BBC Radio 4: The link between terrorism and autism.

It's too much like hard work, and who wants the aggravation of trying to rule a bunch of NT's?

Exactly, 

The autistic supervillain would not leave James Bond in an elaborate mechanism designed to kill him, he would just shoot him!

If villains in movies and television where autistic i don't think the hero would win. firstly they would have to attempt to think in the same way as the autistic villain which would make the autistic villain unpredictable to the most neurotypical super hero. Secondly a truly autistic person would make super villainy a specialised subject and know to avoid revealing plots of their plans, Organised to schedule and wouldn't rely on people to assist them in their plans for world domination.    

i'm surprised no autistic individual in the real world has tried taking over the world. 

On a more interesting note, now I've finally managed to hear the broadcast, just wow!

A couple of things if I may?

The Brummie describing his bad thoughts and how the medications helped him sort them out and reduce their power to influence him, was the exact inverse of my personal initial Prozac experience. Prozac pushed me towards his unmedicated state, which is why I discontinued it. 

The access to mental health help thing is a joke. I've been trying to get help with the ADD for a few years now, this week, I will be exploring Ritalin, outside of the system, because, frankly I want to get it done and see if that drug will hep me focus and restore to me the ability to obtain a living which I lost twenty years ago this year. I've been very good about the last twenty years of complete poverty and the slow dismantling of my lifestyle that resulted, have eschewed crime, and generally "sucked it down" like a trooper, but I'm still raging against my limitations and dealing with the consequent feelings of uselessness, helplessness etc. and getting older. I can't wait whilst my needs are ignored and my requests unanswered in the usual manner..

Did I read correctly that if I out myself to the correct agency, maybe knock up a bomb or two (I'm happy to do that providing I don't have to hurt anyone or destroy useful property) they might give me "pip" without having to lie or describe my limitations with a view to convincing someone who is expecting dishonesty on my part even before they meet me?

And in my case, I am sure my weapons interests and enduring wish to fire a gun again are a psychological injury caused by my weapons training at an impressionable age by the government!

Although actually it feels ore of a 'sperg thing in latter years. I could never get the Browing Hi-Power to do a full magazine without jamming... Now I know why it did that, I think I'd like to have another go..

I've always wanted to get a bit more practice, but ever since Dunblane it's become almost impossible.

However.. I FOUND A FIREARMS TEACHINGS ESTABLISHMENT that will let me continue my weapons training! If I can get a group of us together we can do the police firearms course, or a mixed weapons handling course, with breaking any law!! Which would be good, but it's about 800 quid a day plus accommodation. Boo! Also, everyone I know who professes an interest in weapons even those who own airguns and the like seem to balk when I suggest that we actually go and do some. They are all afraid of ending up on some sort of a "list" seems to be the consensus.

If you think video games are addictive, they aren't. Not compared to firing a real bang-stick! Those who carry firearms for a living are taught from day1 not to enjoy it. Like that really has any effect, go talk to anyone who's fired a gun, and once you get past the "It's no big deal", in reality there is a visceral power in the thing, that I'm personally really glad is held out of the hands of some of you people out there. Some of us can't be trusted to use a laptop correctly, let alone a gun! I don't think I'll ever do that curse, I'd probably want to do more, and I really don't need an expensive interest!

Yes, I just revealed that I have a long standing and abiding deep interest in weapons, and probably worse, it was cast in the crucible of my lifelong need to protect myself, although the rule of law has done a reasonable job of making the streets safe for me to use unarmed, (I've only been mugged twice, and both times managed to retain my property and health through application of psychology & positioning, no gun required) so the gun laws work for me. I'd hate to live in the U.S. where of course whilst I get to indulge my interest practically, that "fun" is offset by the sobering fact that the sort of idiots who express hate when I speak my mind inappropriately could be armed with a gun!

I'd HAVE to have one over there, and the downside to owning firearms as a means of self protection rather than a hobby, is that they are yet another thing that you have to spend a lot of time constantly keeping track of and remembering where it is, and cleaning and lubricating, and keeping it out of the hands of the kids... 

