A proposal for the resolution of the Irish border re: Brexit

England and Wales will survive Brexit. Northern Ireland might not with the way things are going...

In the run up to the referendum it was difficult to determine how Northern Ireland would vote. There were times when I wondered whether Northern Ireland should not be included in the referendum, or a second referendum held in Northern Ireland if its electorate was larger than the winning margin from the mainland.

When the results were coming through there was a clear Protestant / Unionist and Catholic / Republican split to the vote. The only significant exception was North Down but then that's demographically similar to Surrey!

The problem is further complicated by both the Conservatives and UKIP uncompromisingly hell bent on maintaining the Union at almost any costs.

A possible solution would be to split the UK into two countries - England with Wales as its dominion and Scotland with Northern Ireland as its dominion. The first leaves the EU but the second remains in the EU.

Arran said:

There were times when I wondered whether Northern Ireland should not be included in the referendum, or a second referendum held in Northern Ireland if its electorate was larger than the winning margin from the mainland.

They are part of the democratic process, so yeah they should have been included however you felt they might affect the vote.

Arran said:

After all, most Unionists in Northern Ireland are Scottish in origin.

No, most people who support the Ulster Union in Scotland are Irish in origin. Most Ulster-Scots left for the US in the 1700's.

nexus9 said:

Scotland and Ireland could become Scandinavia.

They are Celtic nations. Not Scandanavian. I'd like to try selling that idea to either the Scots or the Irish in my family. Why Scandanavia specifically?

Cassandro said:

It's certainly a mess.

It most certainly is! I was a remainer but when the vote was won I couldn't disagree because it was democratic. The people who did vote leave have been betrayed.

nexus9 said:

Brexit is more and England, little England thing, than anything else.

Arran said:

Big England. Real England.

nexus9 said:

Little England.

This is like right-left political jingoism ping-pong. I'm joining in. Medium sized England with ketchup.

nexus9 said:

It was not the EU that brought in austerity, DWP and sanctions. It was not the EU that closed down the mining industries. It was not the EU that Introduced food banks. It was not the EU that is so determined to sell off the NHS. 

Never a truer word said, it was Tory cunts making Tory cuts.

Arran said:

They would probably be happy with an independent Scotland so long as the majority of Jocks vote for it.

Do you have a problem with all ethnic groups or just the ones that begin with J? First it was Jews now "Jocks". What do you think about Jeks, Jarai or Japanese?

Cloudy Mountains said:

They are part of the democratic process, so yeah they should have been included however you felt they might affect the vote.

Had I been an MP (I'm not, by the way), I would have supported the SNP's amendment to define when the vote would have an effect, and for that to include, for the sake of cohesion and stability, a requirement that NI and Scotland had a majority to leave too:

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/eureferendum/11646236/Nicola-Sturgeon-Scottish-people-will-demand-second-independence-vote-if-dragged-out-of-EU.html

(I'd be against Scottish independence, for reference.)

DongFeng5 said:

It was the EU that ensured up to 50% of fish being caught in Europe was dumped at sea. Wasted.

nexus9 said:

Well then it is a pity that the likes of Farage didn't use his skills to lobby against a relatively small exams of bureaucratic stupidity an an MEP

Risk of overfishing particular species is a serious problem, and 'discards' were a result of previous policy that was amended in 2013. There would be a full ban on discards by 2019 anyway:

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2013/feb/27/eu-fish-discards-ban-welcomed

(Incidentally, Britain had been pushing for higher quotas that were probably unsustainable and would ultimately also be bad for fishermen and consumers.)

Cloudy Mountains said:

This is like right-left political jingoism ping-pong. I'm joining in. Medium sized England with ketchup.

How about England Lite with a new bluey whiteness and a side plate of Mercia?

I'm amazed the automatic censor didn't pick up your expletive for the Con********e Par**. Seems plurals and present participles slip through.

Cassandro said:

Had I been an MP (I'm not, by the way), I would have supported the SNP's amendment to define when the vote would have an effect, and for that to include, for the sake of cohesion and stability, a requirement that NI and Scotland had a majority to leave too:

I think that Scotland do kind of play both sides of the fence. I just think in my own mind that the UK should have been counted the way it was. The UK is basically one administrational area. I'm a remainer and if England had have voted to remain and Scotland would have voted to leave I wouldn't expect Sturgeon to have demanded a vote. I think that the SNP have learned to play the game very well but it seems a bit of a moot point if she still wants Scotland to be part of the UK. It was a UK vote not a regional vote. Again I'm a remainer but I think it was done right imo.

Cassandro said:

I'm amazed the automatic censor didn't pick up your expletive for the Con********e Par**. Seems plurals and present participles slip through.

Sometimes censorship isn't applicable. I think the accuracy of the comment was deemed as acceptable by our machine overlord.

Cassandro said:

How about England Lite with a new bluey whiteness and a side plate of Mercia?

If the "lite" part means it contains Aspartame I'll pass. Mercia sounds quite delicious though, I know it's real root but it does kind of sound like a dish. 

nexus9 said:

Scandinavian countries pay high taxes but they also provide a good standard of living for everyone. 

Looking at the proportion of taxes we pay here we aren't far off but we don't get as much back proportionately. I have Scots in my family and lived there for a while and trust me they wouldn't want to be Scandanavian. Far too patriotic!

Cassandro said:

Had I been an MP (I'm not, by the way), I would have supported the SNP's amendment to define when the vote would have an effect, and for that to include, for the sake of cohesion and stability, a requirement that NI and Scotland had a majority to leave too:

I think that Scotland do kind of play both sides of the fence. I just think in my own mind that the UK should have been counted the way it was. The UK is basically one administrational area. I'm a remainer and if England had have voted to remain and Scotland would have voted to leave I wouldn't expect Sturgeon to have demanded a vote. I think that the SNP have learned to play the game very well but it seems a bit of a moot point if she still wants Scotland to be part of the UK. It was a UK vote not a regional vote. Again I'm a remainer but I think it was done right imo.

Cassandro said:

I'm amazed the automatic censor didn't pick up your expletive for the Con********e Par**. Seems plurals and present participles slip through.

Sometimes censorship isn't applicable. I think the accuracy of the comment was deemed as acceptable by our machine overlord.

Cassandro said:

How about England Lite with a new bluey whiteness and a side plate of Mercia?

If the "lite" part means it contains Aspartame I'll pass. Mercia sounds quite delicious though, I know it's real root but it does kind of sound like a dish. 

nexus9 said:

Scandinavian countries pay high taxes but they also provide a good standard of living for everyone. 

Looking at the proportion of taxes we pay here we aren't far off but we don't get as much back proportionately. I have Scots in my family and lived there for a while and trust me they wouldn't want to be Scandanavian. Far too patriotic!