Advice on my plan

Yo guys, its Wei. 20 years old male.

Today, I have gone to a mental health service and it wasn't very helpful in my opinion because all she did was telling me what i already know and that the thoughts that gone through my brain was all false which i disagree but it was clear i suffer from Asperger and she wasn't a GP so it was a "solution" attempt she said so she wasn't able to give me a prescription. (Read my previous post if you want more information on my situation)

But i have been watching videos of a clinical psychiatrist and also a professor of a university so he teaches lectures and records them on YouTube, name Dr Jordan Perterson. After watching and follow up some of his many works the past month i have found some encouragement in me and like to move forward but just in case my plan is terrible so i'd ask for some advice here and thanks in advance.

I am currently studying Games Technology and its quite likely that i am going to be required to resit even if i try to work for it right now because I have almost 0 knowledge of what is going on and the project deadline is in 6 days. So instead of trying so hard on this course that i chose to be my escape from reality as it is an introvert course dealing with computers that doesn't require much social interaction. i'll like to face my problems from now on and do what i think i'd want to do and want to give my all at.

My plan is instead of fighting a loosing battle or attempt to fight it again, i'll move toward a new course, i don't know what University i will be going to study this but its going to be Psychology. I will like to know more about my thoughts and myself by learning this course and i am going to try to read books, hard books that I never did before. But before going to University, i will take a year gap for once and take it easy for a year from studying, potentially sort my life out while prepare and research more on the topic of psychology and do readings about it. When i go to the University i plan to at the start of every module/lecture i'll introduce myself to everyone that i suffer from Asperger and would like to make friend with everyone despite having difficulty associating with people and hope many of them would accept it.

What are your thoughts on this? Please give me any advice or insight you think is appropriate. (This is a bit leading opinion but in another words, i am giving up on current course and try to persuade myself that i can move on and do better)

I will try and face this difficult path and get pass the fear of failure for real this time is what i believe right now.

Parents
  • Oh Wei, I can’t tell you how happy I am to read your post. I’m sat crying as I type this, with tears of pure joy.

    Today I sent a reply text message to my support worker, that said, I’m going to face the fear and do it anyway and I’m going to do what I need to do despite the fear.

    I took a year ‘out of life’. I mistakenly thought I was going to prepare myself during this year, to get ready to start my business ~ something that I’m 100% passionate about.

    However, I was wrong. It turned out that I needed my year out to rest. To withdraw completely, or as far as was possible, from life and my mind, my plans, my ideas etc.

    I spent a wonderful year inside my home. I was gentle, kind and loving to myself and I distracted myself by watching beautiful black and white movies on YouTube on my little phone. I was gathering my strength, but I didn’t realise that until I began to feel rested enough to start my life again.

    Within less than a week (of me being ready to face the world), I have been given (all free of charge) every ounce of support that I will need and have wanted (since the beginning of 2013), to help me set my business up. I can’t tell you how miraculous it feels and how truly grateful and humbled I am for all the love and exquisite support that’s coming my way.

    Failure, my good friend, is simply a wonderful opportunity to begin again, with more knowledge, understanding and awareness. You only fail when you give in. Success is the flip side to failure.

    This is all going to work out so wonderfully for you. I tell just about everyone I speak to that I’m autistic, and I mean everyone. I put it out there and I am met with nothing less than curiosity and acceptance, every time. I make new friends everyday, by simply smiling at everyone I meet and by saying a genuine, warm hello. If people want to talk they will, if they don’t, that’s perfectly ok, you will nearly always get a smile and a hello back, which helps us build our confidence, slowly, in our ability to make and then maintain friendships. When we are genuinely interested in other people and have a sincere desire to help and be friendly, we find that we make friends easily and we maybe make someone’s day along the way.

    I know I made the day of an elderly gentleman who I met on the street today. His face light up and we had a moment of eye to eye contact that said, thank you, it is so wonderful to meet you and we both parted with more love and joy and compassion active in our hearts than we did before our paths crossed.

    Be open and friendly and the people who resonate with you will become your good friends and the ones who don’t, will be friendly friends when your paths cross.

    There is so much support out there, you only have to ask and it will be given to you. Enjoy your gap year and enjoy the fabulous journey you will embark on from there on. You have a certain and beautiful life gently waiting for you for when you’re ready to claim it. You have already conquered your fear by declaring it is no match for you, and it isn’t. You’re not alone, there are always people around to ask for support when you need it, even if it’s only to say, I’m scared. It’s ok to be scared, it’s ok to have fears, so long as you know that’s all they are and they are no barrier to you achieving what you want in life.

