Why is it so hard to make friends if you try so hard to fit in?

This is a bit Spammy.

Hey guys I am autistic myself so forgive me for wording this all wrong however I am creating a new autisic site for autisic people, their parents, partner's, carers and friends. The whole idea is there is one big place where everyone feel welcome, accepeted and free to talk to people who are going through, experiencing and dealing with the same things. Please feel free to follow my Facebook page and comment there if you wish here is the link www.facebook.com/.../

Don't try too hard I find the best friendships come naturally when you be yourself

Hi there, this is a very common for a lot of people who have ASD. I would suggest that you become comfortable with who you are, be your own best friend and others will be attracted to that. If people sense any sort of social desperation they will 'flee for the hills'. Don't try to hard to 'fit in' with people who are being rude .... do you really want them as friends?  Be true to yourself and good things will happen quite naturally

I don’t think people like to necessarily ‘be pleased and never argued with’. Also I’m not sure how to organize my thoughts so I’m just going to list my thoughts and hope that gets the point across:

1) that psychological study where people are more likely to like you if you ask them for a pencil first. People like to occasionally be kind and with what you described it seems like they don’t necessarily have that opportunity.

2) how would you feel if people treated you that way? If they just tried to please you, you couldn’t really have much of a conversation with them unless you somehow find a way to speak more openly with them

3) if you consistently give people things they may stop viewing you as a person and more of a tool

4) if you talk about your interests and someone zones out, that means you might not be a good match so just try to find someone else rather than forcing it.

All of them except 3 have been confirmed by other people in my life when we’ve talked about this and when talking about 3 they usually say that it’s less about me and more about the other person.

Neurotypical 

What is NT?

Mountain Goat, your story about the weather made me smile. From what I’ve learnt you’ve sort of missed the point with weather chat. Most people couldn’t give two monkeys about the weather. It’s about being able to pat themselves on the back to say they engaged with someone else even though they might prefer not to. The weather is just a constant nonsense topic that is available to everyone. It’s a bit like the “Hi, how are you” comment. All people want to hear is “Hi, I’m good thanks” I got caught out by this once, because the woman I asked said” Not great really” then told me all about her terrible weekend. I think its why I avoid social chit chat, because it has weird unwritten rules I don’t understand all the time.

keep trying to learn and join clubs with your special interest. Liste to others, don't talk about yourself, take on roles for community

My life has been like that. When in a group I feel like I am often treated like a pet dog. Something to say hello to and make attention of, but then the dog just sits there and not being allowed to be part of the conversations... And if the dog tries to, it is like "Isn't he cute" but what he says is not taken i to consideration. When I say something, things can go quiet and then someone says "Moving on..." and they all start talking again about whatever they were talking about...

Ooh. My last reply did work. Sorry. I have replied twice.

I used to be concerned and like you, make quite a lot of effort to try to make friends, but no matter how hard that I tried, I found they were what I call "Surface friends". I did end up with the odd closer friend but I do tend to only see them once or twice a year incase I somehow overdo it and mess up our friendship? I have learnt to do this with people who I count as close friends. The friends one gets just a few times in ones lifetime. 

Surface friends... I have lots of these. People you may know and meet but don't get close to. Each one is valued even though I remain at a distace from them.

Now I have learned some things in life. I gave up a long time ago trying to fit in. No matter how hard I tried to fit into social circles like other people seem to do, I find I am always an outsider to the group even if I am supposed to be in the group. I feel I am treated like a pet dog rather then a human as they enjoy my presence, but I seem to be left out of conversations or sidelined? 

Ooh. I get what you describe very often, where one is having a nice one to one conversation but another person comes along and its as if you are not there? And one is expected to just stand there and be part of things without saying a word? I have learned to walk away and let them carry on. 

Now here in Wales everyone tends to talk about the weather. Now to me I just look outside and whatever we get we have. So as I wanted to try to fit in, I made quite an effort to learn all about clouds and the weather. It was not my subject  but one has to make the effort, even if it is a bit tough going to study something one is not really interested in. So I spent a few days trying to give myself a crash course and trying to remember all the clouds etc., so when someone started talking about the weather I could be included. 

Uhmm. It disn't exactly work. The conversation started with the usual "How are you?" (I answer a standard OK no matter how I feel... Oh... I learned a long time ago not to say how I feel), and then the other person started to talk about the weather, so with my new found knowledge, I started to point to every cloud I could see and talk about them... And the other person just looked at me with their mouth open and didn't say a word. 

I wasn't sure what to do so I made an excuse and said something like "I'm going now" and dissapeared quick to save myself some embarissment. Somehow I have missed something about this weather lark! 

How come people want to talk about the weather, but then when I talk about their favourite subject they seem not to know much about it? I really don't get it! 

But anyway. I do get where you are coming from. I have had the same for many years. I can have good conversations on a one to one if I can sway the subject to one I like (And they like) but in a group of people, somehow, I am excluded. The only exception to this is if I am a group leader. One of those people who is valued, but is not part of the general chit chat in the group... Or if I am in a group but have my own specialist area of expertize so it is aknowledged that I don't have to function and do the same things as everyone else. 

Anyway. I hope that by knowing that you are not alone in your thoughts and feelings, that it brings comfort to you. :) 

I’ve found that most friendships I have with the NT world are difficult and actually I relate to almost everything you’ve said in that post. My advice therefore is try to mix a bit more with people in the spectrum. Obviously that still has its challenges but I’ve found it easier to get on with fellow autistic people. You genuinely sound like a great person, so the fault most certainly isn’t in you - it’s in others

If ever you want a chat or just to rant about the world - I’m always happy to listen. Just drop me a message :) 

To answer your question, because we don’t fit in! My wife and I have a group of “friends” we go out with. Every so often I have to go out With “the lads”. Which I hate. It always involves meeting in a noisy pub, followed by sitting in an equally noisy Indian restaurant, while each member of the group shouts at the others to offer their latest anecdote. I don’t get any of it. I often become aware that I’m sat in the corner not saying anything, or the other extreme, where I have to speak so loud to make myself heard that I become conscious of my own voice. Then I feel like everyone looks at me with a disgruntled look, as if to say, “ok, lets pause our conversation and listen to this nonsense for a minute” so I go back to saying nothing.

I think Plastic hit it on the head though. I think everyone else is so superficial, the crap they talk about is almost unbearable. For me I’m good at talking about 1 topic in detail with a like minded person. That way I can get involved, keep up with what’s going on and I’m more assured that there will be no confrontation. Once I became aware that I had talked to one guy when we were out about Waste Management (my job at the time) for nearly an hour. I think I missed all the signs that he wanted to get away. Really it’s like metal detecting, most of the time it’s the same old beep, beep, beep. Then every so often you find a gold coin. Enjoy the gold coins!

NTs work on a very superficial level so anyone with knowledge or interests is seen as boring - unless it's football, Eastenders or BGT.

You're better off joining groups of like-minded individuals in special interest or activity clubs where all of the people there have more than one dimension.

I was lucky, I worked in engineering where a lot of the other people are undiagnosed Aspies so the tea-room conversation would range over things like Rudge-Whitworth motorbikes to SCUBA re-breather O2 sensor testing to encouraging chickens to lay more eggs.    It's the only thing I miss from working there.