Reform UK Deputy Leader wants to scrap the Equality Act

I'm more than a little frustrated and disillusioned . On  one hand you had the tactically inept pro Corbyn left who put ideology above doing what's needed to win an election . Labour as a perpetual protest party. Now we have a Starmer led Labour trying to out Tory the Tories on welfare. Both in their different ways weren't/aren't getting it right. I want a radical but sensibly pragmatic Labour government. I sure as sure can be don't want one that sees being hard hearted towards the disabled and/or vulnerable as a political virtue.

Harold Wilson said that the Labour Party needs two wings to fly.  But today's Labour is ridden with factions hell bent on destroying each other.  Starmer has done everything possible to alienate some in Labour ,so it would be naive for him to turn around and ask for their support.  So at the moment he is attempting to fly the party with only one wing.

Harold Wilson said that the Labour Party needs two wings to fly.  But today's Labour is ridden with factions hell bent on destroying each other.  Starmer has done everything possible to alienate some in Labour ,so it would be naive for him to turn around and ask for their support.  So at the moment he is attempting to fly the party with only one wing.

I find the whoie class thing confusing and increasingly irrelevant, my parents were working class, ordinary people who owned their own home, for them getting a mortgage was a struggle, my mums wages didn't count and my dads boss had to write a letter saying that there was permanent overtime available. I have a skilled trade as a hairdresser, but also a degree and now I'm on disability benefits, what does that make me?

I didn't trust Corbyn, or more specifically I didn't trust John McDonal, he seemed to be the one promoting Corbyn as Magic Grandpa the most. Having been around in the 70's and 80's, there was no way I wanted a return to that sort of strife, nor did I want to be told where I could live, seeing as with their inheritance tax reforms I wouildn't have been left with enough money to afford anywhere of my own and I didn't want 'Jeremy to build me a house'.

I also didn't trust the power the unions had over Corbyn, to me many unions are stuck in the past, I wondered how long it would be before womens rights were rolled back and we were shoved back into the home and into caring roles, so as men could have the "dignity of work". I know unions have cahnged a lot over the last 30 years, but I still remember them as being hostile to women, happy to use us to rattle tins to support striking miners, but then to go back home.

I think Labour have a long and painful road ahead of them, rebuilding our country will take as much effort and expense as it did after WW2, so many schools and hospitals need rebuilding, so much infrastructure. I think people want good public services and many are willing to pay for them, but they also want the freedom to choose how to spend thier money.

firemonkey said:

I'm not at all pleased with Labour's stance on  welfare.

Labour as it exists now is just a more moderate version of the Tories and have been since the days of Tony Blair.

Why? Because the socialists represent a part of societ that is dwindeling slowly away to nothing as more and more move into the "middle classes" and share aspirations that are more capitalist than socialist.

I really don't think there will ever be a socialist party in power again as they are just no longer relevant to the vast majority of the electorate.

In the meantime Labour continue to wave the red flag of history to gain the few votes that are available from this and we slowly move into a phase of medium right to slightly more medium right parties who alternate holding power as they have done for all of this century.

I'm a pragmatic socialist. One that believes that the main task of a political party is winning elections and changing things for the better. On that score I'm not at all pleased with Labour's stance on  welfare. I very strongly believe that socialists should be making the case for more socialism from within the Labour party, rather than throwing a lengthy political tantrum  because Corbyn was dumped due to being totally incompetent.

The left that includes Corbyn has been about tactically dumb as you can get , with repeatedly demanding the voters embrace too much socialism within one election campaign. They should've played the long game and built up the case for socialism., gradually getting voters on side by well presented  and articulated reasons as to the benefits of a more socialistic,left of centre, society.

I don't think we're going to agree on this as I am of the left and proud of it.

I thought Starmer was on the Corbyn Left?  That's what he told the Labour membership to get elected.   And yet we find out he was closer to Tony Blair all along.

Keir Starmer is now the most unpopular Prime Minister since Liz Truss.  I bet she still has fans who blame everyone else for her problems too.

It's the BBC!  It's the Media! etc

You're better off getting attached to polices rather than politicians in my view.  

It dosen't matter who you vote for the government always get in!

There are those on those on the Corbyn left who deliberately chose to behave in  a way that would see them kicked out of the party. They then used that thoroughly dishonestly to say that Starmer was hell bent on kicking socialists out of Labour. That he was destroying party  unity.