Anyway, the fascination of weapons pales in richness, to the fascination and complexity of adding our two new cats into my life. I've finally got the second one to "like" me and in less than three months! Watching her grow from a small thing (she's ten years old so not a kitten) hiding behind the electrostatics and having to be coaxed out for food, to the rather happier little dominatrix she is becoming, is way more fun than poking holes in targets from a distance. And now they are ganging up on me for the promised "play"... 

Was that a "bizarre" post? Probably, if you've not done any weapons handling, I suppose. But terrorism? Killing people or blowing their stuff up or making biological weapons in laboratories?

Aren't our governments doing enough of that stuff already? 

Terrorism isn't a mental health problem it's an evil problem. To many people are being taught by our beloved "mass media" that violent means can solve problems. That idea permeates EVERYTHING on T.V. except when the protagonists cannot shoot their way out of trouble, then they LIE their way out of trouble. These techniques are held up as solutions, rather than the actual prolonging of the problems that they really are. Of course the weak minded or desperate will be drawn to seeking these sorts of solutions.

Of course our cohort includes many of these people but if we were focussed on, and eliminated as a source of terrorists, it still would not eliminate the problem, just make us even more of a target for "interference" disguised as "working for the greater good". 

My experience is that with genuine loving help, I can play a useful role in this society, (and I have in the past) but left to my own devices unaided, I just get the shitty end of the stick endlessly, and it is very demoralising.

It would fill me with hatred and resentment if I had not found it possible to exist outside of the system without starving or being constantly hounded for money I do not have, and cannot acquire. 

Fortunately the original subversive, Jesus Christ, told me how to finesse this. He said "Be in the world, but not of the world". Suits me.

I do pity the poor souls who have neither resourcefulness nor religious training to fall on, they must be easy meat for the recruiters & promoters of evil, such as your terrorist organisations, or government.

OK.  Sorry if I upset you, that wasn't the intention. 

I'm glad to read that you're looking after your mental heath whilst calling other posters output, when expressed on this forum, as "bizarre"

I'll replace the word Odd with "jarring" to make the difference between what I did there, and what you now appear to be doing here, clearer.

And yes, when I write, I do get a little "steampunk" in my choice of words from time to time. It's a decoration rather than an affection.

You won't find one here, then.

I wrote the post to which you are replying, directly to the OP straight off the bat, having read most of the OP and been triggered by the suggested link twixt Autism and terrorism, because to be honest a fair few screen villains seem to be autistic to me, and I've been cast as the villain myself more often than I believe is reasonable or correct. I wasn't referring to your post. 

(Edit for readibility, and to make sure the sense is clear.) 

I'm not sure if this is a reference to my post, but for clarity, I'd not previously read the comments that you summarize here. I wasn't minded to get into personalized arguments.

On a lighter note, I'm glad that someone who can deploy the phrase "made curious to wonder" sees no irony in accusing me of using "odd English"   

A cuckoo lays eggs in the nests of other species and its young may displace the hatched eggs of the nest builder, and I believe that's the origin of this word, which, right or not, is widely used in this context in the law enforcement community.   Language evolves, so perhaps this is an example of that.   

On social media, I very much look after my own mental health.  There are some topics which are indeed (to me) bizarre, or unpleasant, or which touch on deeply personal issues for me, and which I choose not to discuss on a platform like this. 

Normies like "winding us up". We all know that.

That's not the right word. https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/cuckolded

You do use odd English. In a post above you refer to there being "bizarre posts" recently. 

Again with the dictionary: https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/bizarre

I'm made curious to wonder which of the recent posts do you consider "unusual" for an autists forum?

Just piqued my curiosity. I've read more of the thread now, and it looks like I'm in the adults section at last.

I think I'll just adjust my attitude and read for a while..

Wow! Someone opened that box and it wasn't me! But now I'm going to go there..

I wrote a lot, then I remembered that there are policemen here, and I've already had a pop at them, so I think a bloody good edit of what I wrote is in order. Not because it revealed ANY unlawful activity, but it did start with...

When the IRA were doing their campaign, I remember being struck by how much better I'd do it if I were minded to...

