The toxic interaction between Autism and Narcissism

I've been looking into psychosocial dynamics of why a developmental disorder and and a personality disorder can be so destructive to the wellbeing of both individual sufferers when in the presence of one another. They appear to operate as polar opposites in terms of dysfunctions of nature.

  • A narcissist project hurt down to others to get them to satisfy their needs.
  • An autist reflect hurt back to themselves into a meltdown of needs.
  • NT's simply help each other with their needs.

The solution to this is to break apart the cycle of suffering that enables the perpetuated spiral of emotionally negative transactions. Physical distancing may very well be necessary to help the situation of toxic transmissions of hate and fear.

Once separated, realisation of ones own grief is necessary to ensure that psychic losses are contained and accepted within the confines of their own environment. Only when awareness of compromised psychic defences has been realised that healing can truely take place without risk of future breakdown. Any length of intervention can only be determined by the end users decision making capacity for their own welfare.

Please note that these are my own thoughts as a male aspie that has been brought up by narcissistic mother for almost 2 decades and is still struggling with the fallout of psych-ache.

  • I struggle with abuse and often was dismissed and pushed around by others (can’t really identify whether they’re narcissistic or not) and people saw me as making excuses for my mental health problems.

    I was seen as hostile while they got to push my buttons to make me lose it. I have a very hypersensitive emotional brain, something that I don’t believe many people in the spectrum have. I’ve been ostracized by my own community and baited into believing I’m their friend so people can slowly belittle and mock me.

    Every time I discuss my feelings about my hypersensitivity, I get laughed at and given the “there are people worse off than you/no one else had your problems, so what’s your point?” treatment. And when I confront their behavior, they will yell at me and accuse me of being hostile and self-centered. I’m told I should let people be themselves because they’re autistic as well, meanwhile I don’t have the right to express myself freely.

    ok, I’ll shut up now.

  • My daughter (diagnosed) and my husband (undiagnosed) are autistic.  I am beginning to wonder if my husband is a narcissist.  He always talks about himself and his interests, never letting the other person speak, has big ideas about himself and is a constant show off. He is an embarrassment socially.  We have been married 45 years, most of which have been unhappy.  I am finding it increasingly difficult to live with him and I am afraid for my daughter’s mental health.  She lives with us.  Any suggestions?  Thank you.

  • hello - i have just become a member.

  • NPD is a personality disorder whereas ASD is a developmental disorder. I would bet and say that alot of ASD people are blunt but have authentic souls. That is not the case for NPD, there is a calculation, an intentional motive or manipulation. There is however a cross over of symptoms for certain things but the intent is very different. However this is complex because there are instances where people have both conditions but this is very rare. More often than not, a highly empathetic ASD individual will gaslight themselves, due to the judgements from neurotypical people and internalise their ignorant & false perspective. Please be mindful of this and anyone, even NPDs, can seek professional help :))

  • Thank you DongFeng5! Been busy at work...they’ve nearly wrung this chicken dry....I think I’m what they call battery farmed...but I want to be free range! 

  • Sadly this chicken doesn’t seem to learn,I keep trying to cross that road, keep getting knocked down, to not cross the road means staying put! Not interacting, no co exhisting in a world I have no choice but to continue in, earn money to live, work alongside others I don’t agree with or at times understand, 

    I live in false hope that my intentions will be accepted, and that those who seek to be against me will change.

    I have to learn to distrust and begin to hate those who seek to harm me, not something I relish as a part of My beliefs.

     If I stop believing that I may as well give up all together, I cannot stop my brain from thinking how it does, I can understand the why keep happening! and because points, but my beliefs are my beliefs .

  • Ellie, nice to see you back on the forums. I was wondering how you have been doing.

  • Well, I guess most chickens quickly learn to avoid trying to cross the road as much as they possibly can.

  • There is no problem with you Lone....it is just because we have to cross the tracks to reach NTs. You’re an ND chicken, trying to cross an NT road... you’re bound to get hit or knocked down, now and again... the issue is how we process being knocked down or rejected...

  • “People with Aspergers generally are high functioning in everyday life but have great difficulty connecting with others due to the inability to read faces, body language and subtle verbal clues. They also tend to take words literally and have a hard time multi-tasking.”

    Taken from an article Aspergers and the Alien,

    yes we do understand others have thoughts that differ from our own. 

