"Disk horse" (Discourse)

I'm not the wisest owl, but I have a lot of experience being on the internet since the dawn of social media and apparently I'm part of the "woke" (that isn't a slur it's a badge on honour) crowd so I want to share what little wisdom I have as an older millenia. Because I'm an old young person AND a young old person at this point in my life and I think I can share something that can help bridge the generational divide. I'm witnessing threads of people getting caught up in emotions right now and some have left the site (maybe unrelated events) but as people do leave through upset please let me say this, and it is meant generally so no need to take it personally unless you feel the shoe fits: You cannot make everyone happy, you cannot make everyone agree with you, and you cannot agree with everyone. People will misunderstand you, and if you want to tell someone something you have to meet people on their level of understanding first and build upwards, if you think someone is uneducated you cannot just throw big words at them and make them feel small and expect them to listen. You have to be prepared to give people the benefit of the doubt, and to at least listen even if you don't agree, so you can at least understand, and you don't always have to agree either. An opinion is an opinion. And somones current opinion may not be representative of their true ethical stance on things. You are your own person, you have your own experiences that can and will be different to someone else's. It is a delicate balancing act to be able to shield ourselves whilst remaining open, to change and to other people, and new ideas.
I'm not saying allow people to walk all over you if that's what they are doing, but it is the default reaction of already traumatised people to go into defence mode at even the slightest provocation and it isn't always necessary or productive. Your feelings will always be valid. But your reactions, may require some consideration and further investigation. If someone continues to engage in problematic behaviour you can always report it later on. (I get it, I side eye people who say they are "ex alt right" as sus too.) I'm kinda sticking my neckout here, so I want to clarify, I'm also not saying stick around and be the punch bag, if you don't want to engage with certain people  and their behaviour then don't, that is your perogative, but I am saying do try not to ostracise them in the processs of calling that behaviour out because that is how already vulnerable, people fall down extremist rabbit holes, they don't feel a sense of community anymore and then get picked up by having their loneliness predated on by by far more insideous agents.
I know I am nobody really, but if I can make one plea can we all try to be kind to ourselves and eachother. We austists are an already vulnerable group of people and eachothers natural allys in this harsh world.

(Too late at night to fix all the typos.)

  • I think my autism affects my gender identity. I am so detached from the concept of gender that it doesn't really matter to me at all, I am somewhat baffled why so many people feel so strongly about it. My body is female so I am OK to go along with that, but I am not particularly feminine. I would not be OK to go along with it if I lived in a society which restricted me to child care and housework since I have zero interest or enjoyment in those things. I listened to a really interesting audio book about about someone who was born female but lived as a man in Afghanistan https://smile.amazon.co.uk/dp/B00N41PAAW?plink=OsZae9n6M0PoFZHi&ref_=adblp13nvvxx_0_0_ti

    I relate to women in that I have a shared experience of female puberty, periods, the possibility/threat of pregnancy and perimenopause (but not pregnancy, childbirth or lactation and not yet actual menopause). Maybe due to my autism though I experience those things perhaps differently to the norm, whatever that may be. I have never had any desire to reproduce, so did not welcome the changes to my body (change is always difficult for us, even change for the better, which this never seemed to me) none of which seem to be an improvement over that of a child. Is sex/attraction relevant to gender identity or is that a separate issue? I'm not asexual.

    As to Glitter's question of what body I would choose - a healthy one! (Mine is not.) One with strength and flexibility ideally, I would not mind a male one, a neutral one or a female one as long as the latter was lithe without the annoyance of overly large boobs, but preferably no periods. I deal with the nuisance of periods the same way I deal with that of arthritis. Well, I used to run the contraceptive pill together so I only had 4 a year, but they wouldn't let me have it any more when my blood pressure got high.

    If it had been possible when I was a child to have meds which stopped the onset of puberty I would have seriously considered that option, although I would have been concerned if there were unknown health risks to that.

    What does that make me? Am I autigender? I googled it and the definitions seemed to assume an identity other than cis? Could I be auticis, can that be a thing? I'm not sure if cis means you feel that way naturally or just if you accept it. I think of myself as a person more than as a woman, but I really don't mind.

    Identity is a funny thing. I am British, but I don't like tea, I prefer coffee. I could imagine changing nationality, but there are nationalities I am more to drawn to and ones which i would not prefer. I kind of think even the fact that I draw that analogy might be due to autism. I don't know how it is for others, ND or NT, though I do find it interesting.

    Jesus said we won't have marriage in the next life, we will be like the angels, so gender is not a permanent part of being human anyway. I think that's interesting even for people who don't like religion.

  • I find autigender fits me very well.  Part of it, as Sam said, is the rejection of social constructs.  Part of it is linked to alexithymia and interception and not being able to recognise a feeling of my own gender inside myself.  I enjoy both typically male and female activities and presentations.  Sparkly dresses and three piece suits both fill me with joy!

