PIP rejection.

Have you tried claiming for LCWRA? Sorry if you have but I got awarded the payment and I know a lot of others who didn't get PIP , but got LCWRA. 

Shardovan said:

1. ‘you work full time

I had a similar reason given for rejecting my PIP application.  In my case they explicitly stated that having a university degree ment I had no problems.  Although level of education was never asked for on the PIP application form. It came up in the informal discussion at the assessment.

I'm sorry to hear that happened to you, especially at this time of year. I don't think you can ever truly prepare yourself for a letter like that.

Shardovan said:

And yet… basically their response amounts to a great big ‘LIAR!

That is the hardest thing to accept because autists are so intrinsically honest.

Shardovan said:

A question though if anyone can please help: is it advisable to point out the contradiction addressed in point one above? That is point out that they have cited as a reason for withholding points a fact (that I work) that all the PIP literature said would be neither here nor there in tens of a decision? It feels like a blatantly illegal move flaunted at me in black and white. Appalling really. 

I think it is probably good to point that out. If nothing else it will demonstrate how you interpreted the PIP literature in an autistic literal way and how the process is not autistic friendly.

They appear to be implying that you seldom taking any sick days mean you can 'cope' with working. Your appeal needs to demonstrate the personal cost to you and how much it takes out of you, how you are unable to do other things in life due to the demands of working.

Good luck and kudos to you for putting yourself through the process in the first place. I considered it a few years ago but ultimately decided against, as too gruelling and detrimental to my mental health.

These are a couple of articles I'd bookmarked at the time that you may find useful.

https://www.pinpoint-cambs.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/Asperger_Service_PIP_Guide_Sept_2016.pdf

https://www.communitycare.co.uk/2018/03/29/pip-payments-autism-overcoming-challenges-application-process/

I’m sorry to hear that, they are bastards. I received the same treatment in the past.

Unfortunately it’s down to you to do the hard work.

If you haven’t appealed, then appeal and if that fails take it to the tribunal. In my experience when I’ve done that, they’ve always backed down and awarded me what I truly deserve.

They make it as difficult as possible for claimants knowing full well that their decision will be accepted by most and not appealed!

I know it’s incredibly stressful but keep appealing and if you have documentation to support your diagnosis and anything related to your health, get letters of support if you can. Also, did you complete the form yourself, maybe get someone who knows the procedure.

I always help my niece complete hers and so far we’ve been successful after earlier rejections.

They don’t like it up them, so keep putting it up them!

Hope this helps.

Yes i would say to draw their attention to the contradiction. Work could be considered an essential task to provide some wellness, but not without its challenges. Like me having a dog, she keeps me going, but i have to get out of bed, i would prefer nit to, but the benefits outweigh the negative impact. What we do is nit without suffering but we are intelligent enough to recognise the benefits. Explain this in your appeal letter x

Good idea - many thanks! 

Maybe consider keeping a diary of your day, over a period of a few days or a week. Provide details of how you are feeling, what you struggle with ect. Provide a copy with your appeal letter. Provide your most personal difficulties. Remember they dont know, if you dont tell them. Say it as it is. Taje your time preparing your appeal. Good luck x

Madness. I was rambling and throughout (no surprise as my assessment has those as key characteristics I exhibited strongly), acknowledging as much, apologising for it even,  and there were as many behavioural clues as stated facts in the whole phone call. And yet… basically their response amounts to a great big ‘LIAR!’ What a gruelling and intentionally abusive process. 

This is now exactly my situation as of opening my letter today. Two points only, after one of the most exhausting and forensic divulgences of my day to day I’ve ever had to go through. Particularly hurtful are the following two statements:

1. ‘you work full time and seldom take a sick day’ (this despite all the PIP literature saying that working or not doesn’t affect the assessment either way) 

2. ‘You communicate effectively and articulately’ I expressed even in the phone call itself concern that that very fact would be misinterpreted to mean something it doesn’t about how much I struggle. 

Even though I thought I’d prepared myself for the abusive gaslighting that at least round one of this process would deliver to my door, I’m not sure anything can truly prepare one guy or the bluntness of the ‘you said x but I believe y’ bald statements that comprise the final write-up. I will be resting up for the rest of Christmas (none of the advice lines I tried today are open until new year anyway) and then resuming the struggle via the mandatory appeal process. That will apparently require additional evidence, so I’ll have to ask my parents to write a bluntly honest letter about their adult son’s financial mismanagements and general square peg/round hole-ness. All very uncomfortable but necessary if I’m not to just roll over and accept being called an imposter. 