    And I just know you will make the most wonderful friend so you will not be short of friends. The perfect friends for you are already waiting for you. You’re going to have a great time. Well done and enjoy.

    Do you know you can also do a degree, masters degree and PhD in autism (all funded) at Sheffield Hallam University. I’m not trying to persuade you away from your chosen course, just letting you know it’s there in case it is of any interest to you. They also offer a course in partnership with NAS.

  • Oh wow! i wasn't expecting such a detailed and long respond. Thanks for your time!

    I am so happy that your story about what you have personally been through is going to encourage me on my plan and I hope the people i am going to open to are as incredible as the one around yours.

    I did not know about Sheffield Hallam University but I have looked it up right after i read your message. It seems to be a part time course for 1 to 6 years and helps out people with ASD with study greatly. I will remember this and if i can ever manage free time i will attempt this but at the moment, i am still very young and would like to strife for more even in my condition, i would like to learn a lot more so i will try to study a full time course for my plan right now. Hopefully my course can lead me to become a clinical psychologist to help out people that are suffering my conditions and also other mental health problems, as for now that's very optimistic but it shall be my end goal.

  • There are different ways of studying their autism courses and there are different courses. All of them are open to people on the spectrum but are aimed as well at professionals and acedemics as well as individuals wanting to influence policy and procedure etc around autism. 

    Your goals are most certainly not optimistic and you may not believe me right now, but they’re actually guaranteed, ‘if’ you continue ‘until’ ~ that is, until you get there! No matter how long that takes or how you get there. And yes, you can begin to observe now, people treat us how we treat them and how we treat ourselves. If you treat yourself well and have an open, honest, friendly and genuinely caring approach to life and people, life and people will respond back to you in the same way. 

    I would wish you look but you don’t need it. Your future is secured. You need only enjoy it. 

  • When I work in mental health teams I don’t work as a social worker, I’m classed as a mental health practitioner. Basically, I do what the mental health nurses do apart from giving injections, but we usually have one person in the team that does that anyway. So we assess for mental health issues such as bipolar etc then work on a recovery plan with them. So my therapeutic approach is more like counselling therapy but I use Metaphysical principles so it’s more transformative than just counselling. But I will use more psychological approaches as well, depending on the client. But yeah, any of the things you mentioned could be classed as or be part of a therapeutic approach. And even in social work now with the new care act, it gives a lot of freedom to work in a more therapeutic/recovery model kind of way, which could include counselling type therapy or it could involve a more practical approach such as getting a bath or whatever. 

  • Hi BlueRay,

    Thank you for this.Relaxed

    What you have said is highly consistent with my own professional experience of working with Social Workers as part of a multi-disciplinary ‘Team around the Patient’ approach. Within which, Social Workers will assess each individuals practical needs (alongside an OT) and ensure effective external support is put in place to enable a successful transition/discharge takes place.

    The confusion is mine. I realise that when you use the words ‘therapeutic’ (and metaphysical) and the word ‘practical’ in the same sentence I tend to draw a complete blank as, to me, these seem to be contradictory things. I think perhaps this could be because I have a very different understanding and background surrounding the term ‘therapeutic.’ I appreciate it is possible however that, from a different perspective from my own, a warm bath can be ‘therapeutic,’ eating chocolate can be ‘therapeutic,’ receiving practical support can be ‘therapeutic’ etc.?  

  • Well everybody is different of course but yes, if a person for example has been sectioned under the mental health act in hospital, let’s say, for a few years, I would most certainly be looking at how they are going to manage basic daily living skills when they leave the hospital. For example, if they don’t know how to cook or prepare food then we might look at that and I might get somebody in to help them learn these skills (prior to discharge). The hospitals have facilities to support such activities and often have their own staff to help patients with these sorts of things but if the hospital doesn’t have anybody to do the training then I would bring someone in. 

    Everyone’s different. Before a person is discharged from the hospital, depending on how long they have been there for, we would always do a gradual discharge anyway. For example, they might start by just going for a walk on the hospital grounds, they might build up to going home for an hour or so, this might build up to a few hours and so on. When they first go home I would make sure that we have a support system set up that would make it as easy as possible for the person to make contact for help should they need it. 

