Not sure if I am doing the right thing

Hi All,

My six year old daughter has no diagnosis but we are waiting for a paeds appt.

She has always had difficulty settling to sleep and still wakes in the night regularly after not going to sleep until 10-11pm, she does have a couple of days a week when she is asleep by 9 due to exhaustion.

She has complete meltdowns over things we would consider minor...ie: which side of the car to get in, whether we go through self service or a person at the checkout, which coloured card I use at the shops, which supermarket I go to, (she likes Tesco, I want to shop at Aldi), which pillow she has, how the seams on her clothes feel (clothes shopping is very difficult due to seams and appliques). Where she is dropped off or picked up at school.Who puts her to bed, she also lies a LOT and can keep the lie going on for days on end etc etc

We once had neighbours ask our landlord if she was ok and were we hurting her due to her screaming. She has become increasingly violent when having a meltdown and has started telling us she is a bad girl and I 'borned' her mean.

Her anxiety levels are quite high and it varies from day to day but tends to be about the same things (mentioned above). I had a spell of two weeks of not being able to get her to school; we had just moved house, the colour would drain from her face whenever we mentioned getting her there and she would then have an upset stomach. It was really awful seeing her so upset.

The school weren't much help at all so I took her to the Gp and contacted the school nurses. The Gp referred us to CYPS who have refused to see her until we have done the Webster Stratton parenting course and the school nurse has referred her to a paediatrican as she thinks it might be ASD.

She was early with all her milestones, we taught her baby sign, she was walking by ten months and has always been able to talk the back leg off a donkey. She can read but I can't read any of her writing and the school have started extra lessons for her literacy, but she can pinch my phone take photo's of things and then send them to my friends or famil or discuss the solar system with you. Smile

My new problem is that she is defacating in odd places,she has had her bowels open recently in the bath (not during a bath but has gone in the bath instead of the loo) and then today I have found she has gone in the drawer of a cabinet we have outside. It is covered in a million flies and she denies all knowledge, has explained in great detail how a dog must have climbed over our fence and detailed how it got out. (8ft fence mind you).

Also she seems obsessed with her own bottom and showing it to the world and my boobs and trying to touch them all the time. Telling her I don't like it and we all have parts of our bodies that we don't let people touch any time they want doesn't seem to be getting through.

Any tips on how to handle these two situations would be appreciated.

Thanks

A very tired Mrs J

Parents
  • Your daughter sounds as if she has some red flags for autism.  Is the paediatrician at your local child development centre?  If she is not too young for CAMHS you can usually self-refer to CAMHS, if she is too young, check that the paediatrician she is awaiting an appointment with is able to deal with setting up an ASC assessment.  Paediatricians are not usually expert in autism, even if they are involved in the process.

    I don't know what CYPS is but what a nerve suggesting you do a parenting course!  Unless they have actual evidence that you have parenting issues this is out of order. You could go back to your GP to insist you are referred for ASC assessment specifically (if this appointment with the paediatrician is not for this purpose), rather than expressing concerns asking for a general investigation.  Tell them they cannot fob you off as your child's wellbeing is at stake.

    Regarding your neighbour I totally sympathise.  A similar thing happened to us.  My younger daughter's screaming and meltdowns caused them to call SS.  They aren't nice people anyway and I did feel there was an element of maliciousness about them doing this.  The stupid thing is, a child that is being abused is no doubt terrified and subdued, cowering in fear and not making a sound and not screaming at the top of their lungs.  It's the ones that are being abused that SS miss because the abusers hide what's going on and all these cases come to light of where they failed to step in, so stupid neighbours thinking you are doing awful things to your child because they hear screaming is a bit dense as surely if you really were doing bad stuff you wouldn't be letting screaming alert everyone to it!  There is so much ignorance about autism.

    I found this, on this website:

    http://www.autism.org.uk/living-with-autism/understanding-behaviour/toilet-training.aspx

    Some children smear their poo. This is a very challenging behaviour to come to terms with. There are a number of reasons your child may do this. Firstly, take them to your GP to make sure there are no physical factors as to why this is happening (being in pain). They may not have understood the process of wiping and you may need to teach them 'hand over hand'. The toilet paper could be too harsh for their sensitive skin therefore using wet wipes may be easier for them. Some children enjoy the feel of smearing, provide other acceptable activities which give the same feeling such as finger painting, gloop (cornflour and water) or playdough. Some children may see clearing up after they have smeared as a reward particularly if they like water or receive lots of attention form their carer. Even if they are reprimanding them it can still be seen a reinforcement. Use minimal interaction and alternative clean up methods such as baby wipes or a tepid shower.

