I've got quite a little archive of demo-tapes, multi-track masters, and a few things which have been digitised. The former guitarist of my first band is quite the archivist, too; he has a lot of tapes from the days of us just experimenting in our bedrooms and learning our chops. Of course, with the amateur equipment available back in those days and our lack of finances back then, the recordings are all pretty ropey - if we could borrow a couple of microphones and a cassette four-track for a couple of weeks, we considered ourselves spoiled, and the cellar of a back-to-back is hardly Abbey Road!

The bands I was in did get a few tracks on compilations that were released on vinyl through small "DIY" labels. The final band that I was in did recordings for an EP release of our own, but sadly the drummer had to leave the band due to a personal crisis, so it was canned when the band became defunct. There were only the two of us, and few drummers can get their head around my time-signatures; so, coupled with my "offstage-fright" this was the end of my time playing in bands. I have played one gig since then, a re-union of a comedy band for a friend's birthday, which I did enjoy a great deal, but I wouldn't want to go back to doing it regularly.

I've never got around to looking for free web-hosting or anything like that, though. It's always seemed a bit moot with it all having been so long ago, and while we did have a few enthusiastic followers, we were too outside the usual punk genres to pick up much of a following. To be quite honest, with my social impairments, talking to people who actually liked the music was one of the hardest things of all; I could never think of anything much more to say than "um, thanks?".

To be fair, my parents were actually pretty laid back about those kinds of things; I consider myself fortunate that my family introduced me to gardening, wildlife, rambling, camping, etc. We're not the kind to let a few grey clouds and muddy puddles put us off enjoying the wonders of nature, and nearly having your tent blown down in the middle of the night is seen as an adventure rather than a disaster. I've even taken my mum and step-dad caving and abseiling, which they thoroughly enjoyed!

) ( said:

just rambling my mind and mouth today, random, maybe not topic specific?

Not a problem. Unless a top-poster is requesting support with a particular issue, I've always been cool with the idea of general discussion threads being catalysts as much as anything thematic. I don't usually feel that I "own" or need to "curate" the threads that I start, and the tangents that people take are often as fascinating to me as "on topic" posts.

A bit of lateral thinking never hurt anyone!

I was allowed to run free, only come in when it was tee time or very dark, 

I would fit into any tribe, preoccupation with looks and hygiene are modern concepts to control everyone. 

And as I consider myself reasonably intelligent I know the difference between grubby and toxic, Squalor is a no no, but dirt is all part of life, 

just rambling my mind and mouth today, random, maybe not topic specific? But mean well.

Did you record these songs?

) ( said:

got totally soaked pot holing and windswept and soaked rock climbing

Getting wet, getting muddy, bruising yourself, tearing your clothing, stripping off in a lay-by in a pretty national park; I often wondered whether I took to caving just because I got to do all the things that my parents told me not to when I was a kid.

Trogluddite said “ Always nice to meet someone else who understands the attraction of poking around underground!“

well count me in also.

Although my experience was a brief one during a school trip to wales. I thoroughly enjoyed pot holing and rock climbing, got totally soaked pot holing and windswept and soaked rock climbing, also circumnavigating the rocks along the sea shore, with massive waves crashing against us, also my first abseil was whilst massive waves covered me, 

I enjoyed the intensity of both, Earth and me, at one together, respect is needed, or suffer the consequences.

I never really fitted anything, I was an individual, lost mostly, the comment about missing secret lessons on Toms thread hit me, as I always felt I had missed the secret lessons the others attended, I was a hippy and a biker, both were alternative, so I did not have to try and fit the norm, I deliberately aimed not to, it worked until I mixed with other hippies or mostly bikers, clothes alone do not make the man.

Enjoyed reading your story... thank you, we do share quite a few things it seems.

glad to know I wasn’t the only one doing what I did.

Always nice to meet someone else who understands the attraction of poking around underground!

I'm a great believer in peer-run clubs too. Sadly, institutional concerns about liability, litigation and insurance seem to have led to the downfall of many opportunities for people to get involved. There were a couple of call-outs in my time in the club, but both were caused by freak summer thunderstorm cells that not even the best meteorologist could have predicted, and the rescuers were happy that we were well equipped, well trained, and acted correctly to avoid a bad situation becoming worse. A few bumps and bruises were the worst injury that anyone sustained (if you don't include the riotous annual club dinners!) When people asked me "but isn't that dangerous?", I'd tell them, "yes, the drive there and back can be really hair-raising sometimes!"

My biggest concern is when I see the kind of difficult rescues that get reported in the media, where a large group of novices is involved. There's always the worry that commercial pressures or over-confident leaders can lead to taking unnecessary risks with the weather, or to have too few leaders in charge of groups which might be manageable when all goes well, but which are too large to manage safely if anything goes wrong. There's always the temptation to "not let people down"; contrary to the old cavers' maxim; "If in doubt, stay out."

The rescue personnel that I've spoken to, or who have written about their experiences, seem to agree; they don't mind responsible groups falling foul of the unpredictable, nor experienced cavers pushing hard to discover new ground. Most rescuers are volunteers who are very keen cavers, passionate to encourage involvement, and often the very kind who push for new discoveries. It's the people who take risks with the lives of novices who are utterly reliant on the leader to keep them safe for whom they have the most scorn.