    The mental health system (NHS) is now working towards a recovery model, meaning all hospital admissions now are to be seen as temporary (although of course the length is different for everyone) but it is always with a view that once the person is feeling better, we start to look at getting them home or some other living arrangement that is not the hospital. So if I have a client who has been sectioned, once they are able to, we will always be looking at moving back home or some other place. 

    I don’t actually teach anybody how to cook or clean themselves etc but I will arrange for people to do that for them if that’s necessary (either to teach them or do it for them if necessary). But I’m the one who finds out what they need. So I can see where the confusion lies ~ the penny’s just dropped lol ~ no, I’m not doing hands on practical things (although I sometimes do) but I build up a good relationship with them so we can work out, together, what they’re going to need in terms of support, when they get home. I think what I was saying in that paragraph above is that even though I always work from a metaphysical standpoint, my work is very practical in that I work with people at their level of awareness to meet their needs. But I don’t just assess and make arrangements, I work therapeuticaly as well and that’s why I said I sometimes do practical things. 

    Actually, I think I better stop here! lol! I’m not sure if I’m making it even more confusing. I guess when I said, my work is always practical, I meant it is always relevant and helpful for the client. Maybe I used the wrong word. I don’t have a huge vocabulary and don’t always use the right words at the right time, I carry a dictionary around with me but I get tired of looking up words and their meanings so I sometimes use words without being sure I’m using the right ones. So maybe I used the wrong word?!?!? Thinking

  • Hi BlueRay,

    I work very effectively with people with severe and enduring mental health problems. I work in secure forensic units, in mental health hospitals and in the community. I work with people at all different levels of awareness and my work is always practical, otherwise what would be the point?

    I didn't understand this bit (above.)  I got lost at the 'my work is always practical otherwise what would be the point,' mark. I could not understand what practical advice you offer to someone who is sectioned/living in a secure unit.

    Did you mean you work with individuals on how to eat, self care, keep a roof over their heads and clothe themselves in preparation for discharge?

    Please could you explain this 'practical advice for inpatients,' a bit more if you wouldn't mind, thank you. 

  • I do live on a different dimension or plane to most people California, that’s very true.

    However, my support is totally practical, when understood. I always meet people where they’re at whether that’s in a one to one situation or whether I’m giving a talk to a group of people. 

    However, on a public forum, where I come to get help,  I’m not particularly addressing any one particular person, I’m sharing my experiences etc so I can get more clarity around them. I come here for help, not to help others. If I help others as a side effect of being here, then great, but essentially I’m here for me. 

    My experiences with the Department of Working Pensions are 100% repeatable with 100% accuracy, 100% of the  time,  by ANYBODY who does the necessary inner work to get to that level of certainty, which doesn’t actually take that long if you have somebody working with you.

    For example, if I was working with you ~ I would probably start with what you said in your second to last and last sentence ~ people need food to eat, a roof over the head, clothes. People cannot live without the basics.  These sentences alone are very revealing and after a little exploration, just getting clarity around those sentences alone would have a huge (positive) impact on your life. 

    I work very effectively with people with severe and enduring mental health problems. I work in secure forensic units, in mental health hospitals and in the community. I work with people at all different levels of awareness and my work is always practical, otherwise what would be the point?  But don’t worry, I’m not going to be trying to help anybody else on here any more. I’ve learmed my lesson there (apart from the ones I’m already in contact with), lol! So have no fear, I will not be trying to help others on here any more. 

    Besides, you’ll probably be pleased to know, I won’t have as much time to come on here as now I’m coming out of my 16 month long burnout, I will be more busy with life helping people who do want my help which of course, is the only help that’s worth anything. If people don’t want help then the best help in the world will be useless to them and there are more than enough people who do want my help to keep me busy for the rest of my life Blush

  • (Quote removed by moderator] I think I fell for this. 

  • How many private messages do you get in an average day on here, from people thanking you for your kind support? 

    Although, your support is encouraging. It is not very practical.

    I feel that you live on another planet.

    Some of the experiences you describe are more like miracles.

    For example, your experience with the Department for Work and Pensions.

    They are not repeatable with good degree of reliability.

    The spiritual advice is helpful but in the end, people need food to eat, a roof over the head, clothes.

    People cannot live without the basics.

  • exactly, don't let the bad apple spoil it for the genuine people. I just didn't reply. To reply is to legitimise, better to ignore it ..... as my dear old ma used to say, if you haven't got anything nice to say, better to not say anything at all!

