applying for higher education

I originally replied to the october email newsletter about this 6th October, but got no response.

The newsletter has a section on how to apply for higher education, which is a link to the NAS website Living with autism - education and transition - further and higher education - University: choosing and applying.  The home page also offers this as one of the four cycling options.

I'm concerned that while it may be well intentioned, it isn't really helpful. So I'm puzzled why they are flagging this up now, as if this is the site to look at when applying for higher education. It is certainly time to be thinking about enrolling on a course in September 2015 (the 2014-15 undergraduate programme being underway).

First of all choosing. Making informed choices that take account of any difficulties arising from being on the autistic spectrum is vital. So why refer the reader to standard websites (UCAS and go2uni) that don't have any autism content?  They do go on to refer to Tony Attwood's Australian perspective on education and asperger foundation information sheets, but surely the point of offering a website coverage of applying to university is to provide helpful information directly.

One paragraph begins "if you are interested in or excel in using computers, you may want to study information technology". Unfortunately there is a real problem with students on the spectrum dropping out of IT courses midway or sooner. Interest or aptitude may not be enough, because these courses expect you to complete a broad range of IT skills. The danger, for people on the spectrum, is only being interested in certain aspects.

Similarly aptitude for numbers isn't a good reason for doing a mathematics degree which would usually be highly theoretical and abstract. There aren't degrees in Arithmetic though Accountancy may be appropriate.

This is the sort of advice that needs to be offered on a website addressing choosing a degree subject. Other difficult areas are the amount of labwork involved (smelly chemicals, things happening that may cause anxiety), courses hinged on seminars (group discussions and group projects rather than individual, giving presentations in front of others, talking shops etc), courses built around practical work and fieldwork, including travel overseas. Courses with a high work experience or work-based assessment component, for someone who has had difficulty getting work placements.

Some courses involve high technology/media based assessment, which may be good for some, tricky for others.

There is no attempt to look at the issues affecting choice, if you come from an autism background. I think NAS should be addressing this if they are offering advice on Higher Education courses.

Another aspect I was concerned about was disclosure of disability when applying. Regarding the UCAS application form they say "it is your choice whether or not to disclose information at this stage" and "disclosing your disability will hopefully mean that any additional support you require will be put in place".

The UCAS disabiility categories are vague and often confusing both to applicants and university staff, especially if you have more than one disability (eg aspergers plus dyslexia) it is tempting to put this in the multiple disabilities box.

It takes a while to process UCAS forms, whether admissions tutors go through them and access the individual codings, or student services produces a list, so they tend not to get seen until several weeks into the start of the course, especially so with subsidiary modules in another division, since such data tends to be processed by main subject.  You might be doing English Language and a module from Music or Sport and Recreation - will the tutors for Music or Sport get that information quickly enough?

But they create a problem. Do tutors approach the student to ask about the disability? How many different tutors need to ask the same questions? Will all these different people be able to handle the information discretely?  In reality many students assume what they disclosed on the UCAS form will get them support, often that doesn't happen. Mainly because all the different people who need to know aren't sure what to do. And it is not in the student's best interests to have this random, multiple interface.

Most universities try to centralise this with student services, but to do that the student needs to register and be assessed as to their needs. An added problem is that many universities have gone for the Social Model of Disability, which they interpret as meaning that providing extra time in exams, or coloured paper handouts, or wheelchair ramps is enough. This often means the lecturers and tutors don't get enough information.

So it is important to register with disability support and be pro-active in approaching tutors and lecturers about your disability needs rather than rely on UCAS.

NAS merely says it would be useful to contact student services about disability needs. They place too much emphasis on the UCAS form. 

I've focussed on just two key issues. But a lot of the website information on applying to Higher Education is vague and under-informed. Some of their links are very dated, eg DIRCON.

My feeling is, if NAS are intending to offer an advice service on applying to university, they need to provide well-informed, cutting-edge information. I feel it is irresponsible of them to promote help pages that hardly go far enough.

But other respondents on here may disagree, and may have found the NAS web pages helpful. So please comment.

  • Thanks Avi.

    My concern arose because you advertised having a resource for people applying to university. I personally wouldn't have felt comfortable advertising that I could provide an out of date service that might not be fit for purpose.

  • Hi Longman,

    We appreciate you bringing this issue up and are definitely looking into it.

    We agree that going to University is a very big decision and students should have the best information possible when choosing their course.

    With that in mind we are taking steps to update the information on website. In the interim period we have informed our Helpline staff of this so they will be able to advise callers. 

    We hope you don't think we are closed to suggestions and certainly value your input on this issue.

    Take care...

    Avi

  • Another initiative takes the form of Discovery Days, where you can go along to a university for the day and be guided through various aspects. This is a widespread practice organised through schools, to encourage prospective students from all backgrounds, but there are some ventures directed at autistic spectrum.

