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Flag waving

TheCatWoman

It seems that the English flag is being used again as a symbol of nationalism, being paraded around the streets by those wanting rid of asylum seekers and placed in gardens.

Do you feel comfortable with it? I don't, for me it's tainted by Neo Nazi's and other fascists, or for football.

In Britain we've never had a habit of flag use and worship like some other countries, mostly seen in America and I wouldn't like us to acquire the habit. 

Am I the only one to find it ironic that St George was a Turk? He supplanted St Edmund as Englands national saint on a whim of Richard the Lionheart, we have lots of native saints to choose from, St Alban, St Edward, St Thomas A'Becket, St Hilda, and so many more often more obscure ones like St Petroc or St Willibrord.

I also feel uncomfortable that as a non Christian the flag is a blatently Christian religious symbol, at least in Wales we have Ye Ddraig Goch, The Red Dragon, nice and mythological and non religious.

Parents

  • Welcome to the English version of N. Ireland!

    We have Ulster flags, Irish flags, Union flags (some upside down), UVF, UDA and other such flags, hanging on lamp posts in very nearly every town and city here. We also have Israeli flags hanging in loyalist communities and Palestinian flags hanging in Nationalist communities.

    Some of these flags are flying as a symbol of identity and are to mark territory, but their purpose is to incite fear and hatred.

    I don’t think that people who hang flags as a symbol of hatred are interested in the history of St George, it wouldn't serve their purpose.

    Yes, I do think the Welsh flag is nice and it would be nice if N.Ireland had something nicer than a cross with a red hand.

  • in reply to ArchaeC

    I suspect the Golden Wyvern would upset those from other English regions.

    Newnight did a section on the subject last night and it was very interesting, I actually agreed with Steve Baker, who when he was a minister stood for everything I disliked, he asked about whether those who waved flags around were insecure in thier identity? It's worth a watch, he made comparrisons to NI too.

    Theres no representation of Wales in the Union Jack, so it's not a flag of unified countries, Wales was conquered and assimilated into England.

    I'm not a fan of flags at the best of times, but when I see the St George flag or the Union Jack, I immediately think the worst, maybe its a hangover from growing up in the 1970's when they were associated with football holigans rioting and the National Front. I don't think they'll ever be anything other than symbols of racism and thuggery for me.

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  • in reply to ArchaeC

    I suspect the Golden Wyvern would upset those from other English regions.

    Newnight did a section on the subject last night and it was very interesting, I actually agreed with Steve Baker, who when he was a minister stood for everything I disliked, he asked about whether those who waved flags around were insecure in thier identity? It's worth a watch, he made comparrisons to NI too.

    Theres no representation of Wales in the Union Jack, so it's not a flag of unified countries, Wales was conquered and assimilated into England.

    I'm not a fan of flags at the best of times, but when I see the St George flag or the Union Jack, I immediately think the worst, maybe its a hangover from growing up in the 1970's when they were associated with football holigans rioting and the National Front. I don't think they'll ever be anything other than symbols of racism and thuggery for me.

Children
  • in reply to TheCatWoman
    TheCatWoman said:
    I'm not a fan of flags at the best of times, but when I see the St George flag or the Union Jack, I immediately think the worst, maybe its a hangover from growing up in the 1970's when they were associated with football holigans rioting and the National Front.

    I identify with that, and if we have experienced things like that we can’t feel otherwise.

    In my case it’s when I see the Union Flag and the Irish Tricolour. Having grown up during the worst of ‘the troubles’ in N. Ireland, I associate those flags with division and violence and I loathe the sight of them. It’s impossible not to make the association, even when the Irish Flag is flying legitimately over government buildings in Dublin, or the Union Flag is flying in its proper place over a council building in England.

    Years after her death, I am still hearing my mother’s voice saying, “I would ban the lot of them”. 

    Flags should be flown in a dignified manner. Tragically, the misplaced and illegitimate flying of National flags promotes a less than gratifying experience of legitimate national flag flying.