  • Oh keep looking! There's been more than one. After the first, still being a newbie, I felt the best thing to do for my own health was to "Run away and never come back" (as Scar said to Simba) but then I thought, Why the hell should I? I'm the one who DOES have AS here and (surely) sooner or later NAS will be forced to act. The others on here make it worth coming back anyway. One bad apple ... and all that.  

  • yeah,  I got pretty wound up by one post a little while ago...but "don't feed the trolls" eh? You can always report all of the posts as abusive. I saw on another thread you also had a run-in

  • I wish someone would do something about it as it got very old a LONG time ago! NAS doesn't seem to care that threads are being hijacked on a regular basis for the 'Look At Me' campaign. I guess that's the problem with a public forum, anything gets to jump in and screech.   

  • though three cheers for getting true colours rather than the usual waffling lecture :-) Joking aside, I can't quite believe that "you don’t know the difference between a threat and a guarantee" doesn't contravene forum rules!! Is someone going to do something about this now?

  • Honestly, don't be drawn in. It's what it wants. 

  • You might want to do some work around that false belief ~ that only ‘lucky’ people can be happy and you might also want to do some work around what you think makes a person lucky. 

    Yeah, most miserable hopeless people feel that way about happy successful people ~ it’s ok, we’re used to it, we don’t mind at all [Edited by Moderator - rule 4 - Be nice to one another and enjoy chatting with others. We encourage conversation and respectful debate; however, insulting posts or comments making personal jibes will not be tolerated.]

  • I'm glad you're happy, but plenty of people aren't so lucky.

    I find most of your assertions glib and rather foolish, you seem to have little understanding about how others might feel.

    [Edited by Moderator - rule 4 - Be nice to one another and enjoy chatting with others. We encourage conversation and respectful debate; however, insulting posts or comments making personal jibes will not be tolerated.]

  • I can see how it could look like that. One minute I’m in burnout and the next, I’m happy again. Not that I wasn’t  happy when I was in burnout, but I was more in hibernation mode. It may appear that I just suddenly came out of burnout and in one sense it does kind of appear that way but I have had over 12 months of serious rest and near total isolation from the world before that. But yeah, I woke up one morning last week I think it was and realised, im done, my burnout is over. So yeah, I can understand that’s how it appears to you. It most definitely appears that way to me as well sometimes. Lol! 

    Fortunately or unfortunately (who could know), however,  I’m not bipolar, but it sure does feel that way sometimes, especially when life is so good that everything you touch turns to gold. 

    I’m not sure what you mean about my grip on reality being tenuous though, you would have to expand on that for me to be certain of what you mean and I have no idea what that means, lol, about gushing optimism. I am rarely optimistic, actually, I’m not sure that I ever am (I would have to get a better understanding of that word before I could be certain though) but I can predict, with absolute certainly, that I will always get what I want in life, no matter what it is and I am high on life, who wouldn’t be? I always have and I always will get whatever I want in life. In fact everybody does, it’s just not possible for us to not.  

    However, in probably 97% of the people on this earth, what they think they want and what they actually want, are two very different things so they walk around thinking they never get what they want, when in reality, they get exactly what they want. But only 100% of the time! 

    Is your last sentence your way of thanking me for helping you get sleepy, I’m not sure?!?! I’m not sure I know of any other reason why you would tell me that, so I’ll take it as a thank you and bid you a good nights sleep. Although I do know that I wear miserable (anybody who is less than happy) people out. I’m not saying your miserable just that if I wear you out I can understand that. I don’t wear happy people out, if anything, my energy energises them even more and visa versa but people who just seem to go through life, day by day, not full of excitement and happiness, joy and gratitude, do get worn out my energy, even if I don’t say anything, lol, so yeah, I can understand that. 

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  • I can see how it could look like that. One minute I’m in burnout and the next, I’m happy again. Not that I wasn’t  happy when I was in burnout, but I was more in hibernation mode. It may appear that I just suddenly came out of burnout and in one sense it does kind of appear that way but I have had over 12 months of serious rest and near total isolation from the world before that. But yeah, I woke up one morning last week I think it was and realised, im done, my burnout is over. So yeah, I can understand that’s how it appears to you. It most definitely appears that way to me as well sometimes. Lol! 

    Fortunately or unfortunately (who could know), however,  I’m not bipolar, but it sure does feel that way sometimes, especially when life is so good that everything you touch turns to gold. 

