Are we really a Christian country?

I actually think the idea of Christianity is abused. There are so many bad people who go to church to be seen at church. It’s purely social and bulilt around guilt. 

We are a Christian country in the sense that our civilisation, its' laws, its' justice system and its' culture are based on the basic tenets of Christianity. However, as a society we have drifted so far from those that I don't believe Britain as it is now is a Christian country. Instead we have the sanctity of the self, where we are encouraged to put ourselves above others instead of doing unto others as we would do unto ourselves and we have cancel culture instead of Christian unconditional forgiveness and salvation. 

Wordsmith said:

It's the identification of Christianity with any particular ethnicity or culture that is regarded as heretical

I’m no longer a Christian but I know many Protestant and Catholic Christians too who would find the identification of Christianity with a particular ethnicity or culture problematic because it goes against a key tenet that ‘salvation is available for all’. 

It's the identification of Christianity with any particular ethnicity or culture that is regarded as heretical. This has been the case since the mid-nineteenth century when Bulgaria attempted to set up a Bulgarian Orthodox Church exclusively for Bulgarians. Linguistic and cultural traditions within Orthodoxy are regarded as fine (hence, distinctive Greek, Russian, Romanian, and Georgian traditions, for example), but those traditions are all part of the one Church. So, I became Orthodox through an English-speaking Russian Orthodox Church and currently worship in a Greek Orthodox Church whose congregation includes significant numbers of Romanians, Ukrainians, and Georgians (also a few Bulgarians, Syrians, Russians, and Palestinians).

The Western Church didn't pass on that much about the intellectual traditions of Western Europe, most of them were lost only to be rediscovered after the crusades. Islamic scholars kept the traditions of Greece and Rome alive, translating and expanding upon them.

Thats fascinating that Orthodox Christian regard national culture or ethncity as heretical, can you explain a little more please, I know little about the Orthodox Church, only really Byzantuim in late antiquity.

Islam may not have contributed to the events that shaped the UK, but it certainly made a major contribution to the intellectual traditions that shaped Western Europe. Specifically, it preserved and passed on to medieval Europe a good deal of the classical intellectual tradition.

I suppose Wicca is native to Britain, but only because it was created in the 1940s by Alexander Gardner. Other traditions that might make similar claims would include the Order of Bards, Ovates and Druids (a 19th century romantic reconstruction of druidism) and the Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn (Aleister Crowley et al -- though he quite happily stole from Greco-Roman religion and the mystery traditions).

As an Orthodox Christian, I feel quite uncomfortable with the idea of identifying Christianity with any particular culture or ethnic group. In fact, any such identification would strictly be regarded as heretical within Orthodoxy (hence the difficulty most Orthodox have with Putin's notion of Russkii Mir).

In my view a country cannot be a religion - it can be rocky, prosperous, it can have a particular climate, it can be rich with valuable minerals or arid desert and so on. To be religious requires sentience, to be able to choose one idea over another. So being non sentient a country, which is a geographical area, cannot be religious. Obviously its people usually are religious, but this  heterogeneous population of humans will have multiple and diverse beliefs, from extremist fundamentals to athiest, so such heterogeneity by its definition means a country cannot be a religion 

It wasn't a '..so called Iftar..', it was a real Iftar.

I think you'll find that Islamic countries were busy doing their own things during the events you mention, invading each other and murdering thier own leaders. As many countries were Islam is practiced were part of the British Empire during the two world wars I think you'll find that there were many troops from different countries and religions fighting alongside "us".

Chrisitianity came here through migration and immigration and it's far from a native religion to Britain or Europe, I think the only religion or spiritual path to be native to Britian is Wicca.

I think you'll find poverty, misogyny and homophobia are endemic in Europe too.

I'm white British with a lineage in Britain that stretches back at least 1500 hundred years, I do not practice Christianity, I do not feel Christian and I don't see Islam or any other relgion that has come to this country as particularly foreign, provocative or rejecting of a culture that is supposedly a majority British thing that I don't feel part of and never really have. I have however felt welcomed by immigrant communities.

In relation to the MP pointing out that so called iftar is objectionable, bear in mind  that islam has made no contribution to any if the pi pivotal historic events in our history. like the Norman invasion, Spanish  Amada, Schism with Rome, beheading the king, the  catholic restoration, the Protestant invasion, Napoleonic wars, American war of independence, WW1,WW2. It  has come into this country as a result of mass immigration. from third world countries where poverty, misogyny, homophobia is endemic. To many people celebrating a religious event from a foreign religion is  an act of religious provocation saying we reject the culture of the country we have chosen to move to. 

DormouseAtRest_25 said:

As a Country, I believe there remain some such good lessons we might rediscover and re-apply - for the greater benefit of all community.

I would like to see Quaker values being rediscovered in our communities too.

Many of those values are already in our communities but they don’t make headlines. 

I read today about the below 18th century asylum (with the emphasis upon: retreat, shelter, protection, sanctuary, benevolence, plus, supporting a person's ability to recover their self-esteem and self-control), called "The Retreat", which was set up by a Yorkshire Quaker for aiding people with mental health issues.