*Snip*

It's the prevention of Evil (a concept never really explored on the telly is it, of how you or I could be Evil and not realise it and how to avoid it instinctively) that makes the real difference of outcome, I feel, NOT the hiding of knowledge...

That is the difference between a terrorist or a safety officer. The lack of evil intent.

The UPSIDE of my sort of Autism it that it makes me really GOOD at being able to DO whatever it is takes my interest, which is occasionally very useful to others, the downside is that I'm quite bad at doing things that do not engage me at a fundamental level that is very hard to over come (like steering an oil tanker, doable, but not quickly or easily) which just causes me trouble and isolation, which is compounded by the difficulty in communication/ real world processing caused by the Autism. 

*snip*

The point i wandered off from, is that whilst the "aptitude" and "social isolation" are co-morbid with terrorism and Autism alike, it takes a special kind of nastiness to make a terrorist, called Evil in any civilised language, and that is what is the danger, not the autism. But whilst our aptitude for seeking and finding solutions would probably make us better terrorists, were are no more likely to be evil than any normie, who I am certain make up the majority of terrorists, it's just that like in "normal" life, the Autistic terrorist will Stick out like a sore thumb!

It's because individuals on the spectrum without intellectual disability are often left struggling, expected to assimilate into society. Repeatedly trying to assimilate by getting employed and end up getting repeatedly traumatised, Bully and harrased to the point where they begin to hate the whole human race. 

Another Part of it is that some of us are easily manipulated because we are sometimes so desperate for human interaction and connection we sometimes get taking avantages by cults, organisation and domestically abusive partners. As they often show us some sort of affection.    

Reading this report (link below) - about an extremely vulnerable, autistic man, 'cuckolded' (had people forcibly move into his house against his wishes to use it as a base for drugs trading), and then murdered, by a bunch of thugs, it's hard to escape the conclusion that woefully under-resourced mental health services (who failed to supply the support he needed) acted in concert (albeit unwittingly) with those who killed him.

He was clearly suggestible, and transparently vulnerable. He should have been protected from this awful fate.  

He was neglected by support services, and even if you discard the moral argument and look at it from their perspective, in terms of cynical political self-interest, they've now ended up devoting far more resources to the situation (police investigations, court cases, massive negative publicity etc) than they would have done by dealing with him diligently and professionally in the first place.  

He didn't become a terrorist and he wasn't on Prevent's radar, but it's just another tragic outcome resulting from the same core problem.  

Here's the report if you haven't seen it (despite 'partygate' it has had extensive reporting across the media):

www.bbc.co.uk/.../uk-england-beds-bucks-herts-60125424

Glad you appreciated it, and thanks.  Some interesting points.  I agree there have been some slightly bizarre posts recently, I tend to just ignore those(!)

PersonAnon, thank you for providing the link, this was an interesting programme. The man who became involved in the far-right group provided a poignant and articulate explanation for his experiences. I've read around this subject before, and what he said accorded with my earlier research, that ideological grooming isn't generally done by doctrine, but more often by social interaction. I've heard about religious fundamentalists organizing football games targeted at lonely children, with the focus on doctrine only occurring after they made friends they didn't want to give up.

The statistics about the amount of autistic people involved in prevent were interesting, but I wonder whether they reflect the people who got caught. I think it's likely that the 'true believers' in these movements- the organizers who want to overthrow the state etc, have a very different profile from the vulnerable recruits featured in the broadcast.

It also highlighted the social costs involved in poor mental health provision, which are seen in a number of areas.

From a personal perspective, I would be almost impervious to ideological persuasion on these topics, as I'm very heavily focused on facts, logic, and evidence, but I sometimes worry that I'm open to emotional manipulation because of isolation and poor understanding of social situations. There are probably some ways in which autistic people are more vulnerable to radicalization, and some ways in which they are less vulnerable. I'm sure that autistic people with generally better lives where their needs are met have very similar risks to the rest of the population.

On another note, this thread, and the subsequent discussion, is in my view a much better use of the forum that some other topics recently. Sometimes, I think the forum has become in danger of being crowded with conspiracy theories; in one recent thread, there was even a call to violence. These kinds of discussions are, in my view, more in keeping with what we need.

Done