    I’m not sure what you mean about my grip on reality being tenuous though, you would have to expand on that for me to be certain of what you mean and I have no idea what that means, lol, about gushing optimism. I am rarely optimistic, actually, I’m not sure that I ever am (I would have to get a better understanding of that word before I could be certain though) but I can predict, with absolute certainly, that I will always get what I want in life, no matter what it is and I am high on life, who wouldn’t be? I always have and I always will get whatever I want in life. In fact everybody does, it’s just not possible for us to not.  

    However, in probably 97% of the people on this earth, what they think they want and what they actually want, are two very different things so they walk around thinking they never get what they want, when in reality, they get exactly what they want. But only 100% of the time! 

    Is your last sentence your way of thanking me for helping you get sleepy, I’m not sure?!?! I’m not sure I know of any other reason why you would tell me that, so I’ll take it as a thank you and bid you a good nights sleep. Although I do know that I wear miserable (anybody who is less than happy) people out. I’m not saying your miserable just that if I wear you out I can understand that. I don’t wear happy people out, if anything, my energy energises them even more and visa versa but people who just seem to go through life, day by day, not full of excitement and happiness, joy and gratitude, do get worn out my energy, even if I don’t say anything, lol, so yeah, I can understand that. 

Children
  • Good luck with your meeting- if you can freeze your student loans till next year and then simply transfer them across to a new Uni/course that sounds like a brilliant option. 

    Just a thought; get whatever you can, such as the advice about Student Loans etc in writing, if you can. For example, after having a meeting, or seeking advice, just ask everyone to sum up what they have told you and pop it in an email to you, (say you need this adjustment) so that you have some written evidence of these things/offers/ conversations which may prove useful in future. 

    Best of luck.

  • Ah yes, exactly what i'm thinking about studying psychology, requirements says I only need one of the 4 subjects to be A* which are Maths, Bio, Phy, or Psychology and I have Maths so it was fine without Psychology but as you said helps with start up so why not, I am going to at least get an A here or even A* since im going for it! Trying to hit some high end Uni so requirement to my preferred Uni are a bit higher naturally.

    As for student loan, called my student loan company have it all sorted, frozen the money to be paid to University now since i'm leaving. Going to a meeting in 40 min to get that actually approved, already talked and told my programme leader about it too. 

    Just told my parent about leaving too because I felt guilty doing it without them knowing at all, was very brief so I asked them to wait till they are home with me (my parent is currently out of country) to talk face to face and get them to understand. Oh, my mum and dad was so accepting about all this! I am so shocked >o<. I'm so happy about it, I'm so glad that I was able to sums up the courage to call her because I originally just going to tell them only after they gotten back. (It was so hard to press that call button thoough xD)

  • It sounds to me as if you are really doing your best to plan and embark on a new path. 

    What I do know, with some confidence, is that some Uni's accept less (AAB ) for their psychology degrees and that the A Levels themselves need not be in psychology. 

    However, whatever else you choose to do, if you are serious about studying this subject at degree level,  studying A Level Psychology in your gap year first sounds like a fantastic idea to me, not only to enable you the other A Level you need for your preferred Uni, but more so to give you a good grounding and 'taster' into the subject too.

    I did not realise you were currently studying at Uni, I don't personally know how this works with Student Loans etc if you have already started a degree. Perhaps someone else on here may know and offer their further advice about this?  

  • I'm still in the process of sorting out my current Uni situation such as cancelling student loan, withdrawing programme, and telling my friends and family. I have actually done most of that and calling my mum in about 20 minutes because shes busy right now.

    I made a plan (wrote it down even) to go back to my high school to ask for advice about Psychology study and I know a professor that I could get advice from too. In other words, I have yet to understand the way I would need to approach University to study Psychology completely yet. I have looked up 3 or 4 different Universities, it seems that if I would to head toward a good University such as UCL (my aim) I would need A*AA grade, I currently have A*AB so I am thinking of studying Psychology A level to get that last A. As for GCSE it requires B in Maths or Science and B in English. I have C in English for GCSE so i am probably going for that too. The other Universities are about the same requirements so best if I just go for it.

    Also planned a therapy or a way to face my fear of people and organised my life. I made a draft of my daily schedule includes reading, fixed sleeping timing, exercising and study/research time. I have wrote and confirm a plan of going travel, on my own, to reach further out of the world (I always hated travelling because of the crowd and how exhausting it is for me) but when I thought about what I can be doing during the travel makes me laugh or smile so I knew I wanted to do it. Planned to seek advice on how to travel and save money from relatives and travel agent.