"The Retreat [York, England] was founded in 1792 by William Tuke, a Yorkshire Quaker, and opened in 1796.

It has the distinction of having been the first establishment in England where mental illness was regarded as something from which a person could recover, and patients were treated with sympathy, respect and dignity.

The Retreat had a profound influence on public opinion, resulting ultimately in fundamental reform of the laws relating to mental illness and its treatment.

It occupies a central place in the history of psychiatry. Every textbook on the subject mentions the unique part played by it in the reshaping of attitudes to people who are mentally ill.

The Retreat opened in 1796 in the countryside outside York. Unlike mental institutions of the time, there were no chains or manacles, and physical punishment was banned.

Treatment was based on personalised attention and benevolence, restoring the self-esteem and self-control of residents.

An early example of occupational therapy was introduced, including walks and farm labouring in pleasant and quiet surroundings.

There was a social environment where residents were seen as part of a large family-like unit, built on kindness, moderation, order and trust.

There was a religious dimension, including prayer. Inmates were accepted as potentially rational beings, who could recover proper social conduct through self-restraint and moral strength.

They were permitted to wear their own clothing, and encouraged to engage in handicrafts, to write, and to read books.

They were allowed to wander freely around The Retreat’s courtyards and gardens, which were stocked with various small domestic animals."

It struck me that, somehow, although the lessons were learned well in the 18th century; since then - "the wheel fell off our wagon" ...more is the shame in recent times.

As a Country, I believe there remain some such good lessons we might rediscover and re-apply - for the greater benefit of all community.

Although these events are historical, when I hear people say things like 'we should be Christian' there's an unspoken "or else" there. Or else what exactly, would they like us converted by sword or gun point? Have wardens to ensure we go to church and if we don't go for a couple of weeks without "good reason" have us fined as has previously happened? Or at worst will we return to the burning times, when disenters will face a horrible and painful death for the good of thier souls?

Ferrosol said:

Making us one of only two countries where religious leaders have a formal say in government, the other being Iran.) Our

Saudi Arabia 

Afghanistan

Vatican City

The king as head of the church and Anglican bishops in the house of lords looks like an architectural hangover from earlier days rather than being reflective of current beliefs - I think the bishops should be removed from the HOL as a matter of urgency, there's no justification for it. It's up to the Anglican church who they have as their head.

That 46% figure for Christianity includes people who automatically tick the box 'Christian' in a cultural sense - that figure  falls every ten years when the census is taken, reflecting a habit common among older people. I remember people saying they were 'CofE' if asked, then quickly moving on. They didn't go to church or even pray, it was just the default response. It seems to be a practice that's the preserve of the elderly these days. 

There's actually been a few non-Christian PMs - our current one is an atheist:

Non-religious Prime Ministers: a history – Humanists UK

We are a Christian country, The King is literally the head of the Anglican Church, Anglican Bishops sit in the house of lords. (Making us one of only two countries where religious leaders have a formal say in government, the other being Iran.) Our public holidays are based around Christianity, until only a few years ago members of the royal family were forbidden to convert to catholicism, we have only had a single non-christian prime minister. (Sunak) 

According to the 2021 census christianity is still the largest religion in the UK at around 46% with people declaring no religion second at 36% 

All the rest is just racist resentment with religion used as an excuse by bigots. 

Unknown said:

“Silence is a source of Great Strength.”

True.

As someone who is sometimes situationally mute and struggles for words at the best of times, I've always particularly liked this Lao Tzu quote:

“Silence is a source of Great Strength.”

I think we're post-Christian. I also think we're an inheritor of the philosophy of the classical world (along with the rest of Europe), much of which came to us from the Christian tradition, which was in itself changed by it. I don't think you can deny that we have a Christian heritage, but I think that's fading to a large degree, and I think its historical ubiquity is probably over stated. A lot of Medieval religious practice looks like a tolerated or 'baptised' form of folk belief. In the 19th century, around 50% of the population attended neither church nor chapel.

I'm personally a humanist, but there are certainly aspects of the Christian tradition which inform my humanism. If I were an Indian humanist, it might be aspects of the Hindu tradition. But living in the 21st century and having easy access to a wide range of cultures and philosophies, I can find things from outside the Western religious and philosophical traditions that I find helpful and inspiring, such as the philosophy of Lao Tzu.

I read this today

"British socialist values have deep roots in Christian, particularly nonconformist and Anglican, traditions, which emphasized social justice, the brotherhood of man, and the "common good" long before the rise of secular marxist socialism

. Many early British socialists and Labour Party leaders, including Keir Hardie, cited the New Testament as their primary inspiration, discovering socialist principles within the teachings of Jesus"

www.co-operativeheritage.coop/.../christian-socialism-and-e-v-neale

Free at the point of use systems which the UK has are rare. The norm in most of Europe is for an insurance based system which is heavily subsidised and cost effective, with those on the lowest incomes receiving the highest levels of subsidy or not paying at all.

I would love one with a big log fireplace and pipe organ, just me.