How do you feel about working?

I'm not really sure how to approach this question as it's something I've struggled with my entire life.

I'm also now aware of the statistics for autistic people in employment. Something I didn't even think about or know about until my recent diagnosis. So please, forgive me if I inadvertently cross the line somewhere.

So, I have been self-employed for around 20yrs, and I've had a lot of freedom and relative success in my work. But, I have never wanted to work, and I am rarely motivated by work. I do my work because I have to earn money, and I never wanted a regular job.

I have had regular jobs, when I was younger, but I never found them particularly valuable or stimulating. The things I enjoyed most were the driving from job to job, or driving across Europe for an event. I think it was the sense of autonomy and adventure that I enjoyed. But when it came to doing the actual work, not interested in any shape or form.

Maybe I'm just super lazy.

A personal interest eventually became my career, but not through desire. It was the least worst option. I could do something I found relatively interesting, and earn some money doing it. And I didn't really have to sell myself, people would seek me out.

But the work involved dealing with people on a one-to-one basis, creating/designing/inventing something in situ, and dealing with demands and expectations. This was/is always difficult for me. Balancing freedom and autonomy, career success, and external and perceived demands. Maybe I have low self esteem, or imposter syndrome, but it always feels like it's too much.

Another problem I have is I'm not motivated by money, That combined with 'laziness' and impulsiveness meant that I would be reluctant to take on work, cancel work, and feel irritated when I actually took on work. That behaviour would get me into financial difficulties on numerous occasions. I can't easily be swayed by money, and given a choice between work and no work, I would often choose no work.

I think this might be an issue of values, of motivation, and some form of demand avoidance.

Don't get me wrong, I know how lucky I am to have my work, even if I don't really appreciate it. And I'm fortunate enough that it pays well enough for me to be fickle about it, and it gives me a lot of leeway.

But I've never really understood why we obsess so much about work, financial needs aside, and nobody has been able to answer me. Or maybe they just didn't understand the question. Most people seem to answer on a practical level, but I tend to be asking on a philosophical/existential level.

So, in reality, I don't want to work, I've never wanted to work, I'm not really interested in money, but we need money, and I'm a materialist. Aargh

Also, to clarify. I'm not from a wealthy background, no inheritance etc, we were often scraping to make ends meet, council estate tenants. I was in debt when I was 16/17. So this doesn't come from a place of financial security, this comes from somewhere else.

Now I'm not really sure if this is a question or a statement, but I'd love to know how you all deal with this kind of thing.

  • Ah yes, I think this is quite common.

    I rarely get bored if I'm left to my own devices. I'm quite happy to stare out the window and watch the world go by Slight smile

    I get bored if I have to work too hard, but that might be some kind of demand avoidance, hahaha.

  • i feel bored if I am not working. If i was rich i would be out in my garden doing gardening stuff. 

  • Ah, interesting.

    I do find I enjoy helping people (when I can get around my 'dislike' for people) and I would happily do things for free, The sense of being useful is something I find to be important.

    When expectations and demands creep in I tend to withdraw.

    Maybe it's an ego/money/expectation problem.

    But I have spent so much of my life being combative and defensive that it can be difficult for me to let go .

  • as long as my conscience knows I am serving people I’ll get satisfsctiion. If I’m motivated by me me me I’ll never fill the infinite need 

  • I wouldn't necessarily say that I'm lazy, although others might disagree, because I can be very focused on my work if I am engaged.

    The problem is, my mental energy and engagement can drop pretty quickly, even when doing things I want to do.

    My diagnosis has helped me think about how I function and what is best for my productivity, and I've basically explained to my clients that when I'm done (engagement/focus etc) the work stops and we'll resume another day. I've stopped concerning myself with absolute deadlines and expectations.

    I'm lucky that my work allows for this, and my clients seek me out for certain qualities. Although it might be inconvenient for them they know if they want a quality result, it has to be done my way. I've always been about quality not quantity when it comes to my work.

    I don't really get the working all hours thing, so I try to provide the highest quality work that I can, with a price to match, meaning I don't have to work so often. Again, I know I'm very lucky to be able to do this, but even then it can feel like a chore.

    I did burn out a few years back, and tried to get a job instead. Massive fail, although I didn't try very hard. I hadn't had a job interview since the 90s and had no idea what you're supposed to do. I also found a few job vacancies didn't line up with what was being advertised. Almost as if they want you to be able to do everything and anything.