  • I’m afraid you don’t have that kind of control Wei, none of us, to dictate what is written on a public forum. However, there has been no arguments on here and if something doesn’t relate to you/help you, just leave it. 

    But yeah, keep it simple, that’s what I like to do and if the comments don’t relate to you or they’re more confusing than helpful, just leave them be. Take what works and leave the rest. 

    Ooops, just noticed. Yes. There was some arguing going on, nothing to do with you though Wei, and it’s being dealt with by management. 

  • Oh Wei.

    I so want to reply to BlueRay, oh, so so much, ...

    But, in respect to you, I will do as you ask and 'end the non related debate.' 

    You are very right in that things being said on here can be fake and misleading.., so, best to try to take the best bits from all of us and use whatever bits you can to help you make your decision. 

    Have you got any further with your decision, such as finding out anything you may need to know such as what to do or study during your gap year, how to enable the best support at Uni, and what the Uni's require in terms of other qualifications in order for your application to be successful? 

    I am thinking that, finding out what the Uni's need (qualification wise,) may give you some direction to head towards over the coming year to make your eventual application successful? If you decide this is the right path for you, naturally. 

  • Appreciated :)

    As much as it is good to understand different subjects and topic here, but everything is so biased here and due to anonymity as for the purpose of this forum. Things being said and told can be real, fake, misinterpreted, or self belief so I have to be careful. Therefore, I don't really see much of a reason try to argue with another when I am asking for specific advice for my post, although some are still related but as direct as possible would make things in a thread like this much easier in my opinion.

    I do appreciate the fact that you guys cared <3 and seeing the view count goes up knowing how many people I was able to reach and those replies seeing how significant this post can be, may not be much but enough to sooth my heart, so thanks and lets end the non directly related debates to my opening post's here.

  • Sounds all totally great and logical (although not sure it would really work for me), but it's not helping Wei to decide what and how to study, is it?

    Good point. Sorry Wei. 

  • Sounds all totally great and logical (although not sure it would really work for me), but it's not helping Wei to decide what and how to study, is it?

  • I’ve trained in traditional talking therapies/counselling, based more or less on Carl Rogers. I’ve done some psychology at college and uni and in my work I’ve done continued professional development courses on different therapeutic approaches, I can’t even think of them off hand ~ how to work with ADHD etc etc. I have continued to keep up with my studies (almost but not for several months, while I’ve been in burnout) but metaphysics takes things to another level. 

    For example, a metaphysician might never see his client, know his name or no anything about his troubles, and the healing will still take place just as effectively. 

    I guess the difference can best be described like this. If you go to a gp in this country, for heartburn. He will give you some antacids to get rid of it. Or if you have pain, they will give you some painkillers, etc. 

    If you go to a metaphysician, we will find out the cause of the heartburn or the pain and dissolve the cause and the heartburn or pain will naturally dissolve.

    We don’t deal with the outer cause. For example, a person may be having difficulties in their marriage, they’re having difficulties at work and they’re feeling tired and depressed. A counsellor will talk with them about their relationship or work situation etc and try to help the person come to some compromise or something. 

    We don’t look at any of those things. They are of secondary importance. They are only the effects of the cause. So we deal with the cause. We take out the cause and all the outer problems disappear and we might never even have discussed them. It depends on the metaphysician and how they work as to whether any of the effects are ever discussed or mentioned or not.

    They love me in the NHS mental health teams, not because they love me, they think I’m weird and like nobody they’ve ever met before, but I get their caseloads down because I am able to get to the root cause of people’s problems which means they no longer need to be in the mental health services. This sometimes happens at the initial assessment stage. Some I have got to the cause there and then and with others, we have made enough progress that their needs can better be met through alternative approaches and I haven’t worked in a town yet that doesn’t have at least one place that offers excellent community support so I will signpost them or take them there.

    I work within the care program approach so all my interventions are documented etc, I just have to word them in more laymen’s terms as they wouldn’t be understood from a metaphysical perspective anyway.

    I’ve worked with some incredible psychiatrists and psychologists and we learn a great deal from each other but even they are brining in mindfulness techniques and other alternative approaches as well now. They love what I do and through a greater understanding of what they do, in light of the bigger picture, I love and respect what they do. It took a while for me to come to that understanding but they’re out there, day in day out, doing what they do, I couldn’t do what I do to the same extent as that. So we all have our place and my long term goal is to somehow be back in a position where I can work with those people again (the nhs clients) because I have seen that my work is very effective with them, it just wouldn’t pay the bills for me to work with them just now. 

