ESA!!!!! ATOS!!!!!

Hello "Nobody",

The place to contract would be some sort of advocacy service that deals with benefit applications. Do you have an autism organisation in your area? Or (given your apparent severe anxiety) a mental health organisation? Another option is Citizens' Advice. Not every organisation has a benefits service, but should at least be able to tell you where in your local area that you can approach for support.

ESA is done on points. Just because someone has (or appears to have) one skill like using a phone, doesn't mean that trumps all other difficulties that would make work very difficult or impossible.

All the best with getting some help.

I have Asperger's Syndrome.  I was diagnosed late, as I guess a lot of middle aged people are.  I grew up in an area of high unemployment in the north of england.  I can't tell whether I am stigmatised by a neurological condition or by being from the north, often they seem to have very similar effects.  I was stuck in a college after school and ended up spending the next fifteen years in education, ending up with a phd that was never worth a penny.  I ended up struggling to pay for education and then never got any.  I suffered so deeply during my university education, at that time, there was almost nobody from the north and so I was completely stigmatised.  I suffered a lot of humiliation, living with it on a daily basis, all the while knowing my future was bleak, I could tell from the non-education that i had no future.  It's all processes of elimination anyway.  Anyway, I ended up in hospital twice I got in such a state but eventually finished the phD and got it just to end up back in the home town I hoped to escape in the same condition.  I've remain trapped ever since really and been on benefits for decades.  Last time I went to see anyone at the benefits was 2003 I think.  Last time I was transitioned to ESA from IB without interview.  This time, I think I ticked too many "maybe" questions instead of "No's", I was so stupid.  But now I am in the position where I have to go through the medical.  I can't see I'll survive this and I'll be finished.  I am middle aged now and I've never worked.  I have appalling problems with anxiety, agoraphobia, PTSD (due to the humiliation of university where I spent ten years), I am haunted by the social world, I just try to avoid people as far as I can.  I can't function at all and I am effectively a social cripple.  I can't even face the prospect of going out.  I do manage to go out once-a-day but it's an ordeal and I feel sick almost all the time.  The sense of terror characteristic of autism haunts every moment.  So, anyway, I have read about this interview and I can't see any way I can get through it.  I have published one or two things, other appalling experiences where I've sent stuff off to people who have no contact with me.  So, the benefits people have only to put my name in google to see I can communicate, even though, in reality, I am totally socially dysfunctional.  Much of my work has been done over the phone, but that probably means I could do a job in a call centre.  Anyway, I can barely manage to go out of the door and I don't like or trust people.  I just want to keep away from people as best I can since it's best that way.

  Anyway, is there any way to get legal advice over answers to these questions?

The land of CONFUSION !

quote Scorpion....

"Incapacity does not exist any more (for new claimants).

ESA is the replacement for Incapacity.

And then there's JSA (which is for non-disabled people who are actively seeking work).

However, because the government can't leave anything alone, DLA is being replaced by Personal Independance Payment, and JSA and ESA (for most people) will be replaced by Universal Credit. quote"

Meantime, the British heart and spirit has been numbed. The whole bloodyy thing is a joke !! Time to cut the government and give them all the chop.!

autismtwo said:

Why are you on ESA,, if you have autism ? You are falling into a benefit stress work trap.

I thought when you said this you were critisising people for being on ESA and not working. The next sentence:

You need to work from your condition of Autism into the world, not from worlds relative.

I did not understand so maybe that is where the misunderstanding has arisen. I must admit I had been surprised.

autismtwo said:

Have I made a mistake,, I thought ESA was employment and support allowance.

I was saying do not work unless you are fit too via your own condition(as Scorpian stated also).

Incapacity and DLA are the benefits I would say an Autistic spectrum person should be applying for.

Incapacity does not exist any more (for new claimants).

ESA is the replacement for Incapacity.

And then there's JSA (which is for non-disabled people who are actively seeking work).

However, because the government can't leave anything alone, DLA is being replaced by Personal Independance Payment, and JSA and ESA (for most people) will be replaced by Universal Credit.

Have I made a mistake,, I thought ESA was employment and support allowance.

I was saying do not work unless you are fit too via your own condition(as Scorpian stated also).

Incapacity and DLA are the benefits I would say an Autistic spectrum person should be applying for.