    Further resources

    ERIC (Education and Resources for Improving Childhood Continence) sells a range of bedding protection, swimwear, absorbent pants and vibrating watches.
    Web shop telephone number: 01173 012 101
    Email: sales@webshop.org.uk
    Website: www.ericshop.org.uk
    ERIC has a helpline providing advice and information to children, parents and health professionals on all aspects of toileting. Call 0845 370 8008 (Monday-Friday, 10am-4pm) or visit:www.enuresis.org.uk

    Fledglings is a charity which helps parents and carers of a child with special needs of any kind to find simple, affordable solutions to practical problems. 
    Tel: 0845 458 1124
    Email: enquiries@fledglings.org.uk
    Website: www.fledglings.org.uk

    PROMOCON (Promoting Continence and Product Awareness) has links to various organisations who sell toilet-related products including swimwear, absorbent pants and toilet seats for older children.
    Website: www.promocon.co.uk/products.shtml

    Tinkle Toonz has musical sensors in potties and ones which can be used in underwear, nappies and pull-ups, designed to alert the child or the parent that the child has 'gone' in his potty or pants. 
    Website: www.tinkletoonz.com/special_needs.html

    http://www.autism.org.uk/living-with-autism/understanding-behaviour/challenging-behaviour/challenging-behaviour-in-children-with-an-asd.aspx

    Smearing

    Possible reasons:

    • feeling unwell or in pain
    • reluctant to wipe because toilet paper may be too harsh
    • seeking out sensation from texture, smell or movement of arms during smearing action
    • attention seeking/wanting a reaction
    • not knowing where faeces needs to go
    • fear of toilets.

    Suggested strategies:

    • provide an alternative with the same texture, eg papier-mâché, gelibaf, gloop (cornflour and water), finger painting, play-dough, etc
    • make a structured timetable of the day, showing times when your child can do appropriate smearing activities
    • take your child to the GP to make sure that there are no physical reasons involved, like being in pain
    • if your child does not understand the wiping process, teach them ‘hand over hand’
    • if the toilet paper is too harsh for your child’s sensitive skin, wet wipes could be a gentler alternative
    • avoid asking your child to clear up after themselves, as they may interpret this as being a reward
    • avoid paying too much attention or showing too much reaction
    • do not tell them off, as this can be seen as reinforcement of the behaviour
    • use minimal interaction and alternative cleaning-up methods, like baby wipes or a tepid shower
    • set up a toileting routine (see our ‘Toilet training’ information sheet)
    • use ‘all-in-one’ suits (available from the Abena website:www.abena.co.uk).

    I totally understand your upset at your daughter's state of mind.  My younger child is 8 and when she was 7 she became very self-aware and started blaming herself for her behaviour and she also has bad anxiety.  Only today she was saying she wanted to die.

    Unfortunately you have to fight hard for everything for your child, even once you get the diagnosis.

    This may be of help about the touching:

    http://www.autism.org.uk/living-with-autism/understanding-behaviour/behaviour-common-questions-answered/my-son-will-hug-strangers-in-the-street.aspx

    And you can get cheap social stories books on eBay about autism and boundaries too. 

Reply
  • Your daughter sounds as if she has some red flags for autism.  Is the paediatrician at your local child development centre?  If she is not too young for CAMHS you can usually self-refer to CAMHS, if she is too young, check that the paediatrician she is awaiting an appointment with is able to deal with setting up an ASC assessment.  Paediatricians are not usually expert in autism, even if they are involved in the process.

    I don't know what CYPS is but what a nerve suggesting you do a parenting course!  Unless they have actual evidence that you have parenting issues this is out of order. You could go back to your GP to insist you are referred for ASC assessment specifically (if this appointment with the paediatrician is not for this purpose), rather than expressing concerns asking for a general investigation.  Tell them they cannot fob you off as your child's wellbeing is at stake.