    One of the questions that sparked insight was when I was asked, if I could choose any kind of body, what would that look like?  And the answer was I don't know.  I don't feel a link to any particular bits.  

    I also don't feel a particular connection with other people based on the gender I was assigned at birth.  I don't see characters on TV or film and think "Oh that person is like me because we're the same gender!" (Unless I'm watching the new Quantum leap and swooning over Mason Alexander Park.)  I did feel a strong connection with the autistic character on Holby City though, because that is a much strong influence on my identity than my gender. 

    Sometimes I feel all the genders and sometimes i feel none.  Sometimes I let the colour of my coffee mug help me decide the gender of the day.  Mostly I'm just me and I get bristley over the assumptions people make about me based on what goes on body parts.

  • Is there no specialised forum here for LGBTQ++ folks then? I assumed that there *must* be one already in place...

    Having such a forum established might, I think, be the 'best of both worlds': a home of their own for those folks, while they could still continue to play a massive and valued part on the other boards. Slight smile

  • Hey I hope this isn't too presumptuous but as you signed off as "E" I'm now somewhat fascinated by how you would change you name here since the "NAS xxxxx" are a default setting on the username, if you feel comfortable expressing yourself that way I'd love to see the update.


    I won’t take over your thread but am glad to have found other non binary and queer and trans folk on here.

    Aw that's sweet but honestly feel free, I'm happy to host platform to my community within a community. :)

  • Thanks Sam. I won’t take over your thread but am glad to have found other non binary and queer and trans folk on here. It’s been a long journey for me as I’m sure you’ll appreciate, there’s been huge emotional and relationship costs in being true to myself but it’s been absolutely worth it. We go to The Village most weeks, Via, ON, Molly, Bar Pop, Goose being our faves. I rediscovered not so long ago that I’m a really good dancer, house is my fave music but I get all music at a very deep level and move intuitively to almost anything. This is an amazingly affirming thing as I attract all sorts of positive comments and contact and attention but crucially I’m 100% loyal to my gf and our interaction in clubs and bars shows this. E (she/her) xxx

  • Yes by all means pls share your experience. :) Also that's fascinating knowing you are so close, statistical likilihood decrees I must have driven past you within a few feet already by now as I have lived in the 3 county area for nigh on 10+ years now.

  • Of course. I think the careful and considered approach to these questions are sadly too underappreciated these days. Take all the time you need, I will be very interested in hearing your opinions after they are formed if you wish to share them. Slight smile

  • Hi there, really appreciate your thoughtful post, may I join this discussion? I was only recently dx as autistic aged 64. I am fully immersed in the LGBTQ++ world being a trans woman in a lesbian relationship, love clubbing in Manchester’s Gay Village, I had surgery way back in 1994 in Hove (near to Brighton) and it was a superbly successful affirmation of my true identity. I’m happy to share more if you are interested and to support others in the LGBTQ++ community on here

    E (she/her). 

  • I'm curious have you heard of the term autigender? There seems to be a strong link between autism and gender variance simply because we (generally) do not subscribe to neurotypical norms and thus binary strict gender norms in general also hold less sway over us.

  • With years, adding my 'unusual' mental exercises, and lack of connection with either of original genders, I'm slowly getting there too.

  • Funny you should say that as it would make a great metaphor for me. I find myself neither existing in this world as male or female therefore I conclude I am nonbinary.

    Choosing between going left and going right, if neither is appealing stops me confused
  • Yes, official definitions of many things mind realated are just ignoramt, discriminatory, offensive, demeaning and so on. Rarely making any sense, to be useful

    Choosing between going left and going right, if neither is appealing stops me confused often, until I find what I call '3rd invisible choice'.

  • Hi Mariusz, honestly I'm someone who having arrived at the required lexicon "late in the game" realised I was trans (nonbinary) on a technicallity (which actually makes me laugh, good to have a sense of humour) because if you look into the definition of somone who is cisgender it is someone who identifies with the gender they were assigned at birth (typically based on their sex organs, meaning genitalia) but since gender itself is a social construct which depending on geographical location and time in history has an ever changing "rule"(expected behaviour/appearance) set, then no I just simply don't identify with my assigned gender at birth. I preffer to embrace the personal, and the unique aspects of myself including as they pertain to gender and that has excluded me from being cisgender, so I embraced being transgender as the logical albeit less socially accepted alternative. But thankfully I'm autistic and don't give too many hoots about what falls under aribritarily socially acceptable norms anyway.

  • I would only add that extremists, bullies and others looking for victims online conceal their actions less, because their identity is hidden, and in the effect cause a lot more damage then they would in real life.

    I'm glad you joined Sam, I was looking for someone identifying as non-binary, to ask them to explain about their experiences in that area, what made you self-identify as non-bibnary, many of old generations rised as ableists like me, struggle to grasp the concept, so if you could find time and enlighten us, I would be in your debt.

  • Thanks for putting such thought and time into that very sensitively put take on how we can navigate this space and sense of belonging. Appreciate it.