    Cardiff University is offering both Discovery Days and a two day summer school, one overnight stay, www.cardiff.ac.uk/.../getting-more-young-people-with-autism-into-university-12450.html

    They are using current university students as mentors.

    There are some worrying claims though (I wouldn't have put this in a description of what a discovery day involved, but hey ho....maybe it works): "the opportunity to improve motor skills and social interaction will be delivered through specially tailored circus sessions, while yoga classes will attempt to reduce anxiousness in pupils" - that sounds like they think autism is curable......

    At least they are trying....

  • Some universities provide summer schools for various disadvantaged groups to have a taste of university. They make use of the student ambassador scheme and the widening participation team to organise several days accommodation and various university related activities for a group. You don't need to be planning to go to the university which hosts one of these to get a place.

    There are such opportunities for prospective autistic spectrum students, whatever subject they propose to study. Bath University does one which is over-subscribed www.bath.ac.uk/.../autism-summer-school.html 

    It was first run in 2013, and the website has an evaluation of how things went (based on before and after questionnaires about expectations of university). I don't know if it ran in 2014 (it was scheduled for 1st to 3rd September). The 2013 event was free, and attended by 30 young people having two nights accommodation and three days of events.

    There are other such events around, but they do need to be booked, and may have waiting lists. As an experience for young people on the spectrum contemplating university they are a good idea.

  • Open University can be tricky because individual modules can be quite taxing compared to attended university course modules, and you have to generate your own enthusiasm and commitment.

    OU disability support has improved a lot, but there is still the issue of whether local site resources are adequate.

    To Avi Moderator - the website is still posting the same ten year old stuff, so I guess there's going to be no change in the advice before the 2015-2016 intake?

    Going to university is a big decision. You don't want to waste the opportunity by getting the wrong advice and having to withdraw from the course. NAS ought to be offering up-to-date advice, not the stuff that was around before universities started trying to comply with the new legislation.

    Is NAS really just going to dig their heels in, and insist we're right and we don't take advice? What matters here? Helping people on the autistic spectrum? Or being institutional and resistant to progress?

  • It's maybe worth mentioning that the Open University have been really supportive with me and my ASD issues, saying they get a lot of people on the spectrum applying as distance learning appeals to them.  The exams can also be taken in your own home at no extra cost so it's probably worth a mention.

    In school I couldn't decide what I wanted to study, I wanted to learn everything!  But then I was told I wouldn't amount to anything and there was no point in me applying for university.  So I didn't.  Probably good because I dropped out of the Open Univeristy because for reasons mentioned, I've come across parts that don't interest me and I don't want to continue with it.

  • Hi Longman,
    Thanks for taking the trouble to take this issue on in such detail. Clearly we are keen to make the information we provide on the website as accurate, accessible and up to date as possible.
    I will be drawing the attention of our Autism Information Team and the specialist advisors to your comments. I am sure they will want evaluate your advice and take it on where they agree it is valuable. 
    If I have any feedback or further questions we will post it here or contract you by email.
    Thanks again…

     

    Avi
  • I also have in my possession "Supporting students with Asperger syndrome in higher education" by Rachel Pike NAS Regional Officer, published by NAS in 2005.

    It reads verbatim exactly like what is on the website, as a link from the first page of "University: choosing and applying" - if you are an educational professional - read our guide........

    It is 2014. A lot has changed since 2005!

    OK just as guidance on the website fair enough. But now NAS is advertising these resources on the home page (as one for four cycling topics) and in the newsletter.

    "Accessing Higher Education...what you need to know" .....yes it was valid ten years ago.

    What's the point of giving out old advice?  Why can't we have up to date advice on applying to go into higher education?

  • One of the first guides for higher education was Jamieson & Jamieson "Managing Asperger Syndrome at college and University" David Fulton Publishers 2004.

    I can see a lot of the NAS website follows very closely to their chapter 3 on transition, for example page 29 under Choice of college or university: "The geographical situation may also be important; most universities are in large towns and cities but some are in more rural settings which might be preferable for those who wish to pursue countryside interests".

    The trouble is things have changed a lot since 2004.

    2004 was just three years after SENDA and one year before the deadline for accessible university campuses. Universities were scared of prosecution for failing to provide, and going out of their way to be disability friendly.

    The trouble is there have been few prosecutions because the costs defeat most of those with a case. Universities have got rather too relaxed about it and pepared to take risks. A lot of universities hide behind the idea that minimal compensations based on the Social Model are sufficient.

    At the same time Universities had little experience of students on the spectrum in 2004. One of the guides in circulation was based on a university department's experience of just one student. Most universities now have a body of knowledge about the many manifestations of autistic spectrum, except that lately cut backs have seen experienced staff made redundant, and "cheaper" disability support staff recruited who are clearly more officious and less caring.

    UCAS has changed a bit. The advice given, seemingly based on Jamieson & Jamieson,is rather dated.

