CBT

Thanks very much. 

I didn't find it helpful at all but others have found it very helpful. There is evidence that it needs to be adapted for neurodivergent people though.

This is really helpful. We already do a lot of mindfulness and are looking to build on it. 

Thanks so much..

Thank you, good to know. 

ArchaeC said:

Breathing techniques and mindfulness

These have helped me as well with my anxiety!

I have had CBT a few times, although I was perhaps in my 40s the first time. It helped me manage long-standing guilt, but it didn’t help much with anxiety. Breathing techniques and mindfulness have been more helpful in controlling anxiety, but it never goes away completely.

Just in case you haven’t seen this article about anxiety in children, it might be worth a read, although it isn’t about CBT.

https://www.autism.org.uk/learn/knowledge-hub/professional-practice/anxiety-parental

Not sure about it for children though

I had CBT and got techniques which help me with getting rid of negative thoughts and feelings

Thanks so much Bunny, I will track it down from the library.

I think what I am concluding is that the therapist is key to this rather than the type of therapy. 

Thanks for your input  

Hi Alex and welcome to the community.

You might find it helpful to borrow or buy this book. It discusses various types of therapy (including CBT) and counselling, together with advice on choosing the right therapist or counsellor - all from an autistic person's viewpoint. Several of us here have found it very helpful:

The Autistic Survival Guide to Therapy

This is very helpful, thank you. She does have some sensory challenges but it is more general overthinking leading to fear of something bad happening. It can sometimes lead to insomnia. 

May I ask what therapy you did find helpful for anxiety? Was it a talking therapy? Obviously please only answer if you feel comfortable sharing. 

Many thanks 

Thank you, it's very interesting to hear all perspectives and experiences. Especially from people who have been through it. 

Thank you. 

Thank you, we will make sure that the therapist has experience with neurodivergent children. 

Sensory issues will not go away and CBT aimed at a general audience seems to think this. They can only be worked around 

18yo here, when I was first diagnosed autistic at 11 I was given 6 weeks of CBT. Mainly for anxiety about public transport due to sensory issues. It unfortunately made my problems worse because they tried exposure therapy for sensory issues, instead of working around them (eg suggesting using aids like headphones for the bus). Unfortunately it was the only way to get access to other, more helpful, therapy though. CAHMS would not suggest other help until they had proof that CNT doesn't help. It was seen as "the first step".

Not sure if it still works like this, but I wouldn't be suprised if it hasn't changed. I have heard that CBT is helpful for anxiety if it doesn't stem from sensory issues / directly from autism

I don't have a recommendation, but I can give my opinion:

Looking up what it is throws up a couple of obvious problems just in the setup and framing.

How It Works:

• Identify: You learn to recognize automatic negative thoughts that influence your mood.
• Challenge: You challenge these irrational thoughts, recognizing them as faulty rather than facts.
• Change: You replace negative thoughts and behaviors with healthier, more functional patterns.

It can be done individually or on groups.

Any group based activity is going to be a problem because you are trying to fit in and will not speak openly. You will say what you think they want to hear, if you say anything at all. Unless the other people think like you, you are going to struggle to identify with what they going on about.

The problem is the initial premise that there are negative thoughts, or that they are irrational. They aren't.

The idea that changing your thoughts will calm you is the wrong way round. You are overthinking because you are trying to calm yourself. Stopping this is unhelpful.

The problem is this can  lead to thinking you need to squash your emotions and to mask better.

Most of the problems are due to fear of the unknown and lack of control. Not being able to control who the teacher will pick, means you don't know if it will be you, so you are constantly braced trying to plan an answer and decide what you will do. If you can't, it is fear. Not knowing what to expect in the lesson tomorrow leads to overthinking the various scenarios so you are not caught out. Struggling with interactions and having unexpected responses leads to replaying conversations looking for rules so you know what to say next time or what you did wrong. 

It is the set of rules you build that allows your nervous system to relax.

Trying not to think about things is the long term strategy as an adult, but this comes from safe exposure and learning what to expect. It is a consequence of the rules, not the objective on its own. Once you are sure you know what to expect in a given scenario and you have a set of responses and behaviours you have tried and proven to work, so there is no need to planning, no need to worry, you appear more confident and because you are relaxed it works better.

This takes time and consistency.

Since you are largely running on will power all the time to overcome things, being told to just think positively and go do more stuff is not very easy.

I suppose what you need is a mentor or trusted companion to provide help with specific scenarios, the help makes sense of things, to understand why things happened, whether it is important, and what to do in future. I e. someone to help you figure out the rules.

Being afraid of doing the wrong thing is what holds you back. You learn by doing the wrong things, the issue is to be able to try, not to be too sensitive (which requires calibration) and not be so scared.

I think an autistic teacher/therapist has a better intuitive grasp of this.

Note that this is from a male perspective, I don't know what it feels like as a girl. But while it may appear a bit differently on the outside, I don't think it it is too different. 

I can only share my own experience of CBT, all of which happened prior to my ASD diagnosis. Unfortunately I didn't find it particularly fruitful. I've heard that CBT isn't always as effective with N/D people. There are supposed to be modified versions that are more suitable. Again I'm just speaking from my experience. Good luck.

Hi, I had CBT (though) at an older age and I didn’t find it helpful. The CBT course I did was very standardised and it just didn’t do anything for me (it was so overly simplified and some of the thinking patterns they tried to teach like problem solving were just so super obvious and it just didn’t work for me). I’ve had really bad experiences with therapy in general. 1.5 years ago my university offered to fund some sessions with a therapist who is autistic himself and mainly works with neurodivergent individuals- it’s not CBT and I reluctantly decided to give therapy another chance and this is the first time that I feel that it’s actually useful and I still occasionally talk to the counsellor. It makes a huge difference that he’s autistic himself so I just don’t have to explain so many things and I feel much more understood. He also works with autistic children to support them. I would listen to what your daughter says- therapy can be helpful but it can also be harmful and if it doesn’t feel right it’s safer to stop. If it is an option financially, maybe you could also consider looking for someone who has specific experience working with neurodivergent children and/or who is neurodivergent himself. 

Thank you so much for replying and bumping, I appreciate it. 

That's what I'm thinking regarding CBT - trying to help her manage the anxiety rather than 'fix' her autistic self, which where looking at her behaviour resulting from this feeling starts. It's a bit complex as her anxiety isn't all the time, the same with the insomnia. They are definitely linked as you say. It seems quite difficult to find a properly qualified CBT therapist who specialises in neurodivergent children. We are looking at all options at the moment.

We are fully accepting of the diagnosis, we feel really positive about it however it does feel like a deep and heavy responsibility to know what to do with this information. She is only 10 and we (obviously) want to support her the best we can. 

Thanks again!