Brilliant John Gray interview in the New Statesman.

This is a brilliant interview and discussion with John Gray making many excellent points. Which I would like to discuss with people. If anyone can make it through the whole 80 minute interview. 

I am a High Tory, supporter of the Aristocratic High state being restored. So I support the overthrow of the Liberal managerial state and restoring Parliament, the common law, the Royal Navy so on. 

What I find really interesting is that Mr Gray makes all the right points I would make as a High Tory about the current Liberal consensus with live under and the need for Parliamentary accountability to be restored. I also agree with him the Thomas Hobbs was a form of Liberal. 

Its also because I want more Liberal minded members on here to question there Liberalism from a left-wing perspective. I can question it from a right-wing perspective, but I don't know how to do that from the left-wing side. Any discussion on these important topics within society and the depth of learning, knowledge, experience of Mr Gray is a good starting point for this. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IvDXwjeMB_k  

Thanks. 

Parents
  • I imagine the vision is a return to Britain c.1900, i.e before WW1. A pre-industrial revolution scenario would be hard to envisage.

    The problem is always to balance competing requirements:

    1. How to reward work and effort, so that things get done
    2. How to avoid excessive self interest, corruption and fraud
    3. How to ensure owners and workers are fairly rewarded to prevent exploitation 
    4. How to pay for the necessary functions of the state (law and order, defence, etc.)
    5. What functions the state should have control over
    6. How to help the unfortunate and needy without undermining 1 and 3
    7. How much freedom the individual should have and what obligations they have
    8. How to ensure a cohesive stable system exists, that is self-correcting

    It is not obvious what the correct answer is.

    Most argue for a system that benefits them, rather than that benefits the majority. There is no system that benefits everyone, unless everyone is equally poor.

    A system that does not benefit the majority is unstable.

    The current system is sub-optimal, but what to do is a problem. There are no easy fixes.

  • What you do is your build the corruption into the system, so everybody knows it and can adjust for it. Like the Aristocracy was wholly corrupt, but it was the system so it was accounted for. Amazingly the system we have now is meant to be anti-corruption, but it is way more corrupt than the Aristocratic High state was, which is actually lauded for its lack of corruption in the early 1900's.  

    I argue for a system which means I can't vote, which means I have no power. I argue for the restoration of the Aristocracy, there rights, power and wealth which was stolen from them by the Liberal state. I also believe in the ruling class theory of history which states that whatever the ruling class wants it gets. I don't think building a system for the majority functions at all. But I agree there is no correct answer, just trade off's between different systems. 

  • I'm not sure going back to no NHS, no social services, no disability support (apart from charity=work house), women as property, child labour, no school unless you can afford it and the era of the work house or starving if you can't work would be a good idea.

    I think the quote that "Democracy is the worst form of government except for all others which have been tried" applies.

  • The issues and problem with the NHS is that it was founded to enforce socialism, DEI. It was never about improving healthcare for the bottom third of society economically. I would abolish the NHS and totally rebuild a new state based form of healthcare. Based on Hierarchy, Patriarchy, discrimination. Its the same with state pensions, welfare, education. The poor laws and work houses actually functioned, the current system doesn't at all. State pension is a ponzy scheme which is going to bankrupt the state. It needs to be abolished too. Women we never views as property, they was sex based segregation. Like male university programs and female ones. I believe women had to get there husbands or fathers to sign for bank account and stuff, like parents? Child labor was a good thing generally, but needed to be regulated by the state and it was from the 1850's onwards by the High Tories within Parliament constraining the power of the Liberal industrialists. Like my brother wanted to leave school at 13 to work for my dad, the state actively prevented my brother from doing this. 

    If you want local community formed classical education from children, partially funded by the state, I am all for that. Modern state education is rubbish and integration of the sexes has been a disaster for men in society. Then you have the collapse of birthrates because of extended education for women. There is a directly correlation between women getting 10 years of more of education and the collapse of birthrates, which then means we can't maintain any sort of welfare state or patriarchal structure for society. We have millions of working poor now in the UK reliant on food banks because of inflation. 

    The best form of government is clearly one which functions, representative democracy as it is current operating doesn't function and should be replaced by something which does function. I support the old system which existed before because it function then and I think it could function now.  

    I am not totally rejecting any great positives about Liberalism/Liberal society. For example I benefit massively from state support, cognitive talk therapy, I have a neuro-divergent therapist too, which wasn't accepted before in the Aristocratic High state. I was harassed because I have cerebral palsy year this year and I had a lot of support from the police for that. Which I am grateful for. 

Reply
  • The issues and problem with the NHS is that it was founded to enforce socialism, DEI. It was never about improving healthcare for the bottom third of society economically. I would abolish the NHS and totally rebuild a new state based form of healthcare. Based on Hierarchy, Patriarchy, discrimination. Its the same with state pensions, welfare, education. The poor laws and work houses actually functioned, the current system doesn't at all. State pension is a ponzy scheme which is going to bankrupt the state. It needs to be abolished too. Women we never views as property, they was sex based segregation. Like male university programs and female ones. I believe women had to get there husbands or fathers to sign for bank account and stuff, like parents? Child labor was a good thing generally, but needed to be regulated by the state and it was from the 1850's onwards by the High Tories within Parliament constraining the power of the Liberal industrialists. Like my brother wanted to leave school at 13 to work for my dad, the state actively prevented my brother from doing this. 

    If you want local community formed classical education from children, partially funded by the state, I am all for that. Modern state education is rubbish and integration of the sexes has been a disaster for men in society. Then you have the collapse of birthrates because of extended education for women. There is a directly correlation between women getting 10 years of more of education and the collapse of birthrates, which then means we can't maintain any sort of welfare state or patriarchal structure for society. We have millions of working poor now in the UK reliant on food banks because of inflation. 

    The best form of government is clearly one which functions, representative democracy as it is current operating doesn't function and should be replaced by something which does function. I support the old system which existed before because it function then and I think it could function now.  

    I am not totally rejecting any great positives about Liberalism/Liberal society. For example I benefit massively from state support, cognitive talk therapy, I have a neuro-divergent therapist too, which wasn't accepted before in the Aristocratic High state. I was harassed because I have cerebral palsy year this year and I had a lot of support from the police for that. Which I am grateful for. 

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