Socializing

Yes, this is all very troubling indeed. I thought I'd try to say something.

It seems commonly accepted the notion that there's a difference between being alone and feeling loneliness - that you can be amongst people and still feel alone.

I think in essence, that's a way of saying that our physical being isn't the entirity of our identity, and that as human beings we are defined contextuall - through creating meaningful content, and having those around us relate to it.

It does appear that perhaps this is overwhelming experience for autistics, that they are completely surrounded by people who make them feel more lonely, and that - broadly speaking, currently at-least - there is no escape from it, no matter where they go or what they do.

This would explain the frequent co-morbidities of anxiety, depression and so-on that I regard as kind of 'clustering' around the deep-rooted and virtually all-pervasive sense of alienation and frustration - how much control can you have over your life if you can't relate meaningfully to those in your immediate environment?

That's kind of tangential, but I think what I'm trying to say is - what is a 'social skill'?

Not causing trouble, even if means you don't fit in and feel wretchedly lonely is a social skill, it seems to my mind - either out of respect for others, or because you don't want to attract attention to yourself, or for any other reason.

I think actually, the problems come hand in hand with defining 'social skills' as a symptom of a neurological condition... you could say Adolf Hitler was an individual of exceptional social skill... you could also call him an inhuman, insane sociopath - that's just an extreme of course, but it illustrates something which can occur in endless other manifestations.

To have literally no social skills I guess you would have to no treat or regard human beings as any different from inanimate objects, and defining 'good' and 'bad' social skills is something of an art, rather than a science.

I feel like I am routinely ignored and treated as though I don't exist by the authorities and society in general me... but because it's them who're 'ok' (have jobs, money, houses, friends, family, etc.) I'm supposed to be the one lacking social capability... whereas you could easily say it's them that are callous, devoid of compassion, self-absorbed and uncaring... hardly highly prized social skills.

You could say a social skill facilitates gain - such as paying for something from a shop rather than stealing it (and getting arrested) - but actually, the overwhelming majority of social interaction appears to be less physically 'gain-related' and more about simply relating to those around you.

Given that autistics are by definition neurologically different, it perhaps shouldn't be so surprising that - if most of us are like me - feel as though we stick out like a sore thumb when we attempt to socialise with the vast majority.

Does any of this make sense?

I'd say there's a difference between playing a role and being yourself, but that actually, the line is rather blurry... our sense of self is defined by the roles we perceive ourselves as playing - even if we're not aware of that... it's probably a lot easier for people with 'normal' brains to act out roles without even being aware of it.

Yes, this is all very troubling indeed. I thought I'd try to say something.

It seems commonly accepted the notion that there's a difference between being alone and feeling loneliness - that you can be amongst people and still feel alone.

I think in essence, that's a way of saying that our physical being isn't the entirity of our identity, and that as human beings we are defined contextuall - through creating meaningful content, and having those around us relate to it.

It does appear that perhaps this is overwhelming experience for autistics, that they are completely surrounded by people who make them feel more lonely, and that - broadly speaking, currently at-least - there is no escape from it, no matter where they go or what they do.

This would explain the frequent co-morbidities of anxiety, depression and so-on that I regard as kind of 'clustering' around the deep-rooted and virtually all-pervasive sense of alienation and frustration - how much control can you have over your life if you can't relate meaningfully to those in your immediate environment?

That's kind of tangential, but I think what I'm trying to say is - what is a 'social skill'?

Not causing trouble, even if means you don't fit in and feel wretchedly lonely is a social skill, it seems to my mind - either out of respect for others, or because you don't want to attract attention to yourself, or for any other reason.

I think actually, the problems come hand in hand with defining 'social skills' as a symptom of a neurological condition... you could say Adolf Hitler was an individual of exceptional social skill... you could also call him an inhuman, insane sociopath - that's just an extreme of course, but it illustrates something which can occur in endless other manifestations.

To have literally no social skills I guess you would have to no treat or regard human beings as any different from inanimate objects, and defining 'good' and 'bad' social skills is something of an art, rather than a science.

I feel like I am routinely ignored and treated as though I don't exist by the authorities and society in general me... but because it's them who're 'ok' (have jobs, money, houses, friends, family, etc.) I'm supposed to be the one lacking social capability... whereas you could easily say it's them that are callous, devoid of compassion, self-absorbed and uncaring... hardly highly prized social skills.

You could say a social skill facilitates gain - such as paying for something from a shop rather than stealing it (and getting arrested) - but actually, the overwhelming majority of social interaction appears to be less physically 'gain-related' and more about simply relating to those around you.

Given that autistics are by definition neurologically different, it perhaps shouldn't be so surprising that - if most of us are like me - feel as though we stick out like a sore thumb when we attempt to socialise with the vast majority.

Does any of this make sense?

I'd say there's a difference between playing a role and being yourself, but that actually, the line is rather blurry... our sense of self is defined by the roles we perceive ourselves as playing - even if we're not aware of that... it's probably a lot easier for people with 'normal' brains to act out roles without even being aware of it.