    Regarding your neighbour I totally sympathise.  A similar thing happened to us.  My younger daughter's screaming and meltdowns caused them to call SS.  They aren't nice people anyway and I did feel there was an element of maliciousness about them doing this.  The stupid thing is, a child that is being abused is no doubt terrified and subdued, cowering in fear and not making a sound and not screaming at the top of their lungs.  It's the ones that are being abused that SS miss because the abusers hide what's going on and all these cases come to light of where they failed to step in, so stupid neighbours thinking you are doing awful things to your child because they hear screaming is a bit dense as surely if you really were doing bad stuff you wouldn't be letting screaming alert everyone to it!  There is so much ignorance about autism.

    I found this, on this website:

    http://www.autism.org.uk/living-with-autism/understanding-behaviour/toilet-training.aspx

    Some children smear their poo. This is a very challenging behaviour to come to terms with. There are a number of reasons your child may do this. Firstly, take them to your GP to make sure there are no physical factors as to why this is happening (being in pain). They may not have understood the process of wiping and you may need to teach them 'hand over hand'. The toilet paper could be too harsh for their sensitive skin therefore using wet wipes may be easier for them. Some children enjoy the feel of smearing, provide other acceptable activities which give the same feeling such as finger painting, gloop (cornflour and water) or playdough. Some children may see clearing up after they have smeared as a reward particularly if they like water or receive lots of attention form their carer. Even if they are reprimanding them it can still be seen a reinforcement. Use minimal interaction and alternative clean up methods such as baby wipes or a tepid shower.

    Further resources

    ERIC (Education and Resources for Improving Childhood Continence) sells a range of bedding protection, swimwear, absorbent pants and vibrating watches.
    Web shop telephone number: 01173 012 101
    Email: sales@webshop.org.uk
    Website: www.ericshop.org.uk
    ERIC has a helpline providing advice and information to children, parents and health professionals on all aspects of toileting. Call 0845 370 8008 (Monday-Friday, 10am-4pm) or visit:www.enuresis.org.uk

    Fledglings is a charity which helps parents and carers of a child with special needs of any kind to find simple, affordable solutions to practical problems. 
    Tel: 0845 458 1124
    Email: enquiries@fledglings.org.uk
    Website: www.fledglings.org.uk

    PROMOCON (Promoting Continence and Product Awareness) has links to various organisations who sell toilet-related products including swimwear, absorbent pants and toilet seats for older children.
    Website: www.promocon.co.uk/products.shtml

    Tinkle Toonz has musical sensors in potties and ones which can be used in underwear, nappies and pull-ups, designed to alert the child or the parent that the child has 'gone' in his potty or pants. 
    Website: www.tinkletoonz.com/special_needs.html

    http://www.autism.org.uk/living-with-autism/understanding-behaviour/challenging-behaviour/challenging-behaviour-in-children-with-an-asd.aspx

    Smearing

    Possible reasons:

    • feeling unwell or in pain
    • reluctant to wipe because toilet paper may be too harsh
    • seeking out sensation from texture, smell or movement of arms during smearing action
    • attention seeking/wanting a reaction
    • not knowing where faeces needs to go
    • fear of toilets.

    Suggested strategies:

    • provide an alternative with the same texture, eg papier-mâché, gelibaf, gloop (cornflour and water), finger painting, play-dough, etc
    • make a structured timetable of the day, showing times when your child can do appropriate smearing activities
    • take your child to the GP to make sure that there are no physical reasons involved, like being in pain
    • if your child does not understand the wiping process, teach them ‘hand over hand’
    • if the toilet paper is too harsh for your child’s sensitive skin, wet wipes could be a gentler alternative
    • avoid asking your child to clear up after themselves, as they may interpret this as being a reward
    • avoid paying too much attention or showing too much reaction
    • do not tell them off, as this can be seen as reinforcement of the behaviour
    • use minimal interaction and alternative cleaning-up methods, like baby wipes or a tepid shower
    • set up a toileting routine (see our ‘Toilet training’ information sheet)
    • use ‘all-in-one’ suits (available from the Abena website:www.abena.co.uk).

    I totally understand your upset at your daughter's state of mind.  My younger child is 8 and when she was 7 she became very self-aware and started blaming herself for her behaviour and she also has bad anxiety.  Only today she was saying she wanted to die.

    Unfortunately you have to fight hard for everything for your child, even once you get the diagnosis.

    This may be of help about the touching:

    http://www.autism.org.uk/living-with-autism/understanding-behaviour/behaviour-common-questions-answered/my-son-will-hug-strangers-in-the-street.aspx

    And you can get cheap social stories books on eBay about autism and boundaries too. 

Children
No Data