Anyway, rant over -sorry! A question though if anyone can please help: is it advisable to point out the contradiction addressed in point one above? That is point out that they have cited as a reason for withholding points a fact (that I work) that all the PIP literature said would be neither here nor there in tens of a decision? It feels like a blatantly illegal move flaunted at me in black and white. Appalling really. 

thing about communicating well is whether the other person understood truly what you meant.

for example. issues supposedly get resolved when to me they are not resolved, the other side just thinks im ok with it and its solved and thinks i got what i wanted or whatever when i didnt. i rejected a 4am shift at work and they took it as me rejecting a 7am shift which i wanted to be in the que for... i dont understand how that works and my saying i dont wanna do 2pm shifts because i wanna train kickboxing was then also said to be my excuse for rejecting a 7am shift, when i didnt  reject 7am i rejected 4am and my excuse for not wanting 2pm was kickboxing training.... it goes all over the place and the other side doesnt understand but thinks they do and thinks its clear and perfect communication and solved when it is not and they got it all wrong.

communication hard to diagnose as the other side assumes they know what you mean while absolutely getting it all wrong anyway.

Over 80% of applications are denied at first stage - it's a deliberate attempt to simply make you give up.  In appeals, 60(ish)% are approved without any additional information, another 30(ish)% with oral clarification.  That information all comes from their own website.

I got 0 points. They even said that I communicate perfectly well.  Me. Who's autistic. It would certainly be news to my Consultant as it's a key diagnostic of an autism diagnosis, without which we wouldn't have been diagnosed!

yeah you can look at the questions and requirements for pip and i looked through it myself and have to admit its next to impossible to get pip with autism without actually lying.

you have to pick the options that say you cannot go to the toilet without assistance and cant go outside in public without assistance to get any points... but that would be lying for us yes?

The most useful thing is to know how their points system works and make sure what you say helps them fit you in the appropriate tick boxes. If you fail to say the one thing they need to hear that puts the tick in the box (because you didn't think of it or misunderstood or were too flustered or whatever) you won't get the tick in the box. If you mention one good day and that's all they pay attention too the tick goes in the wrong box. If you mention a good day you have to strongly insist that is not the norm and that almost all the time it is not like that then explain what puts you in the right tick box. Prep beforehand, write notes, make sure you can say what they need to hear to tick the boxes that fit your experience. Here is a link:- https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/Global/Migrated_Documents/adviceguide/pip-9-table-of-activities-descriptors-and-points.pdf

Ask for a Mandatory Review (MR) and if that’s not successful go to a Tribunal. Your chances should improve ar each stage. It’s not personal - DWP are capable of ignoring any and all medical evidence.

Hello

Take it to tribunal there is a issue with the paperwork being sent out by the government.

Also write your own evidence or get support from someone to send them evidence by email or post as it can be hard to describe different disabilities on the forms provided.

If you need any help or want to speak more about it I'm happy to help.

Kind Regards 

Hi K-4, 

I am sorry to hear that. I have exactly the same experience as you. I am not diagnosed though. I have long history of struggles but I am being ping-ponged backwards and forwards between professionals. When I have applied for PIP in September last year I have received 2 points in total. 

You've got to really ham it up. When I went to the assessment I just sat there like an unkempt mute idiot. Don't tell them your life-story. Don't even answer their questions.

Hi K4 

So sorry to hear this. 

I am also in the same process and just recently sent off my forms. I found the whole process really trying and depressing because of the way you have to describe yourself. I am very much a sort of chin up, get on with it, sort of person. I try to put my difficulties behind me and move on as best I can but it just isn't possible sometimes and having to decare that is hard. 

I fully expect to be rejected too, and have to appeal, because everything I have read indicates this is the normal process, so I am buckled up for that. 

Wish we weren't in this position. 

Good luck with the next steps. 

For example your extractor fan got fixed, not because you called the workman, but because ‘the workman was called around for an annual check-up requested by the landlord and he happened to notice it was broken and he fixed it’ so that was good!’, it took 11 months and 29 days to get it fixed though, but it was a good day..

Or if you do mention a good day, be honest about the circumstantial/temporary/chaotic nature, of the components of that day.. and how it isn’t reasonable to rely on those kinds of conditions in your daily living..