I absolutely agree with Scorpion0x17. I have had over thirty years of trying to work and I cannot do it anymore.  The daily levelof distress was too great. The process of getting ESA was stressful but once I was through it, it was SUCH a relief. At last I can start living, being myself, instead of trying to fit in with the world. I do sometimes have a society induced guilt about not being able to work, which AutismTwo's comment doesn't help.  I hope I can in some way make a contribution in other ways.  I don't recognise AutismTwo's "trap".

autismtwo said:

Why are you on ESA,, if you have autism ? You are falling into a benefit stress work trap. You need to work from your condition of Autism into the world, not from worlds relative.

You will just end up not well again. You need a support framework to make sure you are under the correct care. Do not undermine your condition, by hoop jumping,, it does not work. I have done this all my life,, you end up in a collaspe state.

Take care of your health first, the rest follows.

Not everyone on the Spectrum can work, autismtwo.

Indeed some find working more stressful than being on benefit.

And, of those that can work, not all can easily find work in a properly supportive environment, and need help to do so.

Also work is as much about hoop jumping as being on benefit.

There is no one solution that will suit everyone.

For some working in a properly supportive environment will be the solution, for others it will be living on benefits.

The choice of whether to live on benefits or whether to work is not one about undermining ones own condition, it's about recognising ones own limitations and finding the correct solution for oneself.

In fact your comments could be seen as reflecting and reiterating the wider societies attitudes of "if you're not working your life is worthless and meaningless and you'll only get worse so you might as well be left to rot".

Finally, for those on the Spectrum that can not work, or find work difficult, ESA is by far the most suitable and stress free benefit that is currently available, as you not put under the same pressure to work as when you're on JSA and they will help you to find the work you're able to do, in a supportive environment.

Why are you on ESA,, if you have autism ? You are falling into a benefit stress work trap. You need to work from your condition of Autism into the world, not from worlds relative.

You will just end up not well again. You need a support framework to make sure you are under the correct care. Do not undermine your condition, by hoop jumping,, it does not work. I have done this all my life,, you end up in a collaspe state.

Take care of your health first, the rest follows.

missribbons said:

I dont even know where to begin. After years of being unsuccessful in employment - either being sacked or bullied, i have found myself applying for ESA.

The psychological damage that has been caused trying to be a part of society has left me on medication. I wake each morning shaking with fear, usually this is after a night of sleep walking and nightmares.

I relunctantly came to the realisation that i needed to be on ESA. The application form was intimidating and very stressful as i worded each issue i dealt with on a day to day basis. I felt i poured my darkest secrets of how life as an adult with aspergers really is and it hurt. But i needed to do this to survive.

Last week i recived a letter to say i needed to attend a medical assesment to see if i was capable for work. I attended this today.

As i had feared the whole meeting was very distressing, intrusive and completely inappropriate in regards to aspergers syndrome - or 'disease' as the healthcare advisor called it!!!

My reflexs were examined, i was asked to squat, lift my arms, bend my legs, what my hobbies were, did i use a mobile? did i go on the internet? did i play games? all baffling all invasive and all to tick boxes. 

I have avoided reading much about ATOS - the private company paid to assess us; 'lying theiving bastards' but from panoramas programme earlier this week, i feel that this is not an assesment to help those with aspergers. I am scared for the result and distraught at how this has left me feeling even more isolated and desperate than before.

What an awful experience!!

I didn't have anything like that. 

On the form, near the end where they ask if you have any particular needs such as a female, I said the most important thing was to have someone who had knowledge of Autism spectrum and he could not have been more different to yours.  I was also fortunate to have a friend that could come with me and she would not have let them do what happened to you.

Before I started on the form I got a report from a clinical psychologist specialising in AS. I got her name by emailing NAS.

This person doesn't seem to understand that the workplace is not about what you can do physically - it's about people.

It took two weeks for my decision to come through.

Hi all,

missribbons - sorry to hear about your experience during assessment. We have some information about claiming and applying for ESA here: www.autism.org.uk/.../employment-and-support-allowance.aspx. You can also arrange an appointment with our team by calling our Helpline if you'd like more info on ESA - 0808 800 4104 (Mon-Fri, 10-4pm) or you can send us an email with your information and we'll respond: welfarerights@nas.org.uk.

hohner - details of our Board of Trustees, along with the appointment process, annual report and accounts are here: www.autism.org.uk/.../board-of-trustees.aspx. 

Can I remind all members that the Community Rules state posts that are offensive or insulting to others are subject to being edited or removed. The same applies when referencing services or individuals as comments may be considered libelous. If you have concerns, we would encourage any complaints to be sent to community.manager@nas.org.uk where we can support you further.