Funny you mention the caving.  I went to a small school in the Mendips that had a pupil run caving club.  (I don't think you'd get away with that now.)  Teachers only got to go caving by invitation only :-).  Caving is one of the reasons why I didn't do particularly well in my A-levels (although much better than the amount of effort I put in deserved).  After leaving school I still carried on with a bit and then joined the University caving club when I went full time.  I did a couple of trips with them but quit after a couple of the kids were messing around and one ended up with a compound leg fracture.

These "so called" adults had nothing on the sense of understanding and responsibility that we had in the school club which had managed never to require the services of the Mendip Rescue Organisation for about 60 years by the time I was in it.

__Pathfinder__ said:

I picked up Scuba Diving

It was pot-holing/caving for me, hence my username. I carried on for quite a while after I quit my course, as the SU allowed that. I liked that it wasn't competitive in a sporting sense, just people vs. nature, and with no room for big egos because of the remoteness from the outside world and possible dire consequences of a balls up. Besides being in bands, who were always friends anyway, it's the only time I ever felt the word "team" to really be meaningful. You've got to be some kind of nutcase to want to do serious caving in Northern England, so it attracted plenty of odd-balls like me. Sadly the boozing didn't do much for my fitness, and I at least didn't stoop to risking other's safety by pushing my luck, and it ended up getting a bit repetitive with a new bunch of freshers to train up every year. Leading trips underground is certainly the most responsibility I've ever taken on, but despite my usual lack of self-confidence, I was always alright with that somehow - underground, I was far more in my element than above.

__Pathfinder__ said:

Does a diagnosis have any practical value outside having a yes/no answer?

Unless you need supports or accommodations, it's certainly not essential. My attitude is that if people's experiences click, and they receive advice that's useful and a bit of moral support when they need it, then the label is just a convenient term of reference. But I would add this. You may not need supports now, but like all of us, you are going to age, and could have unexpected downturns in your life; so if you have the opportunity, it may be worth taking it as insurance for the future.

__Pathfinder__ said:

I came here for more selfish reasons

Don't worry about that, most of us did. It's in the nature of support sites for it to be so.

__Pathfinder__ said:

Anyway, I'm glad you didnt suceed at suicide.

Thankyou; I'm very flattered and grateful for you saying that. The forum seems to have really blossomed just lately, it will be nice to have you aboard.

One thing kept me at Uni and it had zero to do with studying.  When i was in Wales I picked up Scuba Diving as an optional module.  Always wanted to learn to dive, so I did.  When I moved to my second Uni I kept up the diving and that kept me at Uni for probably longer than everything else.  Don't get me wrong the course was good, but I had several problems I knew about going in, presentations being a major issue and the one I have never defeated or been able to work around.

Nowadays my main release is a motorbike.  I can remove a ton of stress and anxiety with a 40 min ride.  It's at least as good as a quarter of valium.

I don't have a D-Day so far.  I did the online test a while back and got a respectable 38/50, re-ran it recently (a few hours back) and got the same result.  I dont see what a formal diagnosis will do for me.  iThe only real thing i can see it doing is maybe giving me closure and an explanation why I made my parents life a living hell for most of my childhood.  But I dont think they would care either, since I repaired our relationship long ago.  Does a diagnosis have any practical value outside having a yes/no answer?

Anyway, I'm glad you didnt suceed at suicide.  You seem a decent person and offer help to many other people (who I am sure are very grateful).  I came here for more selfish reasons (applied for a cyber security academy for neurodivergent individuals after seeing it on theregister last night), but may stay a while.

__Pathfinder__ said:

Somehow I survived Uni.

I flunked out after a year and a half and getting far too good at picking up pints. I couldn't cope with the people and change of lifestyle at all and ended up with a serious drink problem. I messed up a couple of suicide attempts badly (well?) enough to not do myself too much damage (nothing long-term, anyway.) It's hard to believe I was an A-grader teacher's pet when I was at school!

__Pathfinder__ said:

Still have a bass gutar sat downstairs that I tell myself I will learn to play but have never got around to.

That's once of my few real escapes. Bass was my main instrument, usually through a whole bunch of pedals, and I've always carried on playing since my band days. No songwriting or any intent to play gigs again, I can just take my brain somewhere when I play; maybe a bit like meditation is for some people, but I could never keep my brain calm enough for that.

Pretty much mirrors my experience, minus the punk rock band and song writing, tried and failed at that long ago.  Still have a bass gutar sat downstairs that I tell myself I will learn to play but have never got around to.

I now have an attitude that i dont really give a damn anymore.  i dont know if its a good thing, but it works for me up to a point.  I enter chameleon mode when around people i care for, family, friends and make an effort to interact and act normal (or for me abnormal).  I used to get stoned when i had to do anything social, just to calm me down to a point were i could function, which led to a lot of hilarity in hindsight (trying to process 5 conversations in a loud, crowded pub, while trying to work out how to pick up a pint of cider).  Somehow I survived Uni.

One of my brothers kids asked me "what is the point of life?".  I just bluntly said, their isnt a point, its pointless, then you die.  Umm, probably not the best response at a family bbq. :P  I just forgot for a second im supposed to come up with some deep meaningful bs to explain how good life is.  Life isnt good, or at least mine isnt.  Yours may differ.  Or as ever, YMMV.