    I can’t even remember what my former counselling qualifications are, I never look at them. I am professionally qualified and recognised by the two leading bodies in this country as a metaphysician/metaphysical practiontioner, which like any other professional body, membership has to be maintained by continued professional development. I keep this up both as a metaphysician and a social worker, which also covers me to work in the field of mental health, with people with severe and enduring mental health difficulties and in forensic services.

    Not all therapeutic and counselling interventions get to the root cause of the problem and they’re not all based on Metaphysical principles but even when I work at a more psychological level, my work is still underpinned by metaphsical principles. So there’s definitely a difference in both the approach and outcomes and the length of time it takes to get rid of the root cause of the problem. 

  • Hi BlueRay,

    Any positive and compassionate support for those in need can often be a good thing in my opinion. And I do appreciate now (thank you and thanks to your earlier explanation,) that when you speak of 'therapeutic support,' you are using this term loosely, in the layman's sense, of something being 'therapeutic' as it is a positive.  

    However, nothing I have so far read has enabled me (personally) to believe that you possess any significant professional understanding of what counselling or 'psychological' approaches are (or mean.)

    So my therapeutic approach is more like counselling therapy but I use Metaphysical principles so it’s more transformative than just counselling. But I will use more psychological approaches as well, depending on the client.

    For example, all ‘therapy’ approaches (in the classic ‘counselling’ sense) work on the metaphysical and 'psychological' level. And therefore your statement above came across (to me, currently,) as twaddle.

    Not that for one moment you have to justify yourself to me, because you sincerely don't.

  • When I work in mental health teams I don’t work as a social worker, I’m classed as a mental health practitioner. Basically, I do what the mental health nurses do apart from giving injections, but we usually have one person in the team that does that anyway. So we assess for mental health issues such as bipolar etc then work on a recovery plan with them. So my therapeutic approach is more like counselling therapy but I use Metaphysical principles so it’s more transformative than just counselling. But I will use more psychological approaches as well, depending on the client. But yeah, any of the things you mentioned could be classed as or be part of a therapeutic approach. And even in social work now with the new care act, it gives a lot of freedom to work in a more therapeutic/recovery model kind of way, which could include counselling type therapy or it could involve a more practical approach such as getting a bath or whatever. 

  • Hi BlueRay,

    Thank you for this.Relaxed

    What you have said is highly consistent with my own professional experience of working with Social Workers as part of a multi-disciplinary ‘Team around the Patient’ approach. Within which, Social Workers will assess each individuals practical needs (alongside an OT) and ensure effective external support is put in place to enable a successful transition/discharge takes place.

    The confusion is mine. I realise that when you use the words ‘therapeutic’ (and metaphysical) and the word ‘practical’ in the same sentence I tend to draw a complete blank as, to me, these seem to be contradictory things. I think perhaps this could be because I have a very different understanding and background surrounding the term ‘therapeutic.’ I appreciate it is possible however that, from a different perspective from my own, a warm bath can be ‘therapeutic,’ eating chocolate can be ‘therapeutic,’ receiving practical support can be ‘therapeutic’ etc.?  

  • Well everybody is different of course but yes, if a person for example has been sectioned under the mental health act in hospital, let’s say, for a few years, I would most certainly be looking at how they are going to manage basic daily living skills when they leave the hospital. For example, if they don’t know how to cook or prepare food then we might look at that and I might get somebody in to help them learn these skills (prior to discharge). The hospitals have facilities to support such activities and often have their own staff to help patients with these sorts of things but if the hospital doesn’t have anybody to do the training then I would bring someone in. 

    Everyone’s different. Before a person is discharged from the hospital, depending on how long they have been there for, we would always do a gradual discharge anyway. For example, they might start by just going for a walk on the hospital grounds, they might build up to going home for an hour or so, this might build up to a few hours and so on. When they first go home I would make sure that we have a support system set up that would make it as easy as possible for the person to make contact for help should they need it. 

    The mental health system (NHS) is now working towards a recovery model, meaning all hospital admissions now are to be seen as temporary (although of course the length is different for everyone) but it is always with a view that once the person is feeling better, we start to look at getting them home or some other living arrangement that is not the hospital. So if I have a client who has been sectioned, once they are able to, we will always be looking at moving back home or some other place. 