    Some jobs I looked at were expecting things that in my mind were distinct roles with separate salaries to match. I read that as one person doing several jobs for one person's pay. No thank you. 

    Yes, I hated school, couldn't understand why I was there. I did well in the sciences though. Poorly in the humanities. 

    Always distracted, always dreaming.

  • I relate to your use of the "L" word: Lazy.  I have been called that numerous times by friends and family with regard to work.  I often think I am lazy.

    I recently got an ASC diagnosis although I've had strong suspicions for many years.  One thing that I put on my assessment form about my problematic employment history was that the stress of being disciplined/sacked for poor attendance is often outweighed by the stress of just being at work.  So I've had a lot of time off "ill", and left various jobs either voluntarily or had my marching orders.  "Lazy" is an easy label to use about my behaviour.

    My recent diagnosis has bolstered my belief that the work and education systems we have in this country are not for me.  I hated being at school, being at work is really hard and applying for jobs is a nightmare.

    I'm hoping that now I have a diagnosis I can put the "lazy" falsehood behind me despite it being engrained.  Finding other people here who struggle with employment is most reassuring.

  • Excellent.

    My difficulty is my passions and interests change like the wind, often in the direction that isn't where I need to be going right now. That might be an ADHD thing.

    I do love what I do, but I always want to be doing something else. People have said I should write a book, or go on a talking circuit. But I wouldn't know what to write about or talk about. I have little interest in talking or writing about the thing that I do because doing that thing takes too much of mental energy already. 

    But yes, doing something of interest will always be easier.

  • Yes, I knocked drugs/booze on the head a long time ago. Occasionally I'll drink for social reasons, but it doesn't usually end well, so I tend to avoid booze, and socializing.

    Haha, putting stuff off. I know that well. That's why I developed my work to have little to no planning or preparation, coming up with solutions on the spot. Not the most efficient way, but it works well for my way of thinking, and my clients seem to like the approach.

  • I did a fair bit of drugs and alcohol in my day but I don't seem to have the time for it now.

    Yeah I have some pretty heavy financial incentives not to blow the thing up that said Ive now spent an hour avoiding writing a board report for a meeting I'm chairing tomorrow  

  • I am happy only now I am self-emplyed. I work really hard - but because my job is also my passion and interest. I make money out of talking about things I love. (I'm a writer and a tutor of English) I think that's the key.

  • That was 20-30 years ago, and I had absolutely no comprehension of any condition in me or anyone else. I didn't even know what stimming was until a couple of years ago.

    I was under a moody nihilistic cloud, fueled by drugs and alcohol, and most of my work was involved in alternative lifestyles. People were mostly outsiders, rebels, weirdos, high, drunk, etc

    All the misfits, so I never noticed anything. It was all curiously normal to me. 

    Probably a lot of closet/undiagnosed autists in my field Slight smile

    I have a habit of self sabotage. I basically put my work on self destruct a few years ago, and now I'm trying to rebalance things.

    I'm a sole trader, it's only me. I have no responsibilities apart from my family, but the risk is all mine if I go on self destruct again. No staff to carry the load.

  • Sorry, yes. I had a bit of a brain fart and sort of overlooked the medical part of retired.

    I'm new to all this and having learned about my poor theory of mind I'm trying really hard to understand things from a perspective that isn't my own.

    My view of myself and the world around me has changed somewhat in the last few months.

  • If you'd told me in 2018 that in 2021 I would be medically retired, I would have looked at you with disbelief and spent the rest of that year worrying I would develop a terminal illness. Apart from long bouts of depression and anxiety, I had little to no awareness of ASD or Autism (apart from Dustin Hoffman's character in the Rain Man, which I've never even seen.)

  • So much of your story is familiar, did you realise the driving to and from calls was stimming, I only picked up on it with Covid as I lost all that processing time. 

    If I'm not just projecting about what industry you are in look out for people stimming at conferences it's petty intense, I mentioned my autism in a meeting once and they didn't bat an eyelid so I'm guessing its a well known secret that we are well represented.

    I'm self employed and I've always been driven to make myself redundant by having enough staff, that way I won't need to work.   

  • Unfortunately, I don't think I'll ever be in a position to retire. I'll probably have to some form of paid work until I drop.

    Having said that, I've been existing in a form of 'semi-retirement' for the past 6yrs, at least mentally, hahaha.

  • I'm medically retired now, Exist. I devote all my time to the creative arts: music (piano) composition and performance. Until my early retirement, I'd worked in Education and also Recruitment.