Criticism of Broad Autism Phenotype

That hits exactly on my point, Martin.

Who decides where this "borderline" is? (rhetorical question)

Additionally, we are dealing with a sum of borderlines on a collection of scales into a single borderline.

It's arbitrary enough with one scale - my comment further below is

"You score 144.399389 on this scale - sorry you don't fit this box - you have to suffer in silence by yourself!

You score 145.21991 on this scale - welcome to the club!!"

But then the ASD borderline is based on several of these already arbitrary borderlines.

And THEN, some of these tests are not as scientific and reliable as a layperson would be led to believe. Especially as masking is only recently being taken into account (by some.)

And THEN, there are hidden motives like not wanting to cause any financial cost to the already underfunded health services.

I think there is a lot to be said for what someone opined here, that it might not be in the interests of the government to be offering support for possibly undeserved people. So an ambulant autism, a truly abled autism, would certainly save tax payers money. The ghosts of Christmas past, the workhouse, the poor law and Benthamism do rattle their chains mightily in the UK! Obviously that is not much help to those who mask away, then have it all crashing down because of the need to conform to the neurotypical paradigm, and ways of doing things.

Actually........ 

I heard something a while back about a possible poo test that could diagnose autism. So  for those who might like a little something to carry into the DWP appeal tribunal...... 

Interestingly, Chinese medicine has always said there is a connection with the gut and the mind - the mind that is, that obsesses. 

That is a criticism of the diagnoses of all non-physical conditions that do not have definitive yes/no tests available. A person cannot be borderline Down's Syndrome, as Chr. 21 trisomy is definitive, but borderline autism is all too real.

That has its own diagnostic criteria, I believe.

My mom has traits that are autistic, the biggest difference between me and her is that she manages stress and sensory input much better than me, likes her routine but changes don’t cause her stress, has few long term friends and doesn’t need anyone else. She said she is happy, she always felt different, as a child she was interested with airplanes and didn’t care about peers giving her weird looks when she infodumped them about airplanes. She said she feelt superior to them, although she felt different. She has never understood me feeling inferior and not fully grown up, she has always told me that I’m exaggerating and overreacting. I think me and my mom could be some sort of example of one person having autistic traits but not being really affected by them and other person - having their impact on life. 

Sounds like diagnosis envy to me, NT's who are jealous and feeling left out. People don't realise that just having one or two things that are on the spectrum dosen't mean that the spectrum is wrong or that they are misdiagnosed. A spectrum condition and there are many not just ASC, but things like fibromyalgia, chronic fatigue etc are called a spectrum as there are a list of signs and symptoms that can go to make a diagnosis, people will often have half a dozen or more, but not the whole list, unlike an illness like measles where everybody has the same symptoms.

Where would the d diagnosis PDD Nos fit into this ? 

Really? I didn't know that 

I struggled most of my life, as a teenager I was suicidal be suse of feeling inferior to others and not having friends. I think that I missed the diagnosis at that time because of neglect by my parents. Now I heard that in fact I fit the criteria, dx wouldn’t have helped me. It’s ok, I help myself without dx, by being here for example. My problems changed, now the biggest issue are sensory sensitivities, while lack of friends is not so painful because my situation and priorities have changed. However the trauma from my childhood, the bullying, the depression in that period that was supposed to be the most beautiful, has its impact on me even now. I’m not sure if having the dx back then would have helped me. Recently I started a therapy. My mom is angry that I did it, she said, be careful, don’t let them diagnose you with anything! I honestly regret telling her. I’m 36 and still feel kinda not fully grown up, I still feel like a child lost in a fog especially when being around people and their complicated interactions. For someone I could be autistic enough, for someone else, just a little bit, but not enough. Is it defined precisely how much one has to suffer from being different to be included? What about those who are not included anywhere because they are not enough anywhere? When I had my several hours long examination by a team of neurologists, the result was I don’t have Tourette (previously diagnosed) they only said that I’m just very sensitive to sensory input. And that’s it. No one wanted to look for other reasons why I have tics occasionally and why I stim. It took me years to figure it out by myself - why and solution- minimising sensory input. I think it should be the professionals job to do. 

Well put Mark - I’d agree with all of these points

It's nice to see scientific evidence of a hunch that I had.

It's a bit confusing.

From what I've read there is a level 0 which means you just don't require any substantive support. Where do these people fit against the Broad Autism Phenotype?

It just bothers me because no classification system is perfect and ones that are based on personal opinion and multiple criteria are even less perfect. Throw in long wait times and personal biases that we see reported over and over, leads to people falling through the cracks.

I may have fallen outside of the criteria when I was at my most productive. But that very 'productivity' in itself led to where I am today.

It appears to me to be a useful way to describe people with autistic traits who do not quite reach the criteria for diagnosis. Obviously, such people exist, why not give them a term that describes them in a succinct way? While autism is a spectrum, the spectrum must extend beyond those who are clinically diagnosable into the population in general, as this is what all multifactorial conditions do.

Just did a quick scholarly AI chat about BAP and us 'Latelings'

Key Differences Between BAP and Late-Diagnosed ASD

 still think it is rubbish developed by NT folks in academic ivory towers!

I do not like this definition. It seems to me to be a move to place some folks with ASD (whatever level) into a new category that would not meet the definition of disabled in uk.

Seems to jump on the bandwagon of the right who claim that some of use are using reasonable adjustments to get perks!

This seems to be a made up interpretation of level 1 ASD combined with masking. It then goes on to talk about the toll masking takes leading to autistic burnout. It is a complete contradiction. Pure rubbish.

People really really like to put things in well-defined boxes. (Ironically, possibly autistic people more than most)

That is what all characterisations like this are - putting things in nice neat boxes.

You score 144.399389 on this scale - sorry you don't fit this box - you have to suffer in silence by yourself!

You score 145.21991 on this scale - welcome to the club!!

I personally think that people should be able to get support where they think they may need it, without labels if it helps them.

I had not heard of this term before, so I don't have an opinion yet.

I did find an article with a definition; https://www.verywellhealth.com/what-is-the-broad-autism-phenotype-260048

(I'm currently on moderation, so I don't know when this will appear)