    I don’t actually teach anybody how to cook or clean themselves etc but I will arrange for people to do that for them if that’s necessary (either to teach them or do it for them if necessary). But I’m the one who finds out what they need. So I can see where the confusion lies ~ the penny’s just dropped lol ~ no, I’m not doing hands on practical things (although I sometimes do) but I build up a good relationship with them so we can work out, together, what they’re going to need in terms of support, when they get home. I think what I was saying in that paragraph above is that even though I always work from a metaphysical standpoint, my work is very practical in that I work with people at their level of awareness to meet their needs. But I don’t just assess and make arrangements, I work therapeuticaly as well and that’s why I said I sometimes do practical things. 

    Actually, I think I better stop here! lol! I’m not sure if I’m making it even more confusing. I guess when I said, my work is always practical, I meant it is always relevant and helpful for the client. Maybe I used the wrong word. I don’t have a huge vocabulary and don’t always use the right words at the right time, I carry a dictionary around with me but I get tired of looking up words and their meanings so I sometimes use words without being sure I’m using the right ones. So maybe I used the wrong word?!?!? Thinking

  • Hi BlueRay,

    I work very effectively with people with severe and enduring mental health problems. I work in secure forensic units, in mental health hospitals and in the community. I work with people at all different levels of awareness and my work is always practical, otherwise what would be the point?

    I didn't understand this bit (above.)  I got lost at the 'my work is always practical otherwise what would be the point,' mark. I could not understand what practical advice you offer to someone who is sectioned/living in a secure unit.

    Did you mean you work with individuals on how to eat, self care, keep a roof over their heads and clothe themselves in preparation for discharge?

    Please could you explain this 'practical advice for inpatients,' a bit more if you wouldn't mind, thank you. 

  • I do live on a different dimension or plane to most people California, that’s very true.

    However, my support is totally practical, when understood. I always meet people where they’re at whether that’s in a one to one situation or whether I’m giving a talk to a group of people. 

    However, on a public forum, where I come to get help,  I’m not particularly addressing any one particular person, I’m sharing my experiences etc so I can get more clarity around them. I come here for help, not to help others. If I help others as a side effect of being here, then great, but essentially I’m here for me. 

    My experiences with the Department of Working Pensions are 100% repeatable with 100% accuracy, 100% of the  time,  by ANYBODY who does the necessary inner work to get to that level of certainty, which doesn’t actually take that long if you have somebody working with you.

    For example, if I was working with you ~ I would probably start with what you said in your second to last and last sentence ~ people need food to eat, a roof over the head, clothes. People cannot live without the basics.  These sentences alone are very revealing and after a little exploration, just getting clarity around those sentences alone would have a huge (positive) impact on your life. 

    I work very effectively with people with severe and enduring mental health problems. I work in secure forensic units, in mental health hospitals and in the community. I work with people at all different levels of awareness and my work is always practical, otherwise what would be the point?  But don’t worry, I’m not going to be trying to help anybody else on here any more. I’ve learmed my lesson there (apart from the ones I’m already in contact with), lol! So have no fear, I will not be trying to help others on here any more. 

    Besides, you’ll probably be pleased to know, I won’t have as much time to come on here as now I’m coming out of my 16 month long burnout, I will be more busy with life helping people who do want my help which of course, is the only help that’s worth anything. If people don’t want help then the best help in the world will be useless to them and there are more than enough people who do want my help to keep me busy for the rest of my life Blush

  • (Quote removed by moderator] I think I fell for this. 

  • How many private messages do you get in an average day on here, from people thanking you for your kind support? 

    Although, your support is encouraging. It is not very practical.

    I feel that you live on another planet.

    Some of the experiences you describe are more like miracles.

    For example, your experience with the Department for Work and Pensions.

    They are not repeatable with good degree of reliability.

    The spiritual advice is helpful but in the end, people need food to eat, a roof over the head, clothes.

    People cannot live without the basics.

  • exactly, don't let the bad apple spoil it for the genuine people. I just didn't reply. To reply is to legitimise, better to ignore it ..... as my dear old ma used to say, if you haven't got anything nice to say, better to not say anything at all!

  • Oh keep looking! There's been more than one. After the first, still being a newbie, I felt the best thing to do for my own health was to "Run away and never come back" (as Scar said to Simba) but then I thought, Why the hell should I? I'm the one who DOES have AS here and (surely) sooner or later NAS will be forced to act. The others on here make it worth coming back anyway. One bad apple ... and all that.