    I often misunderstand and feel I have done or said something wrong, this in turn makes me feel low, I start to believe I have caused upset, no amount of reassurance after makes me feel any better.

    it Is due to constantly being wrong in many ways, a life of never getting it right. To give unconditional love and feel it is rejected, An offer to help being misunderstood as me trying to gain something from it?

     I will continue being wrong as I only try to do what I feel is right.

    The pain never gets less, but I can understand my actions are based on belief for others and not through a need to control or manipulate them.

  • Nice distinction.  And I speak from experience.  Having a Narcissist living with me for months. Was a nightmare.  Made me doubt myself and lose even the little trust in people I had before Head bandage

  • From that page:

    "Theory of mind (T.O.M) means you have the ability to understand that other people have thoughts that differ from your own."

    Of course I have the ability to comprehend that other people are autonomous and have their own thoughts, independent of mine...(!)

    I just don't know what those thoughts they have might be! Whenever I ask people "you look X, are you feeling Y?", they almost always tell me I've gotten it wrong...

  • The differences between Aspergers and narcissist.

    www.kmarshack.com/.../

    367,

  • My mother and sister were / are exactly as you describe and more. I'm not sure if I'd call them narcissists exactly but they were definitely unhealthy people to be around - and not just for me. They were damaging to anyone around them who didn't agree with them. 

    Having looked for reasons for all of their behaviours in the past, when it used to matter to me, I think Psychopath best described my sister. As for my mother, I don't think the ICD has a classification for Pure Evil yet. 

  • Well as I said previously, I wasn't aware until my psychotherapist pointed it out.  I am oblivious to people who have ulterior motives or bad intentions.  It's only when other people point it out that I become aware of it.  The only way I protect myself now is to be very cautious around people I don't know and even then I make mistakes.  I think the point is you don't know until it is too late, or you have moved on in life where you can look bad in a neutral and non-emotional way so as not to cast bias. 

    If it was so easy to know, then I would want to know how as it would have prevented a lot of unnecessary suffering along the way!

  • So how would I know? How could I tell if someone in my life was narcissistic? I looked at several of those "you know you're with a narcissist when...", websites, but to be honest I just drew a blank. I'm not sure I've ever been around someone like that. 

    On the other hand, everything with my ex-wife always seemed to have to be a drama. I don't know why. Clearly some things in life are dramas, but I often felt like the simplest of things would be seemingly blown out of all proportion for effect? Do any of you recognise that sort of thing?

  • I'm puzzled, and hoping someone can explain. [Hopefully I can also avoid a torrent of abuse from you all...(!)]

    It seems like nearly all of you have encountered narcissistic individuals and have horror stories to tell. But whenever I look at websites about narcissistic behaviour, they mention things like lack of empathy, anxiety and need to have things "their way"... all of which sound to me like symptoms of ASC?

    Because of the sheer number of folk claiming to have suffered at the hands of narcissists, I am wondering whether the world really is full of them, or whether some of us are somehow projecting things onto others? I.e. Could it be the case that our own cognitive failings increase the chances that we will perceive narcissism in someone who is actually entirely innocent?

    i did a narcissism test myself, but it said I display something called echoism, which somehow seems to be the opposite of narcissism?

  • It could be the way we operate and function that makes us more prone to come across narcissists in our lives.

    When I was undergoing intensive psychotherapy, the therapist commented that my ex partners had psychopathic tendencies and were narcissistic.  I also had a circle of 'friends' at the time that were also preying on me in the same way.  The therapist warned me that the way I operated and understood the world, would make me a prime target for this type of person.  This was before my ASD diagnosis, but I have always been on my guard now and have been better at spotting potential threats. 

  • All I can suggest is to get out whilst you still can!

  • It's not just ASD people that suffer from Narcissists, they are the some of the few people in life I'd ever describe as truly evil, they will hurt anyone and anything to gratify themselves, I've one leave a huge trail of destruction in his wake, he didn't care who he hurt and the majority of those hurt by him were NT. He left an ex wife with PTSD, a son so mal-adjusted he doesn't fit in and may well be a full blown narcissist himself etc.

    I'm now aware of NPDs and I wouldn't ever let one worm their way into any part of my life again (the previous one was a boss), I'd also actively shun these people and not interact with them, they are truly evil individuals.