    Jamieson & Jamieson is still a first rate resource, but superceded largely, not because there are any newer resource texts, because most universities know more about autism issues than the few examples given.

    Surely somewhere there is up to date advice on applying to go into higher education in keeping with the needs of 2014 and forwards? 

    What's the point of offering out-of-date advice?

  • This is University of York: 

    "Asperger's syndrome, autism and related conditions

    Support needs vary enormously for students with autism or Asperger's syndrome so it is important to contact Disability Services (disabilityservices@york.ac.uk) as early as possible to discuss your requirements.

    Some of the types of help available are:

    Personal support

    Equipment

    Special exam arrangements

    Study skills support

    As with other forms of disability, you may be entitled to Disabled Students Allowance to pay for your support needs"

    - this typifies the way the Social Model of Disability has been interpreted to mean just providing some compensatory adjustments to supposedly equip students so they are on a level playing field with non-disabled students. It is becoming more common because there have been few prosecutions for failure, largely owing to the cost of legal actions for disabled students seeking to pursue complaints about being discriminated against or let down.

    - guidance on applying for higher education, needs to make potential students and their families aware of some of the limited and unimaginative approaches some universities are now adopting.

  • This is what University College London says it will provide for "students with Asperger syndrome or other autistic spectrum conditions"  (on their website under disability - services - autistic spectrum - what support is available):

    "Daily drop-in sessions to meet with a Disability Adviser - Monday - Thursday, 2pm-4pm (term time only)"

    "Access to the Student Enabling IT (SEnIT) suite which has assistive software such as mind mapping software"

    "Advice and guidance, both for you and your department, about the potential impact of your condition on your studies and how this can be accommodated".

    "To access a range of other services, you will need to apply for additional funding. Depending on your needs these services could include:"

    "A full assessment of your academic support needs carried out at an accredited assessment centre"

    "Regular mentoring support"

    "Computer equipment and regularised software for you to own"

    "The above lists are not exhaustive. Depending on your particular needs, we may be able to provide services not currently listed. Please contact us to discuss your individual needs."

    errrmmm.... how autism friendly does that sound?  

  • The UCAS website, which NAS refers people to do, to find out about courses when affected by autism, appears just to address disability in respect of how to apply for DSA.

    If you search deeper via "How it all works" then select "Explore your options" then select "Individual needs", then select "students with disabilities". There's a video guide, rather simplistic, that tells you to ask about it before you register, give details of your disability on your application form, and talk to social services.

    They suggest you talk to course providers, and says you may need proof of disability - a good suggestion they make is to ask how they support others with the same disability.

    They tell you to check the lecture facilities - good advice - but what about labs, seminar rooms, workshops - anything else specific to your course.

    But its a lot vaguer than the NAS site, so why does NAS recommend people to use it?

    They have a link to Disability Rights UK Factsheet 21 but all this has is a five line paragraph, if you can find it.

    NAS recomments Go2Uni.net, which has a littlemore information, but again you have to hunt for it. They have a "Top tips for transition" leaflet - again bland and misinformed. For example it says "when you fill in your UCAS application you must tick the appropriate box in the disability section as this enables the university to contact you as soon as possible to discuss your support"

    Great, but is this process working properly? I've mentioned above the vagueness of the categories, and the problems convderting the data, often only available several weeks into the course.

    Again it says you will need evidence. They say "it is really important to contact the disability services team", or whatever else it is called. Quite a few disabled students don't do this because they believe they should be contacted on the basis of the UCAS declarations, so often advised as all you need to do..... also they say "Arrange to meet the disability adviser as soon as you can"

    Why does NAS not give this advice?

  • Seems nothing I try to do will change NAS's resolution to carry on with its present advice. The evidence on this forum suggests that there are problems that need addressing, and it isn't as simple as NAS suggests.

    Some universities are not providing much support to people on the spectrum. People have recently referred to their autism status being dismissed lightly, and to not getting the right kind of support.

    Only a few universituies provide mentoring, and some have strange notions of what mentoring or buddying should involve - as someone reported recently the mentor could show someone the layout of the campus but leave them at the entrance to a building and not show them how to find the lecture room they needed to be at within it.

    A lot of universities interpret the social model of disability as meaning that if they provide a few services to "level the playing field" - extra time in exams, a note taker, different coloured paper for handouts, that's enough to give a disabled person an equal chance as someone able. This strategy doesn't work well for autistic spectrum students.

    Residential accommodatrion and social support - understanding of the needs of people with autism on these aspects rather than academic are very patchy. Some universities give no social help at all.

    I could go on, as in my previous posting. These few examples show that applying for Higher Education courses isn't as straight forward and simplistic as NAS seems to think.

    Can anyone with rercent university experience either add to the evidence that NAS advice isn't accurate enough, or if you feel to the contrary that the NAS advice is fine, please say.

    I'm just trying to avert problems I'm aware of going on year after year because available advice doesn't identify the problems.