autism creates the not coping and then not being able to understand why continues the cycle which can then look like depression.

If only life did not throw us the constant curve balls, then maybe we could be not classified as depressed.

Maybe this analysis can help explain things and provide "insight" Crumble  and thank you for responding - getting up enough drive to do something about it is complicated - environmental and circumstantial influences play a significant role in this I believe.  I wish you all the best

So the answer to depression is - be more "cat"? 

I have read this so many times it is compelling. I had never heard of alexithymia before it was raised on this topic so thank you Hergé  and Phased . This may be why the anti depressants don’t help

agreed, glad it worked for you - there is also the aspect of considering that how we also have a role in the mental states of others and part of the diagnostic criteria of autism is that we might struggle to ascertain what another person is thinking, feeling and intends.  Deliberation on same is something that the diagnosis implies as being something to work on in the way you well describe when pitching how one communicates - good to have several arrows in the bow maybe :-)

Thanks for saying so JT  :-)

My mood dips during the autumn and winter. The rest of the year I feel more useless and worthless than classically depressed. Have I experienced such depression in the past? Yes - more than a few years ago. I've had periods of not liking life, and yet dreading death.