Best wishes,
Mike, NAS 

I also found myself out of work midway last year and had to apply for ESA but I was refused the higher rate, and I was told I had to go to a tribunal.

I appealed via a form they sent, can't remember my exact words but told them something like -  I request that a qualified expert in ASD must be present at the appeal to make the assessment valid. If the assessment if made by those without any expertise or knowledge of ASD then I will appeal again. I will also bring it to the attention of those making the assessment that they have no right to make an assessment unless such an expert is present.

I cannot say for sure if this was the reason but a few week later I got a letter saying they had revised their decision !!!

The London city plc government is an institute which does not have any concern for the disabled,, the reason is german eugenics, survival of the fittest, it also has no consequences to the population, as it knows it has an army of social *********** working for it, be it judges, assessors, council adminstration drones, politicians, councilors, police, ghetto wardens, soldiers.. BRITAIN IS ****** ! The standard of ethics has fallen. The good protecting the vulnerable is lost. The interest group system has been bought by position controls,(the people heading up these organisations are not representing the organisations, it is a resource containment sphere), to data collect and policy control. Who are the NAS ? Why can't I  see any mention of the board of directors on the site ? why not ? Will one of the social spy ****** moderators tell me who are these people,, BASED IN LONDON of course.

@missribbons: Two things to bear in mind:

1. if you have to appeal, go to the CAB as soon as possible after getting the rejection letter - I found my CAB extremely helpful - you have certain amount of time in which to lodge the appeal, and if you do so they then can't force on to JSA, and you won't need to claim JSA whilst waiting for the appeal (though you will continue to get the same amount of money as JSA (if you win the appeal, however, the money is back dated, so it's important to lodge the appeal application as soon as possible)).

2. if you have someone you trust and who is willing to help you, take them to the CAB and to the appeal with you - if not, then go to the CAB by yourself, but ask them if they can offer or suggest an advocacy service.

Oh, also, assuming you either get put on ESA straight away, or win your appeal, make sure you also apply for DLA, if you don't already get it.

hi missribbons - your feelings are totally justified. ATOS has a bad reputation.  Their aim appears to be to get people's benefits reduced to save the government money.  They also do not appear to be trained well enough in all the different conditions they have to assess.  Many many people win on Appeal.  These appeals obviously cost the state a fortune.  Because so many people go to Appeal, there's a long time to wait for an Appeal to be heard.  It could be bad enough under the old system when you had to go to Appeal, but I do think the old system was better than this 1.  ATOS should be assessing people accurately and applying their benefit entitlement accordingly.  That should be their purpose if people are to be treated in a fair way.  Michael Meacher MP will be raising the issue of ATOS/assessments with Ian Duncan Smith MP, who's in charge of all these benefit changes that are creating havoc.  It will be interesting to see if Michael Meacher can get anywhere with IDS - I'm not holding my breath on that 1, despite respecting Michael Meacher for trying.  I would say to anyone who's got to go for these assessments, be prepared mentally, don't be trusting of the assessor, make sure that any official info on your condition is somewhere in writing (such as doctor's notes, social services file, or wherever) so that ATOS have an up-to-date record.  If you have to go to Appeal, that info will be useful.

These people started to learn their particular trade when Thatcher got into power on the slogan 'Britain isn't working'.  Her evidence? About 1 million unemployed.  A very short while after she came to power there were 3 million and everybody available had to start to try to find ways to slim down the apparent number.

Not ASD myself, I was then looking for work and remember with a kind of ache the form I was given by the Jobcentre, or whatever it was then called, to fill in to apply for work if I could get it and benefits if I couldn't.  "What hours are you prepared to work", I remember in particular, was followed by a set of blocks to fill in and an injunction not to answer "Any".  Of course, if you said you would work any hours, which was true in my case, it did not enable them to disqualify you for setting an unreasonable limit on your hours of availability for work.

So great was the stigma, so difficult and humiliating the process, that I stopped attending and, as a result, lost my national insurance contributions for a period of about 7 years - I was at home, looking after my kids instead.

It has not changed.  I trust none of them and advise anybody else to do the same.

R

Gosh thats so manipulative! I did get the impression that the assesment was set out to find anything that you can do, rather than helping me with the things i cant do. Ie i can pick up something off the floor therefore i can be  a litter picker but this makes no sense as there are so many more elements to working for an employer.

The questions are asked to catch you out. If you say you can use the internet, well, you can clearly use a computer and can sit still without needing to get up every few minutes.

The question about the mobile, means you have no problems speaking to others and can type, therefore, can use a computer.