Profound autism

Profound autism, is it real, or is it just intellectual disability with certain autistic features? People with intellectual disability, who are also talkative and extrovert and keen on social interaction are not called 'profoundly neurotypical'.

This sort of thing, like assignment of species in human evolution, tends to switch between 'lumpers' and 'splitters'. The 'spectrum' saw lumpers in the ascendant, perhaps the pendulum is swinging the other way?

Martin said:

Profound autism, is it real, or is it just intellectual disability with certain autistic features?

does it matter in this context?  - to quote the article "The category is intended to help governments and service providers plan and deliver support, so autistic people with the highest needs aren’t overlooked. It also aims to re-balance their under-representation in mainstream autism research.what counts is are they treated fairly and appropriately supported by society."

maybe the mainstream autism research that is prompted by this will answer that question :-)

I think that having nomenclature reflect reality is always important. I think medical terminology being accurate is useful. Then again I am that grey beast, the forest wolf, no, worse than that! - an autistic pedant.

I suddenly got the line form the Anglo-Saxon poem, 'The Battle of Brunnanburh' stuck in my head, "... and þæt græge deor, wulf on wealde".  Deor, ancestor of the word 'deer', originally meant any sort of beast, including wolves.

There undoubtedly needs to be more, and more tailored, support for all autistic people and all people with non-physical disabilities. Perhaps the autistic spectrum is too broad a church to be useful in developing support strategies?

If I may speak as one autistic pedant to another Martin  ?

I have never seen you so I accept your hair may be grey and that you and I as, like all animals, are a beast.

Unless you are unusually capable though, you are not a forest wolf.  Although I appreciate the metaphor to explain .

Whilst naming does not always reflect reality I agree that scientific nomenclature should strive to accurately reflect reality in being precise, stable and universal.

However science is a human construct - although those doing it (mostly) strive to overcome errors, subjective choices and cultural bias it deals with probabilities rather than absolute certainties and it is rarely certain.

I acknowledge that in the IP article case it is driven by some of the problems just mentioned however it does say that the intention is to drive forward research into the topic.  I agree that not least will be defining the need to define nomenclature further - as you so correctly point out.

At present I think it gratifying that there is a move to support people further and make further investigative studies and that is the point I think we might focus on.

Best wishes

If I may speak as one autistic pedant to another Martin  ?

I have never seen you so I accept your hair may be grey and that you and I as, like all animals, are a beast.

Unless you are unusually capable though, you are not a forest wolf.  Although I appreciate the metaphor to explain .

Whilst naming does not always reflect reality I agree that scientific nomenclature should strive to accurately reflect reality in being precise, stable and universal.

However science is a human construct - although those doing it (mostly) strive to overcome errors, subjective choices and cultural bias it deals with probabilities rather than absolute certainties and it is rarely certain.

I acknowledge that in the IP article case it is driven by some of the problems just mentioned however it does say that the intention is to drive forward research into the topic.  I agree that not least will be defining the need to define nomenclature further - as you so correctly point out.

At present I think it gratifying that there is a move to support people further and make further investigative studies and that is the point I think we might focus on.

Best wishes

I suddenly got the line form the Anglo-Saxon poem, 'The Battle of Brunnanburh' stuck in my head, "... and þæt græge deor, wulf on wealde".  Deor, ancestor of the word 'deer', originally meant any sort of beast, including wolves.

There undoubtedly needs to be more, and more tailored, support for all autistic people and all people with non-physical disabilities. Perhaps the autistic spectrum is too broad a church to be useful in developing support strategies?